14 Replies Latest reply on Oct 23, 2014 2:45 PM by A.T. Romano

    Video and audio sync is off

    bsee65 Level 1

      I have a video that was captured using the Hauppauge Win-TV 950Q and the Win TV software package. The file plays just fine in WinTV or using the Windows Media Player, but the timing of the audio and video seem to slip if I import it into Premiere Elements. I am using version 10, so I don't know if this is something that was fixed in a newer version. Over the course of an hour, the audio goes from off by about a second at the beginning to being something on the order of eight seconds behind at the end of an hour. Anyone know how to fix this?

       

      Thanks

      -Bob

        • 1. Re: Video and audio sync is off
          A.T. Romano Level 7

          Bob

           

          What computer operating system is your Premiere Elements 10 running on?

           

          What are the properties of the source video - video compression, audio compression, frame size, frame rate, interlaced or progressive,

          five extension? Especially important is whether or not the video was recorded with a variable frame rate? Variable frame rate instead

          of constant frame rate is often problematic for Premiere Elements to the extent

          a. audio out of sync

          b. source video cannot be imported at all

           

          If you do not know whether or not your video was recorded with a variable frame rate, please put your video through the video properties

          readout program MediaInfo

          MediaInfo | SourceForge.net

          and look for 3 instead of 1 frame rate - if 3, you will see minimum, regular, maximum. You may have to take your video into a

          program like HandBrake to convert the variable to constant frame rate before importing the video into Premiere Elements.

           

          How much control do you have over the settings for the recording of the source? Codecs as well as bitrate and frame rate?

           

          Let us start here and then decide what next.

           

          Thanks.

           

          ATR

          • 2. Re: Video and audio sync is off
            bsee65 Level 1

            thanks for looking! If I knew the answers to all your questions, I probably would know what's wrong and how to fix it. I am not looking to do anything exciting here, just trying to archive a program to a playable DVD. Well - I have it playable, it's just not watchable unless you can deal with badly synced audio.

             

            Loaded up mediainfo and it says the frame rate is 29.97, but a variable bit rate for video and constant audio.

             

            I will look into handbrake.

             

            Oh - and Win 7 OS...

             

            It's probably more than necessary - but here's the text output:

             

             

            General

            ID                                       : 0 (0x0)

            Complete name                            : C:\Users\Public\Videos\S-Video_20141020_1928.ts

            Format                                   : MPEG-TS

            File size                                : 3.00 GiB

            Duration                                 : 55mn 32s

            Overall bit rate mode                    : Variable

            Overall bit rate                         : 7 740 Kbps

             

             

            Video

            ID                                       : 1001 (0x3E9)

            Menu ID                                  : 1 (0x1)

            Format                                   : MPEG Video

            Format version                           : Version 2

            Format profile                           : Main@Main

            Format settings, BVOP                    : Yes

            Format settings, Matrix                  : Default

            Format settings, GOP                     : M=3, N=12

            Codec ID                                 : 2

            Duration                                 : 55mn 32s

            Bit rate mode                            : Variable

            Bit rate                                 : 7 163 Kbps

            Maximum bit rate                         : 8 500 Kbps

            Width                                    : 720 pixels

            Height                                   : 480 pixels

            Display aspect ratio                     : 16:9

            Frame rate                               : 29.970 fps

            Standard                                 : NTSC

            Color space                              : YUV

            Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0

            Bit depth                                : 8 bits

            Scan type                                : Interlaced

            Scan order                               : Top Field First

            Compression mode                         : Lossy

            Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 0.692

            Time code of first frame                 : 02:17:15:16

            Time code source                         : Group of pictures header

            Stream size                              : 2.78 GiB (93%)

             

             

            Audio

            ID                                       : 1002 (0x3EA)

            Menu ID                                  : 1 (0x1)

            Format                                   : MPEG Audio

            Format version                           : Version 1

            Format profile                           : Layer 2

            Codec ID                                 : 4

            Duration                                 : 55mn 32s

            Bit rate mode                            : Constant

            Bit rate                                 : 192 Kbps

            Channel(s)                               : 2 channels

            Sampling rate                            : 48.0 KHz

            Compression mode                         : Lossy

            Delay relative to video                  : -297ms

            Stream size                              : 76.3 MiB (2%)

             

             

            Menu

            ID                                       : 1000 (0x3E8)

            Menu ID                                  : 1 (0x1)

            Duration                                 : 55mn 32s

            List                                     : 1001 (0x3E9) (MPEG Video) / 1002 (0x3EA) (MPEG Audio) / 1003 (0x3EB) ()

            • 3. Re: Video and audio sync is off
              bsee65 Level 1

              I have HandBrake as well now. I am trying to use it to convert to CBR, and we'll see how it goes. I am looking at the settings and would gladly accept any recommendations for settings to change as little as possible and avoid any reduction in quality, particularly on the video side.

               

              Thanks again - seems like I'm making progress with your assistance.

              • 4. Re: Video and audio sync is off
                A.T. Romano Level 7

                bse65

                 

                Thanks for the reply. Suspect a bit of out of sync on the communications. Variable and constant were only being asked for frame rate, not bitrate.

                From the looks of your MediaInfo readout, there is no evidence that the file was recorded with a variable frame rate. (You have 1 frame rate showing, not 3) So much for my primary indication for HandBrake need for the conversion from variable to constant frame rate. Frame rate looks fine at 29.97 interlaced frames per second.

                 

                Next area of concern...if our target is reason for out of sync audio in Premiere Elements....what is your Premiere Elements project preset? If you do not know, please tell us what you see under Edit Menu/Project Settings/General and Editing Mode, Timebase, Frame Size, and Pixel Aspect Ratio even if some fields look grayed out.

                 

                From your video audio properties readout, the following would be indicated...

                NTSC

                DV Widescreen

                 

                Do not uninstall HandBrake yet. Let us see where targeting the Premiere Elements project preset gets us. You may have HD settings where you should have

                SD settings.

                 

                We will be watching for your results.

                 

                Thanks.

                 

                ATR

                • 5. Re: Video and audio sync is off
                  bsee65 Level 1

                  First UBD disclosure... The machine I am using to make the DVD is running Premiere Elements 11, not 10. I have 10 on this laptop, but I'm not using it as part of this project.

                   

                  Okay...

                  The "General" screen shows:

                   

                  editing mode DV NTSC

                  timebase 29.97 fps

                   

                  Video

                  720 x 480

                  aspect D1/Dv NTSC widescreen 16:9 (1.2121)

                  fields upper field first

                  display format 30fps drop frame timecode

                   

                  title safe area 20 / 20

                  action safe area 10 / 10

                   

                  audio

                  sample rate 48 KHz

                  display format audio samples

                   

                  Most are gray except frame size, safe areas, and display formats. There is a playback settings button that is active.

                  If I had to guess, I would suspect that the 29.97 timebase and 30fps display format are the mismatch. if my math is correct, that would amount to approximately 1 frame every 30 seconds and 1 second off every fifteen minutes or so. Of course, I know very little about how this stuff works, so that's a pretty wild guess...

                  • 6. Re: Video and audio sync is off
                    A.T. Romano Level 7

                    bsee65

                     

                    Thanks for the follow up information. Very helpful.

                     

                    It would appear that your project preset matches well enough with the properties of your source media. So much for mismatch of project preset and properties of source media. Your MediaInfo information rules out a variable frame rate as the cause of the audio out of sync. You have a MPEG2.ts file, and Premiere Elements 11 supports files with .ts file extension. So far, more rule outs than ins. For the moments, my focus is on the MPEG2.ts.

                     

                    Now let us bring HandBrake into the picture to determine what happens to your Premiere Elements issue if we convert your MPEG2.ts to H.264.mp4 and import that H.264.mp4 into Premiere Elements. Have you worked with HandBrake before? Just basic use at this point

                    a. make sure the Container is Mp4

                    b. under Video Tab, make sure that Video Codec = H.264 (x264)

                    specify the frame rate = 29.97

                    dot the Constant for the frame rate

                    c. you should not have to do anything under the Picture Tab

                    d. when ready, hit Start button at top left of workspace

                    e. wait for the Queue Finished in the progress bar at the bottom

                    left of the workspace.

                     

                    If any question or need clarification, please let us know.

                     

                    More on this in the morning.

                     

                    Thanks for the follow ups. Much appreciated.

                     

                    ATR

                    • 7. Re: Video and audio sync is off
                      bsee65 Level 1

                      I tried that conversion earlier but did not import the file into premiere. I was concerned that the output file was about 1/8th the size of the original, and that quality might fall off with compression. I will try this shortly and see what results.

                      • 8. Re: Video and audio sync is off
                        bsee65 Level 1

                        The conversion does solve the sync issue, but the fall-off in video quality is unacceptably significant. I am trying the higher quality options with HandBrake and will check back when I figure out if it helps.

                         

                        As a side note, we saw a recommendation to rename the .ts file to .mts, and that seemed to alter the sync, but not quite fix it.

                        • 9. Re: Video and audio sync is off
                          bsee65 Level 1

                          While it would still be nice to resolve this, we've found that the software that came with a DVD R/W drive we bought a year or two ago can write these files cleanly to good quality DVDs in sync. No idea why Premiere can't do it. It would be nice to edit the extra bits off the beginning and end, and to put a top menu on, and that software can't do those things.

                          • 10. Re: Video and audio sync is off
                            A.T. Romano Level 7

                            bsee65

                             

                            What is the comparison of the original and HandBrake file video and audio bitrates.

                             

                            From your properties readout, looks like, for original, video bitrate = 7163 kbps (kilobits per second) and audio bitrate = 192 kbps.

                             

                            Under the HandBrake, Video Tab, Quality,

                            dot the Average Bitrate (kbps) choice and enter 20000 kbps.

                            Let us see if that is more appropriate for a H.264.mp4 file.

                             

                            If the quality is good but the file size prohibitive, we could work down on the bitrate to reach

                            a compromise between bitrate, quality, and file size.

                             

                            Live the audio bitrate as is for now.

                             

                            ATR

                             

                            Add On...I would have to think about the file renaming from .ts to .mts...did you try .ts to .m2ts?

                            But, your version does support .ts files, so.... There are some versions that do not.

                            • 11. Re: Video and audio sync is off
                              bsee65 Level 1

                              Using the default settings, the video bit rate was around 2300. With the quality turned up a bit, the last one I looked at was 5800. When I turned it all the way up to RF0/lossless, the bit rate was just under 19000. The original file size was about 3.6 GB. The smallest result was around 1 GB, the middle result was 2.6 GB, and the lossless file came out around 8.5 GB.

                               

                              This isn't something that would be fixed by upgrading to the latest elements, is it? Should I capture you a short piece of video and send it to you somehow to play with? I would guess you don't need the whole hour....

                              • 12. Re: Video and audio sync is off
                                A.T. Romano Level 7

                                bsee65

                                 

                                Thanks for the follow up.

                                 

                                But, did you try HandBrake with the bitrate adjust that cited - under Video Tab, just dotting the Average Bitrate and setting for 20000 kbps?

                                 

                                If you could send a sample by way of a Dropbox link in this thread, that would be great. I would be glad for the opportunity to work with

                                the portion that presents in Premiere Elements with the audio video out of sync.

                                 

                                ATR

                                • 13. Re: Video and audio sync is off
                                  bsee65 Level 1

                                  Thanks-

                                   

                                  I did not specifically try a 20000 bitrate. Letting it do the best it could resulted in a constant 18998. I can try that anyway, but I doubt it will help. When you force a bitrate, there are a couple other check boxes that become active. SHould I select either of those?

                                   

                                  I will be doing more on this over the weekend, so I might have something for you on Monday.

                                   

                                  -bob

                                  • 14. Re: Video and audio sync is off
                                    A.T. Romano Level 7

                                    bsee65

                                     

                                    Please do exactly as suggested, no more nor less on this particular troubleshooting plan...

                                     

                                    As I wrote earlier

                                    Now let us bring HandBrake into the picture to determine what happens to your Premiere Elements issue if we convert your MPEG2.ts to H.264.mp4 and import that H.264.mp4 into Premiere Elements. Have you worked with HandBrake before? Just basic use at this point

                                    a. make sure the Container is Mp4

                                    b. under Video Tab, make sure that Video Codec = H.264 (x264)

                                    specify the frame rate = 29.97

                                    dot the Constant for the frame rate

                                    c. you should not have to do anything under the Picture Tab

                                    d. when ready, hit Start button at top left of workspace

                                    e. wait for the Queue Finished in the progress bar at the bottom

                                    left of the workspace.

                                    But, now we are going to modify "b" so that it includes with the codec and frame rate settings...

                                    under Video Tab, just dotting the Average Bitrate and setting for 20000 kbps

                                    That should take care of your video quality issues as well as the Premiere Elements audio out sync issue that you

                                    told me HandBrake has taken care of.

                                     

                                    You can enhance a HandBrake approach later if indicated. For now I would like to see if the above works

                                    exactly as written.

                                     

                                    Thanks.

                                     

                                    ATR