Nested tables

Hi Robert...

I don't think that it's possible without some serious FDK or ExtendScript work.

As far as I know the only way to "nest" tables in FM is to use an anchored frame within a table cell. The content within an anchored frame is technically in a separate flow. The standard XML export only processes a single flow. You'd somehow have to merge multiple flows on export, and create multiple flows on import. This sounds like a really bad idea .. if this is really a requirement, I think you're going to have to use a different editor.

However, if the nested table's structure is simple, you could instead use a list structure while in FM, and set up an XSLT import/export that converts that list into a table and back.

Personally, I'd revisit that requirement .. I think you're probably going to run into trouble in many places.

Cheers,

…scott

I'll ask on the FM dev list that I'm on, but I'm not aware of any nested table options. As a FM developer myself, I can "imagine" ways to do that, but it would cost a bit of change to get such a plugin developed. This would not be just some simple "tweaks".

Your statement that "DITA supports nested tables" is technically correct, but I think if you ask around you'll find that this is generally considered a bad practice. The "support" is really more of a workaround than true support. You can insert a table within a <p> that's in a table cell, but I think that this isn't the real intent. I would try to use an alternate structure that emulates a table-like structure rather than using a real table.

…scott

Hi Robert...

I'm not hearing that anyone on the developer's list has any ideas about supporting nested tables. There were suggestions for "simulating" this through the use of straddles, but that can get rather complex. You can also "fake" it with spaces or tabs. You could also use a special list structure within each cell that is formatted in a columnar fashion.

If you really want to be able to have nested tables, you'll likely need a custom FDK plugin. If you're looking for someone to do that work, I'd be willing to talk to you more about this off-list to nail down your requirements and provide a quote for the work. You can contact me at <info at leximation dot com>.

Cheers,

Scott Prentice

Leximation, Inc.

www.leximation.com

Hello Robert,

how about solving the issue mimicking those tables?

If you work with col- and rowspans, you might be able to create a second "table" within your first.

This is actually quite ugly as a solution, but it should work at least.

The nifty part on it would be the XSLT transforming any nested tables into proper spans.

If you use 3 rows and 3 columns as a "standard grid", you could also mimic the spacing around the nested table.

The central cell of this grid would then serve as the container cell for the "nested table".

Not exactly best practice - but should solve at least your legacy problem (the other solution would be to simply ignore the fact it doesn't work and find a solution that looks a bit like the legacy document).

-Alex

Hi Robert,

ok, I see where that one's coming from now.

One or two more questions though:

Are we talking about fixed pages here (as in product information sheets or booklets)?

Or are we talking about flowing text within longer documents, containing those tables?

Are those tables layout constructs or do they contain data that is tied together?

If one of those questions answers with yes, I might have some more ideas to work around it

-Alex

Hi Robert,

this does actually help me a lot, as the situation is like I already suspected, when you mentioned HTML.

The solution might actually be to do the layout limbo.

Simply create several different "table" template pages that mimic those tables you are encountering.

Then set up a grid of text frames using the same flow and add some lines around them.

Those will be of fixed size, but that shouldn't bother your authors much.

Within those "table cells" you're free to add new tables if needed.

Structure wise, you're simply having a plain XML in the background that can be translated to HTML using standard procedures.

If you then add an attribute to the first element of the "table page" you could even control the template pages used automatically.

This is all about "Tarnen und Täuschen" (sorry for using a German saying here - Robert understands this).

Hope you get my idea behind it

-Alex