4 Replies Latest reply on Jun 15, 2015 9:29 AM by Gusgsm

    How to build an ICC color profile for a salmon paper with Color Munki. Doable?

    Gusgsm Level 2

      Hi, folks

       

      We have some newspaper-like publications that are printed in a litho offset web press according to the standard ICC profile ISONewspaper26v4. We make no contract colour proof of them and they have no colour wedge printed. Anyway, I have managed to get some kind of pseudo-proof for ourselves, the design gang, with a laser printer using a ColorMunki Design. Not that they are contract quality proofs or even real colour proofs, but they are way better than having none —and, to be honest, they are much closer to the target than I thought they could be—.

       

      Now, some of the publications are printed in a salmon colour paper. We have some sheets of this same paper that we could use to print the Color Munki patches —two consecutive sets— so as to make an ICC profile for this paper.

       

      My question is: Having this scenario, do you think of a better way of trying to get something near to color management with this paper different from printing the patches in this salmon paper with the laser printer and then build the profile with it?

       

      I mean, afterwards we are going to print in normal plain paper... Somehow I think I am losing something.

       

      And, yes, i know this is a very ****** colour management. But something here is better than none.

       

      Thanks a lot.

       

      Gustavo (Posting from Madrid)

        • 1. Re: How to build an ICC color profile for a salmon paper with Color Munki. Doable?
          G.Hoffmann Level 3

          Do you mean salmon colored paper like this?

          https://www.google.de/search?hl=de&as_q=&as_epq=salmon+color&as_oq=&as_eq=&as_nlo=&as_nhi= &lr=&cr=&as_qdr=all&as_sitesea…

           

          A calibration in the strict sense of color management (show the same appearance for/on different media)

          is in my humble opinion here quite nonsensical. We have two (extreme) possibilities:

          a) source white is mapped to paper color (white is reproduced by light salmon color: Relative Colorimetric)

          b) source white is mapped to neutral gray (white is reproduced as neutral gray gray by printing the complementary

              color of salmon, a kind of greenish cyan, on light areas: Unlucky Absolute Colorimetric). 

           

          Printing K-only on salmon colored paper is probably agreeable, even for photos.

           

          Best regards --Gernot Hoffmann

          • 2. Re: How to build an ICC color profile for a salmon paper with Color Munki. Doable?
            Gusgsm Level 2

            Hi, Gernot,

             

            I said "ISONewspaper26v4", not "ISOnewspaper26v4_gr". We are printing CMYK color, not just K. It's not so nonsensical, really.

            • 3. Re: How to build an ICC color profile for a salmon paper with Color Munki. Doable?
              G.Hoffmann Level 3

              Hola Gustavo,

               

              your task is for me not quite clear. I can see two scenarios:

               

              a) Calibrate the press for  ISONewspaper26v4 ink (your standard process) on salmon colored paper.

                  Print the target by press on this paper, measure and build the profile. There is no problem so far.

                  But preparing CMYK data with this profile for printing by press requires a very complicated gamut

                  compression, becauses the gamut of the actual process on salmon paper is small and excentric

                  in Lab. As mentioned in my previous post.

               

              b) Simulate the appearance of press prints on salmon paper, disregarding the salmon color by profiles.

                  This shall be done in your case by a toner printer.

                  The toner printer has to be calibrated with white paper. As a result one gets a valid Printer Profile.

                  The proof printing happens for a CMYK file, for instance a PDF/X-1a file so:

                  Input profile: ISONewspaper26v4

                  Output profile: Printer Profile

                  Printed on salmon paper!

                  The printer profiling converts the toner printer into a more or less reliable proof printer. This has nothing

                  to do with colored paper.

              Page 11 shows an example:

              http://docs-hoffmann.de/oki-ps-28082005.pdf

               

              Best regards --Gernot Hoffmann

              • 4. Re: How to build an ICC color profile for a salmon paper with Color Munki. Doable?
                Gusgsm Level 2

                All right, some months after, I come back to report what I have done. A real botch, I know

                 

                1. I measured five different samples of stacks of the salmon paper in zones not printed and with nothing printed in the back —the margings to be precise—. I used the ColorMunki because I have nothing else.

                 

                2. I made the mean of the Lab and sRGB values.

                 

                3. I defined a new colour swatch in InDesign with those Lab values.

                 

                4. I placed a big patch over the page with that colour using "darken" blending mode.

                 

                5. I printed that with InDesign using the 'proof' setting for ISONewspaper26v4 and the printer profile for the paper loaded at the printer. I did not click the 'simulate paper color' checkbox.

                 

                Result: It should have resulted a close match but the colour of the paper was the 5 times measured a bit darker than what I saw and it printed thus: A bit darker. Otherwise, well, better than anything.

                 

                But has anybody an idea of a better approach or how to get a better measuring with what I have at hand? (pretty please)