21 Replies Latest reply on Oct 15, 2014 1:14 PM by ssprengel

    Lightroom Profiles for Lumix GX7?

    SC489

      I'm trying out various programs for RAW processing using my new Lumix GX7. I quite like DXO Optics Pro 9 due to the camera and lens profiles for my equipment. However, it has limited functionality compared to Lightroom 5.6 which I'm also trying.

       

      I note the resources folder for Lightroom contains the file Panasonic DMC-GX7 Adobe Standard.dcp which appears to support the GX7. However, the Adobe folder does not contain any lens profiles for my Panasonic or Olympus lenses.

       

      Does Lightroom correct aberrations in these lenses in a similar fashion to DXO Optics Pro without me having to do anything? If I need a Lightroom lens profiles for Panasonic & Olympus lenses, where do I find these since they do not appear to be installed by Lightroom 5.6?

        • 1. Re: Lightroom Profiles for Lumix GX7?
          ssprengel Adobe Community Professional & MVP

          The lens profiles are built in for mirrorless cameras, nowadays, and cannot be turned off so aren’t in any list.  The Camera Raw 8.4 and newer plugin for Photoshop will indicate that a built-in profile is being used, but so far not LR.  Maybe in 6.

          • 2. Re: Lightroom Profiles for Lumix GX7?
            SC489 Level 1

            Thanks. Does that mean that Lightroom will automatically correct for lens aberrations like DXO Optics Pro without me having to install any additional profiles for my Panasonic and Olympus micro 4/3 lenses?

            • 3. Re: Lightroom Profiles for Lumix GX7?
              ssprengel Adobe Community Professional & MVP

              Here is what ACR says for a sample GX7 image I got off of the PhotographyBlog GX7 review"

               

              Here is what the actual raw data distortion is like in a raw converter (RawTherapee) that doesn't do lens corrections:

              • 4. Re: Lightroom Profiles for Lumix GX7?
                SC489 Level 1

                Thanks. It seems Lightroom 5.6 is applying the lens corrections. Is there a way of confirming this from the Lightroom menus?

                • 5. Re: Lightroom Profiles for Lumix GX7?
                  ssprengel Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                  The ACR UI changed mid-version seeing as it’s a cloud-based application that promises continuous updates; whereas, LR isn’t a cloud app so we shouldn’t expect the UI to change until LR6 so LR 5 cannot tell you it’s using a lens profile otherwise I would have shown a screenshot of that.

                   

                  The easy way to confirm is to open the raw file in another raw converter and see that it looks distorted.  The RawTherapee program is free from http://www.rawtherapee.com/

                  • 6. Re: Lightroom Profiles for Lumix GX7?
                    SC489 Level 1

                    Thanks for the RAWTherapee link. I opened a few images taken with my Oly wide zoom at 9mm. I don't see any pincushion or barrel distortion like your photo in either RAWTherapee or Lightroom. I only see the perspective 'distortion'.

                    • 7. Re: Lightroom Profiles for Lumix GX7?
                      ISeward Level 1

                      There is no confirmation in LR the corrections are auto applied.

                       

                      If you compare the conversions of  DXO with LR you will find that the DXO correction is more accurate and in fact the apparent angle of view is greater with DXO.  DXO profile each lens themselves whilst Adobe I believe use the "canned" profiles provided by Panasonic, which appear to include a "crop" of the image.

                      • 8. Re: Lightroom Profiles for Lumix GX7?
                        ssprengel Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                        It is my understanding that a built-in profile is an attempt to do the identical distortion correction to what the camera manufacturer does, by using the camera-manufacturer’s data.  This is less work for Adobe and the images look similar to how the camera does them.

                         

                        DxO does their own thing which is no doubt more accurate. 

                         

                        The camera manufacturer’s transformation, that Adobe is replicating, has to happen in real time as the image is displayed on the LCD screen in the back of the camera for use in composing the shot so it can’t be too complicated.

                        • 9. Re: Lightroom Profiles for Lumix GX7?
                          ssprengel Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                          The sample photo I used is the first raw photo from here, down near the bottom:

                          http://www.photographyblog.com/reviews/panasonic_lumix_dmc_gx7_review/sample_images/

                           

                          Presumably you're also working with raw images not camera JPGs that would already have any distortion correction applied.

                          • 10. Re: Lightroom Profiles for Lumix GX7?
                            SC489 Level 1

                            Thanks, I can now see that the Lightroom RAW image is very similar to the DXO Optics Pro RAW image with distortion correction enabled in DXO Optics Pro. I can see a slightly wider FOV and more distorted image when the DXO Optics Pro distortion correction is turned off compared to Lightroom. Lightroom is obviously correcting the image distortion, although this is not obvious from the user interface. These results are using my Oly 9-18mm Micro 4/3 zoom at 9mm where the distortion is most evident.

                             

                            I have another curious query regarding "dead pixels" and DXO Optics Pro some of you may interested in commenting on at Lumix GX7 - Black / Dead Pixels: Micro Four Thirds Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review

                             

                            DXO Optics Pro marks various RAW pixels with a magenta cross with noise processing disabled and ACDSee Pro shows them as a black dot. I'm still unsure whether these are "dead pixels" or just pixels marked for particular analysis. Lightroom, SilkyPix and RawThreapee mentioned above have no "dead pixels" on initial RAW image import. Very curious.

                             

                            My personal preference for image rendering is DXO Optics Pro (despite the "dead pixel" issue) but I quite like Lightroom's cataloguing functionality.

                            • 11. Re: Lightroom Profiles for Lumix GX7?
                              ssprengel Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                              Adobe raw conversion corrects for dead/stuck pixels up to a point, at least.  My camera has one bright red pixel that is almost in the center of the sensor so I can see it clearly when I have my camera in Live View using the 5x or 10x views, but when I open an image in ACR or LR, that pixel is not red.  Adobe’s demosaicking is detecting and interpolating around that bad pixel.

                               

                              There is a limit to this detection, though.  If you set a very high ISO, there are many stuck pixels that are visible and many of them aren’t corrected for.  I think it is a case of whatever threshold Adobe is using for how much difference a pixel is from it’s neighbors of the same color before it is deemed defective.

                              • 12. Re: Lightroom Profiles for Lumix GX7?
                                ISeward Level 1

                                Yes, I think you have stated the exact situation regarding how Adobe handle Panasonic / Olympus optical corrections and as far as I know every other raw converter does the same except for DXO.  This gives DXO a big advantage with 4/3 lenses as these lenses are designed with computer correction to be implemented and not being constrained by the lack of computing power within a camera. 

                                With LR you get the best of both worlds as you can use LR for DAM purposes and then send the best shots for raw conversion through DXO where you get the optimum optical corrections and can perform global raw adjustments.  Then the TIFF file can be automatically re-imported into LR for local adjustments and fine tuning.

                                • 13. Re: Lightroom Profiles for Lumix GX7?
                                  ssprengel Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                  Doesn't DxO allow exporting as DNG (a linearized DNG) that can be manipulated in ACR and LR similarly to a raw file, including absolute white-balance adjustments, but with the DxO distortion and sharpness enhancements, without having to use DxO for global raw adjustments, or is that no longer possible.  It has been some years since I've toyed with a DxO trial version.

                                  • 14. Re: Lightroom Profiles for Lumix GX7?
                                    DdeGannes Level 5

                                    Quote "with 4/3 lenses as these lenses are designed with computer correction to be implemented and not being constrained by the lack of computing power within a camera."

                                     

                                    This is true for Micro 4/3 lenses but the original Olympus and Panasonic 4/3 lenses do not need to have automatic lens corrections applied.

                                    • 15. Re: Lightroom Profiles for Lumix GX7?
                                      ssprengel Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                      Because they were perfect optical systems or for some other reason?

                                      • 16. Re: Lightroom Profiles for Lumix GX7?
                                        DdeGannes Level 5

                                        Not necessarily perfect but acceptable for the purpose for which they were designed.

                                        The Micro Lenses by design require correction by software processing to achieve acceptable performance.

                                        • 17. Re: Lightroom Profiles for Lumix GX7?
                                          ISeward Level 1

                                          Yes you can use DNG but I just use a 16bit TIFF, you have all the possible information (DNG is basically a TIFF), and as well as calibrating for optical correction DXO calibrate the bodies for colour so if I am round tripping I take advantage of that as well.  You also get the opportunity to use DXO's prime noise reduction which is outstanding, as it should be as it can take around 90 - 130 sec to process on an i7 @ 4.5Ghz.  For micro 4/3 DXO provides superior optical correction (integral for micro 4/3 lenses), calibrated colour and superior noise reduction, reducing one of the drawbacks of the smaller sensor compared to full frame.  Couple this with LR's DAM facilities and local adjustment they work well together particularly for micro 4/3.

                                          • 18. Re: Lightroom Profiles for Lumix GX7?
                                            ISeward Level 1

                                            Yes, sorry I meant to type micro 4/3.  I have a tendency to forget as I was never interested on 4/3 and that is from someone who used to use the best designed camera in the world an OM4Ti :-)

                                            • 19. Re: Lightroom Profiles for Lumix GX7?
                                              SC489 Level 1

                                              Thanks for your very useful advice on exchanging images between Lightroom and DXO Optics Pro. I noticed a major difference in the resulting file sizes (based on one test image):

                                               

                                              RW2     19.34MB

                                              DNG     61.68MB   (x3.19)

                                              TIFF     93.70  MB (x4.84)



                                              • 20. Re: Lightroom Profiles for Lumix GX7?
                                                ISeward Level 1

                                                Yes, DXO does not offer any compressed TIFF options and I am happy to take the improved optical correction,colour and noise reduction improvements along with the higher file size.  For me it is not an issue as I regard the DXO TIFF as an intermediate edit step.  After I have carried out local adjustments in LR I will save the final image as a jpg.  I have not found any difference in printing (I always use Qimage) from a jpg compared to TIFF for real world images, neither do I have a 16bit RIP or printer :-) 

                                                • 21. Re: Lightroom Profiles for Lumix GX7?
                                                  ssprengel Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                  A DNG allows adjusting WB in absolute terms if it is created from a raw file.  An RGB TIF does not allow adjusting WB in absolute terms, only relative.

                                                   

                                                  If you are using DxO after you have already imported into LR then it doesn't matter, but if you are using DxO before importing into LR then it would matter and a DNG from a raw file would be more useful.