15 Replies Latest reply on Dec 1, 2014 10:45 AM by ECBowen

    Current workstation performance and building a new one

    DonAndress Level 1

      Hello.

       

      I was just wondering if my current's workstation render time is ok or I should expect better performance.

      It's Xeon E3-1231 v3 (stock 3.4-3.8GHz), Gigabyte motherboard with Z97 chipset, 4GB of ram and unfortunately GeForce 210.

      There's Win7 x64, latest drivers, AP Pro CC.

       

      The render time of 30min footage (1080/50p) with only multiple cross dissolve effect and some audio volume tweaking is around 1h 30min.

      But when I add Red Giant Denoiser on almost all clip and Colorista on some parts the rendering time increases up to 35h.

      Does that sound about right with system?

       

       

      Another question would be - what system should I build to significantly lower the render time?

      Would adding just GeForce 780 to the existing one do the trick?

      I know that 4GB of ram is way too low. I plan to exchange that for 32GB soon but I believe that ram doesn't really affect rendering time itself. Am I wrong?

       

      Or if GeForce 780 and 32GB is not enough then what CPU should I buy?

       

      Does it make sense to install 2x GeForce 780?

      Will that increase performance significantly vs 1x GeForce 780?

      We are talking only Premiere Pro CC here.

        • 1. Re: Current workstation performance and building a new one
          JEShort01 Level 4

          Premiere Pro requires a balanced system to perform well. If any of the chain is weak (cpu, RAM, drive(s), and GPU), then performance will suffer in one or more areas.

           

          And in your case, your build is really unbalanced .

           

          For Adobe CC, I would suggest:

          - 32GB of RAM; 16 would be massively better than 4GB, but RAM works best when purchased together, so I would remove your current RAM and go with 32GB

          - GTX 780 is a fine card, but GTX 970 may be the better investment

          - what drives do you have? When you speed up the RAM and GPU, you may see yet another bottleneck in the render chain

           

          Now, regarding your Colorista and Giant Denoiser slow-downs, their processing can be pretty taxing for even the strongest systems, but with more RAM and GPU, they should both work a whole lot better.

           

          Regards,

           

          Jim

          • 2. Re: Current workstation performance and building a new one
            Bill Gehrke Adobe Community Professional & MVP

            Once you get RAM, GPU and memory updated if you then want more power at the heart of the system upgrade your CPU to a Core i7-4790K (4.0-4.4 GHz) and then gently overclock it a bit.

             

            What is your power supply?  If this system was purchased off the shelf it might be marginal for any upgrades.

            • 3. Re: Current workstation performance and building a new one
              ECBowen Most Valuable Participant

              Ram significantly effects render time both for the CPU processing and the GPU processing. If you don't increase the ram then adding a new GPU wont help you. GPU acceleration requires ram to send the data down to the GPU for processing. You require enough ram to shadow the amount of data the GPU can handle to really utilize the capability of it. GPU acceleration is Premiere uses allot of ram and that is besides the ram required for the caching of frame data the CPU's needs to decode. When you add FX data to the mix the ram usage exponentially increases since frame data has to be buffered multiple times as the FX data processes the frame data and has to adjust that  to the frame data adjusted by the FX. All of this equates to you really want atleast 16GB of ram for Premiere and HD media. 32GB of ram is where you want to be. 4K media makes 32GB of ram really the minimum and 64GB  where you want to be most of the time.

               

              Eric

              ADK

              • 4. Re: Current workstation performance and building a new one
                RjL190365 Level 4

                I agree with the others: Upgrade the RAM and GPU both at once. 4GB is way too little RAM to effectively run these professional media applications, while the GeForce 210 is an extremely weak GPU to begin with (it is actually slower with MPE GPU acceleration enabled than in software-only MPE mode). The GeForce 210 has only 16 CUDA cores (versus the 640 CUDA cores that even a middling GeForce GTX 750 Ti has), and its memory throughput is an appallingly low 8.0 to 12.8 GB/s (versus the still mediocre 86.4 GB/s of the GTX 750 Ti). Both of those conspire to make the Haswell-based quad-core, 8-thread Xeon slower than some dual-core, two-thread Celeron CPU-based systems in overall performance in Adobe Premiere Pro. Even an el cheapo GeForce GT 730 with 2GB of 64-bit GDDR5 RAM (memory throughput: 41 GB/s) is significantly faster than that GeForce 210.

                • 5. Re: Current workstation performance and building a new one
                  DonAndress Level 1

                  @Jim

                  Drives - for system and software 250GB Samsung SATA, for data 1TB WD EZEX + 2TB Toshiba ACA200.

                  Do you think there are better plugins in terms of performance but which would give me as good result as Red Giant Denosier?

                  I am just stunned with the results I get with RG Denoiser!

                   

                  @Bill Gehrke

                  Do you think it's wise to purchase some other Xeon CPU instead of i7-4790K?

                  I chose E3-1231 v3 just because it's the same as i7 but just without GPU.

                  How about E5-2637 v3 with 3.5-3.7GHz and 15MB of L3 cache?

                  Does that make sens or is it better to go for clock speed with your i7 suggestion?

                   

                   

                  Guys, it's decided then - I'm going for at least 32GB of ram.

                  I'm just wondering about the GPU. I read here at the board that there is no full support for GTX 970 yet and all those CUDA processors can't be used for rendering.

                  Therefore I was thinking of GTX 780 instead.

                  Although it would be better to have a card with two times less power consumption in GTX 970...

                  Did anything change in that area? Is there a full support for this new Maxwell architecture yet?

                   

                  And I'll go back to the last question - does it make sens to combine 2x GTX 780 (970)?

                  Will that increase the rendering speed?

                  • 6. Re: Current workstation performance and building a new one
                    Bill Gehrke Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                    DonAndress wrote:

                     

                    @Bill Gehrke

                    Do you think it's wise to purchase some other Xeon CPU instead of i7-4790K?

                    I chose E3-1231 v3 just because it's the same as i7 but just without GPU.

                    How about E5-2637 v3 with 3.5-3.7GHz and 15MB of L3 cache?

                    Does that make sens or is it better to go for clock speed with your i7 suggestion?

                    There is absolutely no technical reason to buy a Xeon unless you want more than one CPU in your system  Our Premiere Pro BenchMark (PPBM) has proven that many times over.

                     

                    The GTX 970 that I have currently performs about the same as my GTX 780.  But at much less power (runs cooler), it is HDMI 2.0 compatible (4k), and it may have future expansion capability that has not yet been used.

                    • 7. Re: Current workstation performance and building a new one
                      DonAndress Level 1

                      Bill.

                      Thanks for your input.

                       

                      This is what I think should be fine. What do you recon?

                       

                      Gigabyte GA-Z97-HD3

                      Intel Core i7-4790K, socket LGA1150

                      HyperX FURY DDR3 8GB 1866MHz CL10          x4

                      Gigabyte GeForce GTX 980 OC 4GB

                      Samsung 850 PRO ASAP 256GB                     for system and apps

                      Cooler: Be Quiet! Dark Rock PRO 3

                      PSU: XFX ATX Core 450W

                       

                      Regarding SSD drive - will that really be any advantage?

                      Once I start the system and Premiere Pro it's there and I don't need to further load it, so maybe SSD would be "bored" and it's better to stay with my current 250GB SATA Samsung?

                       

                      And regarding PSU: CPU ~100W, GPU ~200W, ram+drives+all_fans+mobo should be ~60W

                      Therefore I assume 450W of this very efficient and good quality PSU should be enough, right?

                      If not, there is also 550W or 650W version worth considering from the same manufacturer.

                      • 8. Re: Current workstation performance and building a new one
                        cc_merchant Level 4

                        This is a very common mistake among new builders, skimping on a good PSU and the cause for many, many problems. 450W is not enough. Suggested is at least 700W, better 750 or 850W.

                        The PSU is one of the most crucial components in any system but also the one component most often overlooked. A good PSU will give you years of reliable work on your PC, a suboptimal or mediocre PSU will give you tremendous headaches and unexplainable crashes, hangs or errors, causing you to miss deadlines.

                         

                        Go to eXtreme Power Supply Calculator Pro v2.5 and get the Pro version. Enter all your components, including planned expansions, set the Motherboard to High End - Desktop, set the CPU Utilization (TDP) to 100%, set System Load to 100% and Capacitor Aging to 30% and press the Calculate button. Add 10 - 15% to this Wattage for safety and note the required amperage on the various rails (+3.3V, +5V and +12V). Based on these figures, select a good GOLD or PLATINUM label PSU, that meets the total wattage and the amperage on each rail. It is your best guarantee for long and reliable, trouble-free editing.

                         

                        It is a myth that a big PSU uses more electricity than a small PSU. If the system needs 600W to run, a 650W PSU will use 600W and run at 92% of its capacity. A 1200W PSU will draw the same 600W from the wall outlet, but runs at 50% of its capacity. It is comparable to a Formula 1 race with a safety car situation. Bernd Schneider in his Mercedes AMG safety car will run at 92% of its capacity, the Formula 1 cars run at 50% of their capacity.

                        You are better off with running a PSU at 50-65% of its capacity, than running it at 80% or more.

                         

                        From Tweakers Page - What kind of PC to use?. Also read the other articles there.

                        The GTX-980 OC is way overkill for this simple 4 core system with extremely limited disk setup. A GTX-760 is more in line with the other components, but requires an even heftier PSU.

                        • 9. Re: Current workstation performance and building a new one
                          DonAndress Level 1

                          Ok, so if Intel Core i7-4790K is not powerful enough, then what do you suggest the CPU should be for this graphic card?

                          • 11. Re: Current workstation performance and building a new one
                            DonAndress Level 1

                            That's socket 2011 and if so, isn't it better to go for i7-5930K?

                            It's 15MB of cache L3 and there is not much of a difference in the price department.

                            • 12. Re: Current workstation performance and building a new one
                              Bill Gehrke Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                              Yes, that is a great upgrade for you , the only disadvantage right now is the cost of the DDR4 RAM.  I am personally hoping that the after Christmas slow down in buying might cause some price reductions.  As it is a new high end item I have not seen it discounted if at all.

                               

                              Edit:

                               

                              That i7-5930K is not a socket 2011, it is a socket 2011-3 which is not the same and requires an X99 motherboard and the newer DDR4 RAM

                              • 13. Re: Current workstation performance and building a new one
                                ECBowen Most Valuable Participant

                                BTW all of the E5 Xeon chips are socket 2011 and not 1150. The E3 Xeon chips are the 1150 CPU's. That means the Z97 is E3 only.

                                 

                                Eric

                                ADK

                                • 14. Re: Current workstation performance and building a new one
                                  DonAndress Level 1

                                  Yes Eric, thanks for clarification.

                                  I think for now I will stay with what I have, I will just upgrade to 32GB of ram and add GTX 9x0 (I don't know which yet, this choice is also about power consumption as 780 series needs twice as much). That's because for now I only edit Full HD footage plus the explanation below:

                                   

                                   

                                  Bill, regarding DDR4 - I think that even if it's after Christmas there will be no significant price drop. I think we have to wait for Intel and their Z107 chipset for new processors family which will launch somewhere in the second half of 2015. Z107 is designed for home-power users and it will force usage of DDR4 so I believe it will be a nice kick for customers to buy DDR4 and therefore a price drop.

                                  • 15. Re: Current workstation performance and building a new one
                                    ECBowen Most Valuable Participant

                                    DDR4 pricing is not about demand right now. It's due to the very limited production. Very few Fabs are producing DDR4 at the moment which means availability is very limited worldwide and therefore pricing is much higher. That will likely change sometime mid next year but don't expect the desktop platform updating to DDR4 next year last I checked. If it does it wont be until end of the year at best most likely. Until more fabs move to DDR4 pricing is going to stay high as it is now unless demand drops completely.


                                    Eric

                                    ADK