24 Replies Latest reply on Mar 25, 2015 12:26 PM by A.T. Romano

    Timing mismatch between picture and sound.

    gertm4738408

      I have been using Premier Element ver. 12 with my films recorded with my Canon EOS camera without any problems. I have now been trying to clip a film recorded with a MAC copmuter. The files have .mov extension. My problem now is, that the sound and the pictures are not sycnroniced anymore. It seems that the Pictures are 3 seconds faster per minute than the sound. So after 20 minutes the Pictures are 1 minute in front of the sound. Playing the original files with the Windows player Works fine and the timing of the sound in Premiere Elements fits with sound using the Windows player.

      Any Ideas????

      Gert Munch

        • 1. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
          whsprague Level 4

          There are so many possible reasons for out of sync audio, it is hard to pinpoint why your Apple recording is not working.  You wrote nothing about how or with what they were recorded.

           

          The usual fix in Premier Elements is to "unlink" the audio and video tracks and slide the audio track to where it fits.  It can be selected and moved with the mouse or, as little as a frame at a time, with keys.

           

          I probably am useless at helping with the recording on your Apple, but I can help with techniques for moving the audio track.

           

          Good luck!

           

          Bill

          • 2. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
            John T Smith Adobe Community Professional & MVP

            MOV is a wrapper, what is inside YOUR wrapper - Exactly what is INSIDE the video you are editing?

            Codec & Format information, with 2 links inside for you to read http://forums.adobe.com/thread/1270588

            Report back with the codec details of your file, use the programs below... A screen shot works well to SHOW people what you are doing

            https://forums.adobe.com/thread/1070933 for screen shot instructions

            Free programs to get file information for PC/Mac http://mediaarea.net/en/MediaInfo/Download

             

            What you describe is a "classic" symptom of a variable frame rate

            Does your video use a VARIABLE Frame Rate or a Constant Frame Rate?

            • 3. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
              A.T. Romano Level 7

              Gert Munch

               

              Not sure of what you are doing - are you going between Premiere Elements 12 Windows and Premiere Elements 12 Mac or iMovie with a .mov

              movie file from your Canon or something else?

              and

              I am not sure if out of sync audio is being caused by your clipping/trimming of the file, project settings, or some inherent property of the file that was

              created.

               

              Details..

               

              I would like to contribute some ideas, but could you please clarify the following so that I can do that.

               

              Assumptions...

               

              Given the you have .mov video files from a Canon camera, and you have been taking them into Premiere Elements 12 for editing

              and export without problem.

              Question: I am assuming that you used Premiere Elements 12 installed on a Mac computer for this successful work.  Is that correct? If not,

              please explain.

               

              You wrote:

              I have now been trying to clip a film recorded with a MAC computer. The files have .mov extension. My problem now is, that the sound and the pictures are not synchronized

              Question: When you say this, are you still in Premiere Elements 12 Mac splitting clips on the Timeline there or some how are you in Premiere Elements 12 Windows working with a video clip (.mov) created in Premiere Elements 12 Mac or iMovie or other?

               

              Looking forward to your follow up to help us help you.

               

              Thank you.

               

              ATR

              • 4. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
                gertm4738408 Level 1

                Hi' Bill

                Thanks for your response. The recorded clips are recorded with some kind of MAC computer. I have not performed the recordings myself, but are clipping them together for a freind. I am now trying to get information on the type of MAC computer.

                 

                I know about unlinking the sound track from the video track and moving them relative to each other. My problem is, that when the recordings are loaded into Premiere Elements, the video tracks are compressed in time whereas the sound track maintain its original length. From a recording originaly lasting 1 hour the sound track lasts 1 hour when loaded into Premiere Elements whereas the video track is now compressed to 57 min. Nothing is missing, the video track just finishes 3 min before the audio track.

                 

                Gert

                • 5. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
                  gertm4738408 Level 1

                  Hi' A.T.R

                  Thanks for your response.

                  It can sometimes be hard to explain things without leaving some doubt behind. I will try to explain a Little more precise.:

                  A number of video recordings have been performed by Means of some kind of MAC computer. As I did not perform the recordings I do not yet know what type of MAC were used. I am trying to find out.

                  These recordings have been loaded into Permiere Elements instaled on a PC with Windows 8.1

                  Watching these recordings within Premiere Elements, still without any editing, shows, that the video tracks are compressed in time whereas the sound tracks maintain the original timing. An original recording of 1 hour gives a video track of 57 min in Premiere elements. The sound track have the correct timing, but is chopped of at the end of the compressed video track.

                   

                  When playing the original recordings using the player in Windows the sound and video stays syncronised and have the correct length in time.

                  When working with video recordings performed with my own Canon EOS 7 I do not have any problems.

                  Hope this clarifyes my situation and ansvers your questions.

                  Gert

                  • 6. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
                    gertm4738408 Level 1

                    Hi' Bill

                    I forgot to mention, that the audio track is having its original timing, but is chopped of when the time compressed video track ends. Sorry for the confusion.

                    So in Premiere Elements the video track and the audio track have the same length, but the video track is compressed in time (everything is there) and the audio track is truncated in time at the end.

                    Gert

                    • 7. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
                      whsprague Level 4

                      Try the Time Stretch Tool. 

                       

                      Unlink the audio and video.  Select the video track and slow it down to match the exact time length of the audio track.  It will probably not be perfect, but it might be close enough.

                       

                      Good luck!

                      • 8. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
                        A.T. Romano Level 7

                        Gert

                         

                        Thanks for the additional information on your situation

                         

                        Bottom line:

                        If you import this file into Movie Maker 2012, does it present with video and audio components completely and in sync?

                        If so, I would consider taking the file into Movie Maker 2012 to create an edited or non edited H.264.mp4 version which you can take

                        into Premiere Elements project if necessary.

                         

                        Details

                         

                        Premiere Elements 12/12.1 on Windows 8.1 64 bit

                        Knowing the properties of the problem file at different levels of approach

                         

                        Quick

                        If you have a file with video and audio components, and it was recorded with Mac, I suspect the file has a .mp4 or .mov file extension. Is that correct?

                        What we need to find out about this file are its properties. A very quick look might be to right click the file's thumbnail in Premiere Elements 12 Expert workspace

                        Project Assets, select Properties from the drop down menu, and tell us what is displayed for

                        Type

                        File Size

                        Frame Rate

                        Total Duration

                        Pixel Aspect Ratio

                        Also from that right click, Interpret Footage, what do you see for Frame Rate from file and well as Pixel Aspect Ratio?

                         

                        More Information

                        Download and install the free codec utility named GSpot and let us know the readings, especially for Video Name Codec Status and Audio Name Status.

                        GSpot Codec Information Appliance

                         

                        Comprehensive Information

                        Download and install the free MediaInfo properties readout program

                        MediaInfo | SourceForge.net

                         

                        If the problem file is coming from a screen capture program, there are numerous possibilities for problems in the Premiere Elements project.

                        My approach is to find out as much information about this file in the absence of any help from the person who created the file and establish

                        a troubleshooting plan based on the findings.

                         

                        Looking forward to the results. Any questions or need clarification, please do not hesitate to ask.

                         

                        ATR

                        • 9. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
                          A.T. Romano Level 7

                          Gert

                           

                          I would prefer to move forward with this with as much file information as possible as mentioned in my prior post.

                           

                          In post 6, you further clarified

                          So in Premiere Elements the video track and the audio track have the same length, but the video track is compressed in time (everything is there) and the audio track is truncated in time at the end.

                           

                          In the properties readouts, please see if you can find any readings for video bitrate and audio bitrate.

                           

                          Some of the pieces of the issue fall into place for one explanation while they do not for others.

                           

                          ATR

                          • 10. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
                            gertm4738408 Level 1

                            Hi' John!

                            Thanks for your response.

                            I have downloaded and instaled the program you suggested and the information on the 4 video files in play is seen below.

                            Since my question I have discovered something. One of the video files Works in Premiere Elements without problems and that is the first in the list, the one with 22 frames/s.

                             

                            I have some additional facts:

                            Film 10-03-15:  22 frames/s   1080x720

                            Film 12-01-15:  14 frames/s   720x480

                            Film 15-12-15:  14 frames/s   1080x720

                            Film 16-02-15:  14 frames/s   1080x720

                             

                            The recordings are made with a MAC-book R and the person WHO has performed the recordings have no idea of how to set things up. This is obvious from the different formats of the 4 recordings..

                             

                            I do not know if your question about variable frame rate is ansvered from the above. I would not expect the frame rate to change during a recording.

                            Gert

                             

                            • 11. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
                              A.T. Romano Level 7

                              Gert

                               

                              Thanks for the recent details of the files that you are trying to work with.

                               

                              It is difficult to point to one particular file property to pursue for cause of file non support in Premiere Elements in view of the details when we

                              see the following in which the first does work, but the rest do not.

                              Film 10-03-15:  22 frames/s   1080x720

                              Film 12-01-15:  14 frames/s   720x480

                              Film 15-12-15:  14 frames/s   1080x720

                              Film 16-02-15:  14 frames/s   1080x720

                              We could target the frame rate..

                               

                              Can you get the other 4 to process through Premiere Elements if you convert them first in Movie Maker 2012 to H.264.mp4 with

                              a frames rate of 29.97 frames per second? If so, what does that look like. You can also use the free HandBrake as well for the task.

                               

                              You have a lot of properties in the group that are atypical for Premiere Elements. And, deciding on the best possible import and export

                              settings would be next if we ever get those files to import in the first place.

                               

                              But, let us see what we can do.

                               

                              Thanks.

                               

                              ATR

                              • 12. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
                                John T Smith Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                >question about variable frame rate is ansvered from the above. I would not expect the frame rate to change during a recording

                                 

                                Back in message #2 I posted a link to find software that will TELL you about your files... and depending on exactly what software was used to create the files, a variable frame rate is very possible

                                • 13. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
                                  gertm4738408 Level 1

                                  Hi' Whaprague!

                                  Thanks for your hint, which with some Work will solve the problem for now. It would be nice though to find the cause of the problem for future issues.

                                  Best regards

                                  Gert

                                  • 14. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
                                    whsprague Level 4

                                    gertm4738408 wrote:

                                     

                                    Hi' Whaprague!

                                    Thanks for your hint, which with some Work will solve the problem for now. It would be nice though to find the cause of the problem for future issues.

                                    Best regards

                                    Gert

                                    Glad to hear it!  Sorry it's not perfect.

                                     

                                    Bill

                                    • 15. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
                                      gertm4738408 Level 1

                                      Hi John!

                                      I did download the program you mentioned in # 2 and the readings from that program is shown in #10 unless I have misunderstod your advise.

                                      Gert

                                      • 17. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
                                        gertm4738408 Level 1

                                        Hi' ATR

                                        Ref. #8

                                        Loading one of the problem files into Movie Maker Shows a small but constant shift between sound and Video within Movie Maker. Easy to fix. Exporting and import into Premiere Elements shows the same small but constant misallignment. That is good.

                                         

                                        The screenshots of the required readings is seen below

                                        Properties from Premiere Elements:

                                            

                                        I did not dare to install the MediaInfo properties readout program as I was warned about malware.

                                         

                                        Ref. #9

                                        From Movie Maker the Video bitrate is stated to be:

                                        15-12-14: 177232 kbps

                                        12-01-15: 81164   kbps

                                        16-02-15: 177396 kbps

                                        10-03-15: 280596 kbps

                                         

                                        From the above screen shots the audio bitrate seems to be 128 kbps

                                        Hope this makes sense to you.

                                        Gert

                                        • 18. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
                                          gertm4738408 Level 1

                                          For some reason the properties for 15-12-14 was left out. I ad it here.

                                          • 19. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
                                            A.T. Romano Level 7

                                            Gert

                                             

                                            Thanks for the great information from the GSpot readout.

                                             

                                            Idea...you take one of your 1080 x 720 audio out of sync into Movie Maker...when it comes time to export...Save Movie and "Create Custom

                                            Settings" and this time increase the video bitrate only slightly above what you had before and determine if that results in the audio being in sync better.

                                            Bitrate.JPG

                                            So, if you had 8000 kbps before than maybe evaluate result with 10000 kbps.

                                             

                                            More later.

                                             

                                            Thanks.

                                             

                                            ATR

                                            • 20. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
                                              A.T. Romano Level 7

                                              Gert

                                               

                                              Depending on how close you are to obtaining audio in sync product, I have a few additional ideas.

                                              But, I would be interested first in the results from last idea of increasing just the video bitrate of the Movie Maker export, and then determining

                                              if the audio in sync was better or perfect or same as before.

                                               

                                              ATR

                                              • 21. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
                                                gertm4738408 Level 1

                                                Hi' ATR

                                                 

                                                Ref.  #19:  I am new in Movie Maker and I have not succeded in finding the "Create custom settings" window. Can you advise a bit?

                                                 

                                                Gert

                                                • 22. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
                                                  A.T. Romano Level 7

                                                  Gert

                                                   

                                                  Thanks for the reply...

                                                  Movie Maker 2012

                                                   

                                                  Click on Create Custom Setting under Save Movie

                                                   

                                                  MovieMaker.jpg

                                                   

                                                  Fill in the Create Custom Settings dialog (do not forget to file in name in Name field.

                                                  I used name = My Special Project.

                                                  Save.JPG

                                                  Click Save to get the Save Custom Settings Dialog (as .wlvs). Close out of there.

                                                   

                                                  Go back to Save Movie and look for your custom setting by name "My Special Project" in the list of choices.

                                                   

                                                  My-Special.jpg

                                                   

                                                  Click on My Special Project, and, in the Save Movie dialog that opens, set the save location and name of the file (default is My Movie.mp4).

                                                   

                                                  Please let me know if you are OK with the above.

                                                   

                                                  Thanks for the follow ups.

                                                   

                                                  ATR

                                                  • 23. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
                                                    gertm4738408 Level 1

                                                    Hi' Again  ATR

                                                    Thank you very much for your interest in my problems.

                                                    The reason that i could not figure out your previous suggestion was, that i had installed version 6 instead of the 2012 version. I have done that right now and have got the following result:

                                                     

                                                    Loading one of the files, with 3 s/min compression of the video relative to the sound when loaded into  Premiere Elements, into Movie Maker 2012 I see a constant shift of the video track relative to the sound track of app. 300 ms. This is maintained when saving the video as MP4 file with a bitrate of 10000 kbps as suggested and played back using the Windows player.

                                                    Loading this MP4 file into Premiere Elements shows the same constant shift between video and sound. This is a big improvement as this shift is constant and can easily be corrected in Premiere Elements in contrast to the compressed version.

                                                    So I think my problems are solved, but I am a bit disapointed with Premiere Elements in this respect.

                                                     

                                                    Thank you so much for your help and also thanks to the other contributers in this matter.

                                                     

                                                    Best regards

                                                    Gert Munch

                                                    • 24. Re: Timing mismatch between picture and sound.
                                                      A.T. Romano Level 7

                                                      Gert Munch

                                                       

                                                      Thanks for the update. Always good news learning that you are able to move forward in your projects. And, many thanks for taking the time to look at the possible solutions.

                                                       

                                                      Premiere Elements does not fare well with variable frame rates which are recorded by some devices and which appear to relate to lighting conditions

                                                      during the recording. Movie maker may have proven the means to establish a constant frame rate to improve the situation. Usually I mention HandBrake for the purpose. MediaInfo is particularly useful to determine if our speculations about the frame rate are valid......if variable frame rate, MediaInfo shows three frame rates in its Tree View properties readout, minimum, mid one, and maximum. But, MediaInfo download usually brings along a lot of unwanted baggage and extreme care must be taken in the choices during it download and install.

                                                       

                                                      Great job in staying with and sorting through the troubleshooting to reach your success.

                                                       

                                                      Best wishes

                                                       

                                                      ATR