9 Replies Latest reply on Feb 3, 2015 10:19 PM by Laubender

    Creep gives me the creep

    LindyHop1943 Level 1

      I have created a 100 page magazin for saddle stiching. Because it is a cultural event the budget is low. We print with the biggest low cost priting house in Germany FlyerAlarm. Quality and speed are excelent. The problem I'm facing is that FlyerAlarm does not account for creep. It is wrong, but they are so much cheaper and faster than anyone else.

       

      I know the print booklet option in InDesign and also know that there are various Imposition plugins, but all of them create impositions, two page spreads for printing. FlyerAlarm only accepts single pages with no bleed on the inside. So I would need to shift the contents according to the calculated creep. I would like not to do this by hand. Is there any option in InDesign, Acrobat or with plugins to achive this automated?

       

      Cheers Marcus

        • 1. Re: Creep gives me the creep
          MW Design Level 4

          Unless you have a small live area, creep on 25 sheets for your 100 pages will not be very noticeable depending upon the paper thickness. For a magazine, with its typical thickness, I doubt creep is really measurable versus page shift running through their press at the speed it is going.

           

          Mike

          • 2. Re: Creep gives me the creep
            rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

            What you are trying to do would be very unusual, so I doubt there is a plugin. It probably could be scripted—you could place the InDesign pages in a new InDesign document then incrementally shift the pages.

            • 3. Re: Creep gives me the creep
              LindyHop1943 Level 1

              The difference between the first and last page of last year's booklet was 6mm (about 0.23 inch). So that is quite noticeble. This year we have a vintage border on the spreads.

               

              I did shift the content and frame on each page manually. I calculated the shift and set the increment of the cursor keys. Next I dectached all master page elements except the locked background.  Then on the first round I shifted the frame inside its frame and on teh second run the contect to balance the border distance. I pressed once on teh arrow key on the second page, twice on the next, and so on.

               

              It is stupid work and should be possible by a setting, but at least the result looks good.

              • 4. Re: Creep gives me the creep
                MW Design Level 4

                Almost a quarter of an inch? Wow. Are you certain of that number? How thick is the paper?

                 

                Mike

                • 5. Re: Creep gives me the creep
                  LindyHop1943 Level 1

                  Mike, it was 135g.

                   

                  We also printed a small info booklet with 24 pages and the difference was very visible due to the frame.

                  • 6. Re: Creep gives me the creep
                    LindyHop1943 Level 1

                    Sounds like an idea. I won't be able to do it now, but for the future it would be helpful.

                    • 7. Re: Creep gives me the creep
                      Colin Flashman Adobe Community Professional

                      MW Design wrote:

                       

                      Unless you have a small live area, creep on 25 sheets for your 100 pages will not be very noticeable depending upon the paper thickness. For a magazine, with its typical thickness, I doubt creep is really measurable versus page shift running through their press at the speed it is going.

                       

                      Mike

                      not very noticeable? I disagree - something like that would have 5mm of creep on stock such as 80gsm laser.

                       

                      there is a way that it can be done in indesign manually, but as the thread suggests, I STRONGLY URGE YOU not to have to move items yourself and let the printer handle that sort of stuff:

                       

                      [CS3-CS5|JS] is there a script to apply creep to artwork?

                      • 8. Re: Creep gives me the creep
                        MW Design Level 4

                        Using the last paper stock that was used for a 72-page mag I laid out was a gloss at 0.0041" (130 G/M2). That's 0.0697" of creep...assuming the paper was on spec as I haven't mic'd it. The last larger mag I did was 160-page and used 100 G/M2, 0.0031" thick paper and had about 0.160" of creep.

                         

                        The only way I can calculate getting to 0.23" creep is to use a light cover stock, but the G/M2 is significantly higher than the OP indicates. For 100 pages, 25 sheets (minus one depending on how creep is dealt with so calculation is typically on 24 sheets in this case), it takes a paper thickness of 0.0096" thick.

                        • 9. Re: Creep gives me the creep
                          Laubender Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                          @Lindy – Best would be to show us a screenshot of a full double page layout where we can look at the rulers.

                          Maybe your layout is not good for or tolerant enough for this kind of binding.

                           

                          If you absolutely have to stick with your current layout, I would go with the suggestion that Rob made in answer #2. Placing InDesign pages or PDFs and moving them. That will minimize the effect of creep, but it will not totally go away, since there are always tolerancesof other kind.

                           

                          Uwe