11 Replies Latest reply on Jan 7, 2015 5:03 AM by dj_paige

    I export to a jpeg and add to cat but if I do a synch after it wants to delete it

    sonofcy Level 1

      If I export a raw to a jpeg in same folder update catalog it all works, but if I do a folder synch after that all my exported jpeg's want to be deleted.

      Our LR group admin tried this as well and got the same results. I am on 5.7.1 he is on 5.2 and we are both experienced users. Since normally I export my jpegs to a separate folder out of the catalog I didn't notice this earlier but I was actually doing a test for a user having a similar problem involving edit in PS and losing the tif.

        • 1. Re: I export to a jpeg and add to cat but if I do a synch after it wants to delete it
          dj_paige Level 9

          I guess the question is why are you doing a folder sync if the photos in that folder (both RAW and JPG) are already in Lightroom? It sounds like this is an unnecessary step.

          • 2. Re: I export to a jpeg and add to cat but if I do a synch after it wants to delete it
            sonofcy Level 1

            I was actually troubleshooting somebody else s problem and this was a simulation of it.

             

            In any case, a folder synch should not delete images that are properly in LR.

             

            It doesn't matter if it is necessary or not, it's incorrect behavior.

             

            I also had our LR group admin try it and his did the same thing.

             

            The adobe support people tell me that they can not reproduce it so I am going to make a screen movie and send that to them since I have reason to doubt that they got it.

            • 3. Re: I export to a jpeg and add to cat but if I do a synch after it wants to delete it
              dj_paige Level 9

              It doesn't matter if it is necessary or not, it's incorrect behavior.

              I guess I don't understand enough of what you are doing and where your photos are to agree its incorrect behavior.

               

              If you sync a folder, and you have photos in Lightroom that are registered in the Lightroom database as being in that folder, but the operating system has no such photos in that folder, then Lightroom correctly deletes the photos from its database to match what exists in the operating system. So, is that your situation, or not?

              • 4. Re: I export to a jpeg and add to cat but if I do a synch after it wants to delete it
                sonofcy Level 1

                I thought I explained it but maybe not.

                 

                I exported a raw as jpeg to same folder, checked the add to catalog box. When I come back to Library view the jpeg shows up in the film strip and grid after a moment. I also glance at my Smart collection for File Type = JPEG and it has updated.

                 

                I now do a Folder Synch and the dialog says it will delete all the jpegs (only 4) THIS IS WAYYYYYYY WRONG.


                I then had the LR Help Group admin try it and he got the same behavior.


                The reason I did it was to emulate another users problem in case there was a general export issue. The original scenario worked for me and my test scenario failed as noted. Looks like a bug to me and I have been messin with puters since 1960 and debugged software all over the world.


                I will keep poking around to see if there is some other reason for this but so far no luck.

                • 5. Re: I export to a jpeg and add to cat but if I do a synch after it wants to delete it
                  Bob Somrak Level 5

                  Sync Folders is sort of an IMPORT instruction so maybe it honors the "Treat JPEG files next to raw files as separate photos" setting in preferences.   Turn it on/off and see what happens.  With it switched OFF the sync will remove the jpg from Lr as you say.  With the preference set to OFF it probably should remove the photo although there is a setting to not to in the sync dialog.  I didn't test this too much as my workflow does NOT include keeping jpgs is the same folder as the RAWS.

                   

                  Screen Shot 2015-01-06 at 2.59.27 PM.png

                  • 6. Re: I export to a jpeg and add to cat but if I do a synch after it wants to delete it
                    sonofcy Level 1

                    Give that man a cigar. Thank you.

                     

                    Now why did Adobe support not know that?

                     

                    I will email them on this, Thanks again.

                     

                    BTW I turned the option ON it was OFF.

                    • 7. Re: I export to a jpeg and add to cat but if I do a synch after it wants to delete it
                      ssprengel Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                      LR is operating correctly and it is not right to characterize what has happened as the JPGs that were in the catalog from a export-reimport being deleted/removed during a synchronize.  If you have treat-separate not enabled then the JPGs are moved to be sidecars of their respective raws--and this indication would have been in the Metadata panel in Library had you known to look, so they are still imported into the catalog they are just hidden.  You can reverse the effect by enabling treat-separate and doing another synchronize.

                      --

                      Most people who work for Adobe (free) Support probably don't actually use Lightroom or Photoshop or other Adobe programs, they only know how to recite scripted responses to common questions that they search in the internal Adobe knowledge base.   There utility is where the user has a common problem with a common solution and only needs to be guided along the path to it.

                       

                      The community forums are a group of other users like yourself who do actually use Adobe products and have much deeper knowledge of how things work from experience.  Of course the forums are staffed by people who feel like helping and during certain days or times of days there may not be anyone who knows how to respond online and watching for new queries.    

                      • 8. Re: I export to a jpeg and add to cat but if I do a synch after it wants to delete it
                        sonofcy Level 1

                        I sorta agree with you, but if I am allowed to export as jpeg and allowed to check the options of same folder and import to catalog then where is the warning that I also need to check the option to treat jpegs as separate.

                         

                        Other than sports photographers who need to send their jpegs to publishers in near real time almost everyone who knows better only shoots raw. So as I see it adobe should have defaulted the setting to treat as seperate.

                         

                        Even one of the admins of the LR Help Group did not know this.

                        • 9. Re: I export to a jpeg and add to cat but if I do a synch after it wants to delete it
                          ssprengel Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                          The initial characterization of the JPGs being removed and the additional characterization of LR acting incorrectly, wasn't exactly true, as so that could have confused some people from the correct analysis.

                           

                          LR is acting properly, as designed by hiding or showing JPGs with corresponding raws based on the treat-separately setting during a batch import or synchronize operation.  Your not knowing what Synchronize does with JPG-raw pairs is no reason to remind you every time you use it even long after you know exactly how things work, right?

                           

                          I always export my JPGs to a subfolder of the master photos based on the purpose or destination because I want to remember what went where especially if the same thing goes to multiple destinations, so as I see it, if you don't want to lose track of your JPGs to an inadvertent Synchronize operation then organize things a bit more and use separate folders if you're only shooting RAWs.  If you're shooting raws + JPGs then you wouldn't be exporting to the same folder in the first place because it would overwrite your JPGs and you'd already being using a separate folder to save your exported JPGs.

                          • 10. Re: I export to a jpeg and add to cat but if I do a synch after it wants to delete it
                            sonofcy Level 1

                            I normally export my jpegs to a totally separate folder structure outside of my Pictures folder so this has never tripped me up before.

                             

                            As I stated earlier not only me but also the admin of the LR Help Group was caught by this as well. He is a very experienced user, I am a newbie to LR, but 55 years a computer techie.

                             

                            The only reason we were doing this was to try and test another users issue with losing images coming back from PSCC. I was simply making sure there was not a general issue in the new release 5.7.1 of saving in same folder and adding to catalog. In that process I noticed that a synchronize wanted to delete my jpegs and that caused me to think there was a problem since I didn't know about the raw+jpeg setting.

                             

                            The statement you made of 'even long after you know exactly how things work,' is not true, I am a newbie and am still a long way from knowing exactly how things work.

                             

                            If I was the LR programmer I could easily be talked into adding a check re the separate jpeg feature and pop up a warning box. BTW I have been programming since 1965.

                             

                            I do now understand that the LR chat support is next to useless and I will not waste my time with them again.

                             

                            This support mechanism looks much better and will be the first place I go for support in the future.

                             

                            My apologies to adobe for incorrectly characterizing the observed behavior as a bug. Rather I would now ask them to consider a feature request that whenever a user attempts to do something that is in conflict with a preference that they pop up a dialog box warning them of such. I believe that this would cut the support requests dramatically.

                             

                            Thanks for the feedback but maybe lighten up a bit on us newbies. At 72 even if I saw the option there is a good chance I would not remember it.

                             

                            Don't laugh, you will get there some day too.

                            • 11. Re: I export to a jpeg and add to cat but if I do a synch after it wants to delete it
                              dj_paige Level 9

                              Feature requests go here: http://feedback.photoshop.com/

                               

                              If I was the LR programmer I could easily be talked into adding a check re the separate jpeg feature and pop up a warning box. BTW I have been programming since 1965.

                              There's no doubt this could be programmed. The issue is whether or not you can convince Adobe that it needs to be programmed, and honestly, I'm skeptical.