10 Replies Latest reply on Feb 9, 2015 8:16 AM by pjgfi

    ID Master Pages vs Powerpoint / Captivate Master Slides

    pjgfi Level 1

      Hello,

       

      I'm new to InDesign and I just can't get the way Master Pages are supposed to work.

       

      I though they were pages like the ones in Powerpoint or Captivate : you put placeholders on the page and format them the way you want, then when you create new pages based on those masters you just fill in the pre-formatted fields.

       

      This is not the case in InDesign. Everything's locked ! What's the point ?

       

      It's fine for background pictures, pages numbers and that kind of stuff but why would you put text and image placeholders you just can't edit ?

       

      Of course, you can override item but you just lose link to the master page.

       

      A simple example : I made a master page with chapter title on a line (white on a grey background) with automatic numbering and a block of text underneath.

       

      Now, if I apply this master to a page, I just can't type in text, autonumbering is useless. I have to overide elements but what if I change title background color and decide text should be on two columns ? If I reapply Master on my page, I get modified stuff underneath overidden elements !

       

      I hope you see what I mean and that you will give me clues to the best approach to InDesign master pages.

       

      Thanks.

       

      PJ

        • 1. Re: ID Master Pages vs Powerpoint / Captivate Master Slides
          Willi Adelberger Most Valuable Participant

          Don't put anythin on the Master. Except automatic page number, running header and maybe a background on the lowest layer.

           

          Text styles and other styles are defined in Paragraph, Character, Object, Table and Cell Styles and found in WIndow > Styles > …

          Define your styles there, it is much more better than PPT.

          • 2. Re: ID Master Pages vs Powerpoint / Captivate Master Slides
            pjgfi Level 1

            Thanks for your answer.

             

            But what if I want to have pages layouts ? Like title + 2 columns of text, chapter title on a single page...

            • 3. Re: ID Master Pages vs Powerpoint / Captivate Master Slides
              Willi Adelberger Most Valuable Participant

              Specify it with styles, that's what they are for:

              • Pragraph Text with Paragraph Style and included GREP, Nested. LInes and INitial Letters and Lists as Character Style
              • Single Words inside a Paragraph which are different as the rest with Character Styles.
              • Text and Image Frames as Object Styles (which also includes the number of columns)
              • Tables with Table and Cell Styles.

              On the master page define border guide lines and manuala guide lines.

              For the whole document use Layers.

               

              You can't compare PowerPoint with InDesign. InDesign is a high prolific layout program.

              • 4. Re: ID Master Pages vs Powerpoint / Captivate Master Slides
                pjgfi Level 1

                Right ! I sort of get it now.

                The annoying bit is Text and Image frame.

                Suppose I have many pages with the same layout : Numbered title (there's a white rectangle over the grey one) + text on two columns + picture. Are you telling me you can make an "object" from the stuff on the left (like you would make a clip in Flash) and then drop it on every page needed ?

                inDesign.gif

                How do I convert stuff on the left into an object ?

                 

                Thanks !

                • 5. Re: ID Master Pages vs Powerpoint / Captivate Master Slides
                  Willi Adelberger Most Valuable Participant

                  Prepare it, put it into a Library (INDL file) and place it (not via drag and drop) as you need it.

                   

                  But Your layout as it is on the screen shot is much toooooo complicated. Make 1 text frame for the headline and for the 2 columns. Why are you splitting it into 2 frames?

                  Use Paragraph Styles!

                   

                  I think you should take some classes before starting your project and forget everything you have done in PowerPoint. The kind to work is soooo different, you you can't use it as helpful experience here.

                  • 6. Re: ID Master Pages vs Powerpoint / Captivate Master Slides
                    pjgfi Level 1

                    Thanks for your answers Willi !

                    The good thing is I actually never used PowerPoint, it was just a reference. But I've used Captivate and I know it uses the same template principle as PPT.

                     

                    As for the classes, I red some books and watched tutorial and they go for the "override stuff in the Master page to be able to edit it, which sounds to me like you're breaking your Master page when you shouldn't.

                     

                    You find my layout complicated and I see what you mean (like having title spanned over the two columns) but I can't see how I could mix Character styles without having dummy text that I would replace afterwards.

                     

                    By the way, could you recommend me some books?

                     

                    Thanks.

                    • 7. Re: ID Master Pages vs Powerpoint / Captivate Master Slides
                      Willi Adelberger Most Valuable Participant
                      1. Make the border and column guid lines in page layout.
                      2. Use text frames with 2 columns best practice is to set up them via object styles.
                      3. Set a pragraph style for your text.
                      4. Set another paragraph style for your headline: Make column Span over all with a specified distance after, Paragraph Ruler for the Grey bar, white text

                      But don't use Character Styles, except for single words, automatic numbers, all things which are different from the residing pargraph properties.

                       

                      Avoid overrides on pages, as these are causing problems in syntax and in editing later. Beter is to use a different master page, where you can use overrides.

                      E.g. it makes problems when you have overrides and want to reapply the same master again.

                      Or it makes problems when you create PDFs for unlimitted access or when you export EPUBs or HTML.

                      • 8. Re: ID Master Pages vs Powerpoint / Captivate Master Slides
                        pjgfi Level 1

                        Thanks, I managed to get the headline through Paragraph Style and ruler (sorry, I wrote "Character style" but I meant "Paragraph style").

                         

                        Still, I don't see how you can mix styles in a block without having dummy text. You can't tell "First line: Paragraph Style 1, Rest of text: Paragraph Style 2 Except last line: Paragraph Style 3", can you ?

                        • 9. Re: ID Master Pages vs Powerpoint / Captivate Master Slides
                          Willi Adelberger Most Valuable Participant
                          • You can define next style in the paragraph style.
                          • When you select several paragraphs, you can can apply with the right mouse click style and next style.
                          • You can also define it in the Object Style, either a paragraph style for all or with next style.
                          • Next style works also when you write.
                          • And of course you can apply a paragraph style by clicking into the paragraph and applying it from the paragraph styles.
                          • 10. Re: ID Master Pages vs Powerpoint / Captivate Master Slides
                            pjgfi Level 1

                            Great! "Next style", of course...

                            Many, many thanks.

                             

                            Actually, I nearly managed to get the white bar automatically inserted in header ('|' in Numbering Style + Character style making it wider and taller) but Nested Style or GREP style won't work on numbering...