15 Replies Latest reply on Apr 27, 2007 5:02 PM by Ann_Shelbourne

    Anyone else's colors not even close?

    cPants
      Just curious if anyone else has experienced the immense innacuracy of Kuler's representation of color on screen. Check out this screenshot of what the exact same color looks like in relation to InDesign CS2, Illustrator CS2, and Photoshop CS2. Photoshop is even in RGB mode and does it well. Is this just me, or has anyone else noticed this? Happens with every color in every browser I have. I'm a on PowerMac, don't know if that changes anything or not.

      Crazy color screenshot
        • 1. Re: Anyone else's colors not even close?
          jksdjkadfjksdfhsdfjh
          oh man, i thought it was my set up. i'm on a powerbook g4 (X.4, safari), and i was going to ask what my color settings should be i in illustrator cs2, because what i was seeing in kuler was waaay different.

          i'd like help here too in this regard.

          also, it was a bear to be able to post. i _was_ in safari, and when i tried to reply to this (or a new post), it said i had to craete a nickname, even tho i was logged in. no matter what i chose, it said that name was taken, even a string of random characters. i went to firefox and was able to post, but now i'm afraid i have some crazy nickname.

          isn't the adobe help forum in sync w/ being logged into the kuler site? why do i need a nickname?
          • 2. Re: Anyone else's colors not even close?
            Ann_Shelbourne
            Most browsers are NOT Color Managed so you are viewing the web-content in your Monitor Color Space. That is why the colors that you see in a Browser do not look the same as the Swatches do in Photoshop or inDesign — which ARE Color Managed.

            If you use Safari, and your monitor is correctly profiled to 2.2 Gamma, Kuler's Color Swatches should look similar in the Browser to the way that they do in an Adobe sRGB color space.

            (Well, they do on my monitor anyway.)
            -------------
            Regarding login names:
            Some outfit called "del.icio.us" seem to have got into the act here — but even if you register with them, it is impossible to actually get into the Kuler site.
            (I tried that route using Firefox and Netscape in order to see how well the colors displayed in those Browsers) but could not get into the Kuler site at all that way.)

            Using Safari and my normal Adobe ID, I can access the Kuler site and download canned swatches to my Desktop; but i cannot save new themes to "My Kuler" at all.
            • 3. Re: Anyone else's colors not even close?
              Sami@Adobe Adobe Employee
              Ann, thanks for the response to the color management question.

              Just to clarify, kuler is *not* associated with del.icio.us. Where are you seeing that information? (Perhaps you are thinking of a new Illustrator feature called knowhow?) Thanks!

              Sami
              • 4. Re: Anyone else's colors not even close?
                Ann_Shelbourne Level 1
                If I try to access Kuler directly using Firefox, i just get a black page but can see the del.icio.us logo on the Kuler web page (which implies that you need to use them to access the page!).

                This may be something to do with a new tie-up with Adobe?
                See this page:
                http://www.adobe.com/designcenter/tutorials/

                I find that I need to use the Mac Widget and Safari to get full access to the Kuler Site.
                • 5. Anyone else's colors not even close?
                  Ann_Shelbourne Level 1
                  FrozenFusion seems to be duplicating Posts AGAIN!

                  :(
                  • 6. Anyone else's colors not even close?
                    Ann_Shelbourne Level 1
                    FrozenFusion seems to be duplicating, and triplicating, Posts — AGAIN!

                    :(
                    • 7. Re: Anyone else's colors not even close?
                      cPants Level 1
                      I use GretagMacbeth's Eye-One for monitor calibration...so you'd think I should be okay as far as that goes. It probably looks just fine to PC users, but on my perfectly calibrated cinema display the colors aren't even close. Any other solutions?
                      • 8. Re: Anyone else's colors not even close?
                        Ann_Shelbourne Level 1
                        Are you using Gamma 2.2 when calibrating your Monitor?

                        • 9. Re: Anyone else's colors not even close?
                          lametastic
                          quote:

                          Originally posted by: cPants
                          I use GretagMacbeth's Eye-One for monitor calibration...so you'd think I should be okay as far as that goes. It probably looks just fine to PC users, but on my perfectly calibrated cinema display the colors aren't even close. Any other solutions?


                          RGB is a color space, while CMYK is just a bunch of colors put together. Hence you cannot get exact CMYK representation of every RGB color, rendered by your monitor. This is in some way the closest color (I got no idea what algorithm is used to define that) you can obtain converting the base RGB values into CMYK.
                          So no matter how hard you try, you won't be able to get some - mostly green, blue and violet - variations in process colors.

                          This can become quite an issue when preparing prints in RGB space and switching color mode of your design to CMYK at the ends.
                          • 10. Re: Anyone else's colors not even close?
                            Ann_Shelbourne Level 1
                            CMYK is not really "just a bunch of colors put together"!

                            The CMYK values represent the percentage of each of the 4 process color INKS which will most closely reproduce the RGB colors (which you see on your Monitor) when ink hits paper under certain Press conditions.

                            The reasons that Violets, Blues and Greens cannot be reproduced on paper with the intensity that you see on your RGB Monitor has a great deal to do with the pigments that are available to manufacture Cyan ink.

                            If you want to reproduce intense Violets, Blues and Greens (and certain reds and oranges too) on printed paper, you need to print with additional "Touch Plates" with Spot Color (Pantone) inks.

                            Inkjet printers use 6 or 8 colors (NOT the Press 4C Process inks) so you can obtain more intense colors from your Epson than you will from an Offset Press.
                            • 11. Re: Anyone else's colors not even close?
                              lametastic Level 1
                              Thank you Ann, you added some deeper insight to my messy post :) I'm glad your professional point of view doubles my. Sorry cPants ;)
                              • 12. Re: Anyone else's colors not even close?
                                Sami@Adobe Adobe Employee
                                Thanks to both Lametastic and Ann for jumping right in to help other members with the recent flurry of color management questions. (Is it something in the air? What's going on?) Much appreciated! Sami
                                • 13. Re: Anyone else's colors not even close?
                                  cPants Level 1
                                  Nope, I calibrate it to the Mac standard of 1.8
                                  It'd be cool if kuler would automatically adjust to the operating system, as many mac users will be at 1.8. But even then I don't believe that 1.8 is the root problem. I've changed my monitor profile to all sorts of PC and RGB standards and still don't get anything close. Colors are still as mismatched as the screenshot.
                                  • 14. Re: Anyone else's colors not even close?
                                    Sami@Adobe Adobe Employee
                                    Hmm... we'll take another look at your screenshot. Stay tuned.
                                    Sami
                                    • 15. Anyone else's colors not even close?
                                      Ann_Shelbourne Level 1
                                      > I calibrate it to the Mac standard of 1.8>

                                      cPants:

                                      Very few people still do that because it was only the "Mac Standard" when it related to matching the 13" Apple monitors of the late 1980s to the Apple StyleWriter printers of the same period.

                                      Professional designers who use Macs are all using Gamma 2.2 now because it equates with what 95% of the other computer users are using; and sRGB (which was formulated as a universal color space for the Web) is designed for Gamma 2.2 monitors.

                                      It does sound as though your Monitor Profile is fried!

                                      Try re-calibrating your monitor from scratch by following the instructions on this website and see if that helps:

                                      http://www.gballard.net/nca.html
                                      --------------
                                      The trouble with your Screen Shot is that you selected a CMYK color in Kuler while looking at it in a non-color managed RGB Browser on a transmitted-light-generating monitor.

                                      Photoshop converted those CMYK percentages into what you could expect to get back from your printing company when process INKS mix on paper using the CMYK Working Profile (SWOP 2 perhaps?) that you have currently selected.

                                      Actually, i suggest that it would be wise to REMOVE the ability to specify colors in CMYK percentages from Kuler entirely — because they can only be highly misleading in the context of being viewed in a non-color-managed RGB Web Browser.