9 Replies Latest reply on Feb 22, 2015 8:50 AM by Ann Bens
      • 1. Re: How to get rid of the black bars on the sides of the encoding to DVD PAL 16: 9?
        A.T. Romano Level 7

        kodziu

         

        What version of Premiere Elements and on what computer operating system.

         

        If you are maintaining a 16:9 workflow from source to end product, no black borders on your PAL DVD-VIDEO widescreen 16:9 on DVD disc.

         

        Pending further information, go back to the Edit area of the program and make sure that there are no black borders in what you

        are seeing in the Edit area monitor playback of the Timeline. If you see them there, then scale the image in the monitor just to the point where

        the black borders are gone.

         

        We will be watching for your results and details. Depending on the details, we will customize the troubleshooting accordingly.

         

        Thank you.

         

        ATR

        • 2. Re: How to get rid of the black bars on the sides of the encoding to DVD PAL 16: 9?
          kodziu Level 1

          Adobe Premiere Elements 12

          Widnows 7

           

          I do not know how well you understood but on the timeline in the viewer can not see the bars. The album also dvd are black belts.

          An ad hoc solution to problems is to disable scaling and increase in the width to 102.

          But is it normal?

          http://zapodaj.net/images/630a2099e1ab1.png

          • 3. Re: How to get rid of the black bars on the sides of the encoding to DVD PAL 16: 9?
            A.T. Romano Level 7

            kodziu

             

            I understood your question and that is why I asked the questions that I did.

             

            When you (manually) or the project (automatically) set the project preset, that project project

            should match the properties of the source media so that the program is directed to establish

            the correct format space in the Edit area monitor for editing. The expectation is that then the import

            image will fill that space. That is normal.

             

            And, from what you wrote, that is exactly what is happening, if you say that there are no black borders in

            the Edit area monitor.

             

            Nonetheless, you say that you are seeing small black borders to the left and right of your TV display after

            the burn to DVD disc using the preset PAL_Widescreen_Dolby Digital.

             

            1. What is the project preset that you or the project is setting? If you do not know, then please

            tell us the readings for Editing Mode, Timebase, Frame Size, and Pixel Aspect Ratio (even if they

            are grayed out) under Edit Menu/Project Settings/General.

             

            2. What are the properties of your source media especially as it relates to Frame Size and Pixel Aspect Ratio?

            From your screenshot, it looks like AVCHD.mts 1920 x 1080 16:9 or 1440 x 1080 HD anamorphic 16:9.

             

            2. What are you using as the player? Have you looked at other DVD players attached to TV? Wondering if it can

            be a problem with the TV player interaction with the 16:9 flag attached to the video (stretch should be to 1056 x 576, the Adobe way).

             

            The workaround solution that we arrived on was scale out of the black borders to the left and right. I probably would have used "zachowa proprcje" with a

            check mark next to it and scaled width and height together rather than just height with the no check mark next to "zachowa proprcje".

             

            But, when we rule out all of the above considerations as a baseline, I wonder if the issue will resolve to one regarding the PAL square pixel issue

            of 1024 x 576 versus what Adobe uses 1056 x 576.

            http://www.mikeafford.com/blog/2009/03/pal-d1-dv-widescreen-square-pixel-settings-in-after -effects-cs4-vs-cs3/

             

            I will think through the latter and comment further.

             

            Looking forward to your reply.

             

            Thank you.

             

            ATR

            • 4. Re: How to get rid of the black bars on the sides of the encoding to DVD PAL 16: 9?
              kodziu Level 1

              I am sending a few screenshots:
              1-3. project Settings

              http://images68.fotosik.pl/637/fd6087fa6f42d05cgen.png

              http://images70.fotosik.pl/636/df754a8c565cf17egen.png

              http://images67.fotosik.pl/638/f2ed44105356de4agen.png
              4. Export Settings

              http://images68.fotosik.pl/637/b0d01892c69f807egen.png
              5. Information on the output file

              http://images70.fotosik.pl/636/e8d87e9c2a2ec07dgen.png
              6. Information on the source file

              http://images70.fotosik.pl/636/ff12fe3aac222be8gen.png


              Screen of the first post comes from the laptop screen with a resolution of 1366x768. Black bars on the TV so do not throw in the eye, but I see that they are.

              Excuse me, but I know little English. Thank you for your help.

              • 5. Re: How to get rid of the black bars on the sides of the encoding to DVD PAL 16: 9?
                A.T. Romano Level 7

                kodziu

                 

                Thanks for the additional very helpful information.

                 

                You start with source AVCHD.mts 1920 x 1080i25 with the appropriate project setting and you take that

                to export to file using Publish+Share/Computer/MPEG with preset of PAL DVD Widescreen preset.

                 

                Originally I thought that you were taking the Timetime directly to burn to disc, PAL DVD-VIDEO 16:9 on DVD disc.

                But your post suggests you are going through PAL MPEG2.mpg 16:9 to get to burn the burn to disc. Is that correct?

                 

                Where are you seeing the black borders....when you play the PAL DVD-VIDEO 16:9 Widescreen on the TV set for 16:9

                or when you play the PAL MPEG2.mpg file on a computer player.

                 

                I need to walk through the steps to determine if the issue in any way is related to the conversion between non square pixels

                and square pixels (Adobe's old and new 1424 x 576 versus 1456 x 576) as discussed in the link that I posted in the prior thread.

                 

                More later.

                 

                Thank you again for the follow up.

                 

                ATR

                • 6. Re: How to get rid of the black bars on the sides of the encoding to DVD PAL 16: 9?
                  A.T. Romano Level 7

                  kodziu

                   

                  I just dealt with this solely on a computer level without adding to it the TV...

                   

                  Here is the possible explanation I have come up with.....the matter seems to involve PAL square pixels equivalents for non square pixels and the burn to DVD disc

                   

                  Think I have caught the core of this when I suspected the PAL 1024 x 576 vs 1056 x 576 square pixel equivalents for non square pixel 720 x 576 16:9.

                  For Premiere Elements, PAL DV Widescreen, 720 x 576 16:9 is stretched  for display after encoding to 1056 x 576 pixels as per Adobe (used to be to 1024 x 576 pixels).

                  See previous link that I posted on that earlier. Note that 1056 x 576 is not an exact 16:9; whereas 1024 x 576 is.

                   

                  The project preset, in this case, PAL DV Widescreen, instructs the program to set up the correct format space in the Edit Mode monitor for editing. I confirmed that

                  space being set up by that project preset setting for that project preset is 1056 x 1080. And, further if you import a file into a PAL DV Widescreen project and export it

                  to Publish+Share/Computer/MPEG2 with Presets = PAL DVD Widescreen and re-import the export into the PAL DV Widescreen project, the image fits the 1056 x 1080.

                  So far so good - well consistent anyway.

                   

                  However, when the export is burn to disc (Publish+Share/Disc/DVD disc with Presets = PAL_Widescreen_Dolby DVD) and the video file on the disc inspected in Premiere Elements, that video file presents with the 1024 x 576 size (a true 16:9) rather than 1056 x 576.

                   

                  I see no way to customize the burn to preset PAL_Widescreen_Dolby to avoid what seems to have gone on during the burn to disc.

                  Consequently, the only correction that I see is doing what you are doing with scaling of the image slightly before the burn to unless there is a TV settings to factor this out.

                   

                  But I am looking at this microscopically here and wonder just how much of this you would really expect to see at the TV view level.

                   

                  Please consider and let me know if you find the same.

                   

                  Thank you.

                   

                  ATR

                  • 7. Re: How to get rid of the black bars on the sides of the encoding to DVD PAL 16: 9?
                    kodziu Level 1

                    Direct recording to DVD also gives you the black bars on the sides. But on the other hand, the disc menu does not have these strips.
                    It does not interpret these strips if the footage as follows:

                    http://images68.fotosik.pl/638/892c0924e3039fc5.png

                    But then the image is flattened.

                    For as far as I understood you concludes that we should not worry about it, because on TV these bars are not much visible. And if you want to get rid of them, I should scale the image at the same time, not just on the right and left.

                    I think this will end. Thank you very much.

                    • 8. Re: How to get rid of the black bars on the sides of the encoding to DVD PAL 16: 9?
                      A.T. Romano Level 7

                      kodziu

                       

                      Thanks for the reply.

                       

                      At this point, my tentative conclusion is use the scaling before the export if necessary. For now, that would be it.

                      But, I will see if I can get further information on your specific question.

                       

                      Best wishes

                       

                      ATR

                      • 9. Re: How to get rid of the black bars on the sides of the encoding to DVD PAL 16: 9?
                        Ann Bens Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                        You cannot correct the black bars in Elements (you can Premiere Pro)

                        This has all to do with the pixel aspect ratio. It used to be 1.422 for PAL dv widescreen. (this is not just PAL but the same goes for NTSC; different PAR)

                        Adobe changed this to 1.4587 somewhere around 2009.

                        Hence the black bars when converting HD 1920x1080 to SD 720x576. (HD is a perfect 16:9 as SD widescreen is not)

                        In Premiere Pro there is a crop function on export to correct this 'issue' that Element does not have. (there is no point in scaling in the timeline, one needs to crop on output)

                        I would not worry too much about it, on most tv's you wont see the bars only on a PC.

                         

                        FEATURE request

                         

                        For DV widescreen square pixels Adobe use 1050x576 for PAL and 872x486 for NTSC.