7 Replies Latest reply on Jan 5, 2015 3:25 PM by mslinn

    Live capture into PP CC 2014

    mslinn

      I have a Samsung NX30 mirrorless camera, which I purchased to assist me in making videos - I work alone. The camera streams video at 1080p @ 30fps over HDMI 1.4a. Older, tape-based cameras streamed video into PP via live capture over FireWire. A similar live video capture feature for HDMI capture cards would provide for a workflow as efficient as FireWire capture used to be. BTW, I tried 3 BlackMagic capture cards, which advertised such a feature and none of them worked. Does anyone have a solution for live capture with this camera?

        • 1. Re: Live capture into PP CC 2014
          Kevin-Monahan Adobe Employee

          Hi MsLinn,

          mslinn wrote:

           

          I have a Samsung NX30 mirrorless camera, which I purchased to assist me in making videos - I work alone. The camera streams video at 1080p @ 30fps over HDMI 1.4a. Older, tape-based cameras streamed video into PP via live capture over FireWire. A similar live video capture feature for HDMI capture cards would provide for a workflow as efficient as FireWire capture used to be. BTW, I tried 3 BlackMagic capture cards, which advertised such a feature and none of them worked. Does anyone have a solution for live capture with this camera?

           

          When you say they "didn't work," what do you mean? Did you get a warning? Which BlackMagic cards did you try using? Were they visible in Preferences > Device Control?

           

          Thanks,
          Kevin

          • 2. Re: Live capture into PP CC 2014
            mslinn Level 1

            I was able to view the video stream from the camera in a TV and a computer monitor.

             

            I tested 3 Blackmagic DeckLink Mini Recorders with 3 custom-built computers, for a total of 9 combinations: two computers have ASUS Sabertooth motherboards and one has an ASUS P9X79 motherboard. These computers run PP extremely well. Yes, entries appeared in Premiere Pro Preferences > Device Control. Unfortunately, no video stream was captured from the camera by any of the 3 Blackmagic DeckLink Mini Recorders. There was no error message. Instead, the 3 Windows computers I all bluescreened after a few minutes running Blackmagic Media Express. I spent a LOT of time with Blackmagic tech support, over a 5-week time period, and they were unable to help, so I returned the cards, one by one.

             

            I now am trying to get an image from a StarTech PEXHDCAP card using their StreamCatcher software, again without success. Unfortunately, I do not expect that this card will be able to stream video into PP for live capture ... unless you know of a way to do this?

             

            Is there a way forward with a video card from any manufacturer at all?

             

            Thanks,

             

            Mike

            • 3. Re: Live capture into PP CC 2014
              Kevin-Monahan Adobe Employee

              Hi Mike,

              Check out AJA. And they have excellent support. Unfortunately, I don't have any records of anyone else doing this so I'm sorry that I'm lacking info.

               

              Thanks,
              Kevin

              • 4. Re: Live capture into PP CC 2014
                mslinn Level 1

                Just got off the phone with AJA. Their IO Express seems like the least expensive ($995) option. Ouch! Know of any other products that will do the job?

                • 5. Re: Live capture into PP CC 2014
                  mslinn Level 1

                  We have several workstations with the ASUS Sabertooth X79 motherboard, and the others have the ASUS P9X79 motherboard. After speaking extensively with AJA sales, and 4 people from presales support during a conference call, I ordered the IO Express because they were adamant their products would work with an ASUS Sabertooth X79 motherboard, and that this had previously be verified by testing.

                   

                  Unfortunately, the AJA IO Express that I received would not capture anything from my camera. I filed a trouble ticket and spoke with Steve at AJA (a tech support person), who told me that the IO Express was designed several years ago and the hardware has not been modified since. Steve suggested I update drivers, which I did, to no avail. I updated the trouble ticket. Nothing happened for  a week, probably because of the holidays. I just got a call from Will Simpson, another tech support person @ AJA. Will told me that AJA products are only supported to work with these computers: https://www.aja.com/en/support/kona-pc-system-configuration. Will's position was that ASUS and Gigabyte make substandard motherboards that did not comply with PCIE standards; this was a surprising claim to hear. Will said that AJA would not even support their Thunderbolt products on any computer with a Thunderbolt add-in card - AJA will only support the specific systems they reference, provided that Thunderbolt support is built-into the motherboard.

                   

                  Will's suggestion was that we replace all our computers with others from their approved list so that they would be compatible with AJA's products. That is not a viable option.

                   

                  I will return the AJA IO Express to B&H where I bought it. I am very disappointed.

                   

                  Are there any other options for live capture from a camera into PP CC 2014?

                  • 6. Re: Live capture into PP CC 2014
                    SAFEHARBOR11 Most Valuable Participant

                    It's quite possible that there is nothing wrong with any of the capture cards you tried and it could be the camera. Did you try capturing any other HDMI video sources other than the NX30? Here's the thing - "camcorders" with HDMI outputs send out a very standard 1080i signal in most cases, and they "just work" whether talking about video capture to a PC or using a portable recorder such as the Atomos Ninja 2 device.

                     

                    DSLR cameras are another story entirely. When DSLRs first started offering HD video recording a few years ago, a lot of them had non-standard HDMI outputs. Some cameras had viewfinder data overlays on the HDMI output that could NOT be disabled, rendering the HDMI output useless for recording. Some cameras also put out a weird frame sizing that was cropped or otherwise non-standard. Most newer models of Canon, Panasonic, and Sony DSLRs are now putting out a standard signal that works, in part due to the efforts of Atomos working directly with the camera makers.

                     

                    Some of the DSLRs that will work with Atomos don't do so "out of the box" - the user is required to go into the DSLR setup menu and get all the settings "just so" to make it work. While it is quite common for DSLR videographers to want to connect to a portable recorder such as the Atomos units, much less likely when talking about desktop capture, so that is why I keep referencing Atomos, since I don't know anyone connecting a DSLR to a BlackMagic card for instance.

                     

                    So, while you may be able to connect the NX30 HDMI output directly to an HD screen and get a picture, that is not a guarantee that the same HDMI output is going to work with a "capture card". I checked here What cameras are supported? | Atomos and see no mention of any Samsung camera models. That does not necessarily mean it is not possible to record the output, but not a good sign that it is not mentioned. The solution might be as simple as changing a camera menu setting or record mode or something, but I'm not familiar with that camera personally.

                     

                    I see that the NX30 can record 1080p60, so please note that most capture cards do not accept 1080p60 inputs. I did see camera specs that suggest the HDMI output is 1080p30 and that *should* work.

                     

                    Just to give you an idea of the compatibility issues with recording HDMI from DSLRs, check these links: http://atomos.helponclick.com/kb/article/ninja-tests-with-popular-dslr-cameras

                     

                    F3 - What cameras work with Atomos recorders? - ATOMOS

                     

                    May I ask the intended workflow? Is there a reason that the video recorded to SD card is not going to work out for your needs, making "live capture" preferable?

                     

                    Thanks

                     

                    Jeff Pulera

                    Safe Harbor Computers

                    www.sharbor.com

                    • 7. Re: Live capture into PP CC 2014
                      mslinn Level 1

                      This mirrorless camera is quite new, so I doubt that it appears on any compatibility list yet. This camera only puts out 1080p @ 60 under limited circumstances. Normally it puts out 1080p @ 30fps. I connected the camera to a TV and a computer monitor and they both worked fine. This camera puts out HDMI 1.4a, and uses all the extra 1.4a features such as expanded Adobe color space, however the AJA products are only tested to work with HDMI 1.3. I had expected that this was likely to be one significant problem, so I had quizzed AJA sales and presales support on this issue extensively and they insisted that it would work.

                       

                      I did not make clear in my previous post that the AJA card does not appear to have installed correctly. This is the gating issue. Instead of offering support of their product on a system with an ASUS motherboard the initial response was "send your computer to us for a week or more and then we'll seek internal authorization to maybe look it." Later in the conversation that changed to "replace your machine with one from our list of approved prebuilt systems".

                       

                      I'm not going to attempt to justify to you why we want live capture. That's what we need, and it would be a shame to have to go back to an old tape-based camera with FireWire in order to get it with PP CC 2014.

                       

                      Thanks,

                       

                      Mike