20 Replies Latest reply on Jun 6, 2015 4:14 PM by trshaner

    1:1 previews don't speed up library?

    nathan_h Level 1

      When I import my RAW files in LR6, I generate 1:1 previews.  And I have LR set to never delete the 1:1 previews.  My RAW cache is set to 40GB.

       

      I keep the RAW files on a USB2 drive connected to the Mac.  I keep the LR catalog and previews on an SSD in the Mac.  This is a 2012 Mac Mini with 16GB RAM.  i5 dual core processor.

       

      But in the Library module, whether I am looking at a picture I took last week or last year, the behavior is the same.  Each photo pauses to re-render a preview as I step through images in the Library.  And it happens again/further if I zoom a photo to 1:1 in the Library in loupe view.

       

      I thought that 1:1 previews were supposed to obviate the need for LR to create previews like this (sometimes taking more than 5 seconds per photo)?  I did some searching and reading here, including the knowledgebase and FAQ articles about Previews.  But the behavior described there is not what I am seeing, so simply following those instructions about generating and using 1:1 previews doesn't seem to be solving the situation for me

        • 1. Re: 1:1 previews don't speed up library?
          thedigitaldog MVP & Adobe Community Professional

          1:1 previews are supposed to speed up the process but that said, I still see a slight delay in Develop when they exist and zoom in 1:1. Perhaps just loading the data is the cause. I suspect it is still faster than having to wait for the preview to be built, then loaded.

          • 2. Re: 1:1 previews don't speed up library?
            nathan_h Level 1

            Hi,

             

            Thanks for the perspective. 

             

            Note that I am talking about the LIBRARY module.    I'm more tolerant of DEVELOP

             

            But I am not talking about a slight delay in LIBRARY.  I'm saying there is another time for me to go get a beer out of the fridge and open it (twist top) and get back to my computer BEFORE the image has shown in at 1:1 size in LIBRARY browsing, even when I have pre-generated 1:1 previews and keep my catalog on an internal SSD drive.

            • 3. Re: 1:1 previews don't speed up library?
              thedigitaldog MVP & Adobe Community Professional

              The same should apply in either module. Are you seeing it take longer in Library vs. Develop?

              Actually let me correct that after some investigation, the two use a different preview schema so it is possible Develop would be a tad slower. Outside Develop, LR uses rendered JPEGs so Develop may be a tad slower but should provide a more accurate preview.

              • 4. Re: 1:1 previews don't speed up library?
                dj_paige Level 9

                As I understand things, develop always renders a new image, the 1:1 previews really shouldn't speed up Develop.


                As far as in the Library, in Lightroom 6 I am seeing that zooming seems to take about 5 seconds for the image to render, which is different behavior than in Lightroom 5, and I'm with you, @nathan_h, I was under the impression that shouldn't be necessary if I have 1:1 previews that are never discarded. I'm seeing only a trivial slowdown going from Grid mode to Loupe Mode (not a problem), but zooming in Loupe mode is where I see the problem.

                 

                Strangely, the same image renders quickly in Develop Mode, zoomed, but much more slowly when I am in the Library and I zoom from Loupe Mode.

                • 5. Re: 1:1 previews don't speed up library?
                  trshaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                  nathan_h wrote:

                   

                  When I import my RAW files in LR6, I generate 1:1 previews.  And I have LR set to never delete the 1:1 previews.  My RAW cache is set to 40GB.

                   

                  I thought that 1:1 previews were supposed to obviate the need for LR to create previews like this (sometimes taking more than 5 seconds per photo)? 

                  Since you are working with raw files I'm going to assume you edit the images at some point in the Develop module. Once you apply or change ANY setting to an image file in the Develop module the previews are no longer valid and must be rebuilt. The best way to do this is to select ALL images in the folder after an editing session. Next in the Library module menu Library> Previews> select 'Build Standard-Sized Previews' or 'Build 1:1' Previews.' New previews will be built for only those image files that have changes applied. Those image files with up-to-date previews (i.e. no new edits) will NOT have new previews created.

                   

                  So what type of previews do you need to rebuild? If you will be using only Fit and Fill view in the Library module you should choose 'Build Standard-Sized Previews.' Just make sure your LR Catalog setting for 'Standard Preview Size is the same or larger than your monitor's horizontal resolution. The 'Auto' setting will do that automatically for you.

                  If you intend to use any of the pyramid Zoom View settings 1:16, 1:8, 1:4, 1:3, 1:2, or 1:1 then you must use 'Build 1:1' Previews, which will also rebuild the 'Standard-Sized Previews.'

                   

                  If this doesn't fix the issue please let us know. There are a few other things we can investigate.

                  • 6. Re: 1:1 previews don't speed up library?
                    nathan_h Level 1

                    Thanks for the suggestion.  My main issue is before I ever open any of the images in DEVELOP. 

                     

                    Mostly what I am hoping to achieve is a quicker way to open and zoom images in LIBRARY for culling/tagging, before I go to the DEVELOP stage.

                     

                    So while I will keep your fix in mind and use that technique for good hygiene, I actually think this won't solve my main issue, which is how slow the LIBRARY images are before I ever get to the stage of editing any in DEVELOP.

                     

                    What else can I check?

                    • 7. Re: 1:1 previews don't speed up library?
                      trshaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                      dj_paige wrote:

                      Strangely, the same image renders quickly in Develop Mode, zoomed, but much more slowly when I am in the Library and I zoom from Loupe Mode.

                      The Develop module uses a faster (less accurate) Nearest-Neighbor interploation to create the Develop module preview. This also helps to keep the slider response closer to real-time. The Library module uses a set of JPEG image files (image pyramid), which are created using a slower (more accurate) Bicubic interpolation.

                       

                      dj_paige wrote:

                      As far as in the Library, in Lightroom 6 I am seeing that zooming seems to take about 5 seconds for the image to render, which is different behavior than in Lightroom 5

                      Most likely the images have Develop module edits applied since the last 1:1 preview build.

                       

                      This issue will also occur using Fit and Fill view with the new default 'Auto' setting in the LR 6/CC Catalog settings. It is causing a different 'Standard Preview Size' to be selected than what was used in the previous LR version (LR 3, 4, 5). In my case it went from 2880 previous to 2560 Auto. Also keep in mind that if you upgrade your monitor or change this setting for any other reason the 'Standard-Size' previews are NOT automatically rebuilt. I upgraded my monitor from 1920x1080 to 2560x1440  a few months ago, and then upgraded to LR CC, so ALL of my 'Standard-Sized Previews' need to be updated.

                      • 8. Re: 1:1 previews don't speed up library?
                        trshaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                        nathan_h wrote:

                         

                        Thanks for the suggestion.  My main issue is before I ever open any of the images in DEVELOP.

                         

                        Mostly what I am hoping to achieve is a quicker way to open and zoom images in LIBRARY for culling/tagging, before I go to the DEVELOP stage.

                         

                        So while I will keep your fix in mind and use that technique for good hygiene, I actually think this won't solve my main issue, which is how slow the LIBRARY images are before I ever get to the stage of editing any in DEVELOP.

                         

                        What else can I check?

                        If you want to "zoom images" in the Library module you need to set '1:1' in the LR Import module when importing new image files.

                         

                        Also, are you waiting for all 1:1 previews to be built. That would be after the below progress bar completes and closes:

                         

                        If doing all of the above still doesn't fix the issue I suggest resetting your LR preferences file as outlined here. This fixes many issues that have an unexplained root-cause.

                         

                        http://www.lightroomforums.net/showthread.php?25197-Resetting-the-lightroom-preferences-fi le-updated

                        • 9. Re: 1:1 previews don't speed up library?
                          nathan_h Level 1

                          Okay, thanks.  Looks like I should reset the preferences file, since I have done the other steps you outline.

                           

                          I guess the good news is that the LIBRARY image presentation should not be taking as long as it is with my 1:1 previews.....  so it's not a design error or natural limitation of LR6, but a hiccup that can be corrected.

                          • 10. Re: 1:1 previews don't speed up library?
                            dj_paige Level 9

                            Regenerating 1:1 previews seems to have fixed my problem, the 1:1 view appears instantaneously now.

                            • 11. Re: 1:1 previews don't speed up library?
                              nathan_h Level 1

                              Strangely, even thought I have my import options set to generate 1:1 previews for everything, and I didn't edit stuff in the Develop module before browsing the Library, regenerating all my 1:1 previews (just for the last year so far) overnight has solved the issue for me, too!

                               

                              Seems like the import function doesn't properly or really generate 1:1 previews.  Hope someone has filed that bug!

                              • 12. Re: 1:1 previews don't speed up library?
                                trshaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                Import 1:1 Preview building works fine in LR CC for me.

                                nathan_h wrote:

                                regenerating all my 1:1 previews (just for the last year so far) overnight has solved the issue for me, too!

                                What you're saying is the 1:1 preview building in a previous LR version was not working properly, since LR 6/CC was released a little over one-month ago. I'm not aware of any 1:1 Preview building issues with previous LR versions.

                                 

                                The most likely cause is the LR 6/CC "conversion" of the previous version catalog and previews folder. It may be corrupting the Previews database and cause images to no longer register as having up-to-date previews. This could very well be due to the new 'Auto' mode that has been added for the 'Standard Size Preview' Catalog Settings and set by default. This shouldn't impact the 1:1 Previews since they are full-size previews, but they both use the same "converted" Previews database.

                                 

                                To be honest I was actually suspicious that the LR 5 upgrade caused this same issue. I was seeing a lot of preview building when browsing older images in the Library module that hadn't been edited for years (i.e. LR 1, 2, 3, 4, and now 5). I chalked it up to the fact I probably hadn't manually rebuilt 1:1 Previews after making edits to those images years ago. I'm going to rebuild the 'Standard-Sized' previews for my entire catalog. Standard-Sized previews are used for full-screen mode in the Library module, which is big enough for reviewing images. I may still build 1:1 Previews on Import for critical image review, but after that I'll only be using 1:1 in the Develop module so they won't be needed.

                                • 13. Re: 1:1 previews don't speed up library?
                                  nathan_h Level 1

                                  Well, I'm not sure if I am saying that preview building in an earlier version was broken or even incompatible with LR6.  Yes, I have been using LR since version 4, and just upgrade the catalog each time, and maybe that impacted things.  But, for example, I may have also failed to move over my previews file/db to my current hard drive when I moved my catalog to a fresh HDD a while back.

                                   

                                  But what I am saying is that for the past year, including the last few weeks with LR6, when I import RAW files from my camera, I have LR set to build 1:1 previews during the import  (and I see the status bar saying it is doing that, long after the file copy process is complete) BUT when I actually go to browse those newly imported files in the Library, it is like there are no 1:1 previews built.

                                   

                                  I had thought things were just slow.  Hence the title of this thread

                                   

                                  But now that I have forced the building of 1:1 previews (for those same RAW files that were imported with "build 1:1 previews" enabled), the previews actually load "instantly" in the Library module, including 100% zoom being "instant".

                                  • 14. Re: 1:1 previews don't speed up library?
                                    trshaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                    nathan_h wrote:

                                    But what I am saying is that for the past year, including the last few weeks with LR6, when I import RAW files from my camera, I have LR set to build 1:1 previews during the import  (and I see the status bar saying it is doing that, long after the file copy process is complete) BUT when I actually go to browse those newly imported files in the Library, it is like there are no 1:1 previews built.

                                    Did you reset the LR6 Preferences file as I suggested? There have been numerous reports of issues with LR 6/CC upgrades that have been resolved after resetting the Preferences file.

                                     

                                    If that doesn't resolve the issue you can create a new "test" catalog and Import any image folder that exhibits the problem and see if it fixes the issue. Creating a new catalog creates a new Previews folder and database and will rule them out as the cause if the problem persists.

                                    • 15. Re: 1:1 previews don't speed up library?
                                      nathan_h Level 1

                                      I haven't reset the preferences, yet.  I wanted to trouble shoot some more and find a pattern, which I have now done, successfully.

                                       

                                      I may try resetting preferences to see if that solves the import issue, which would be ideal

                                      • 16. Re: 1:1 previews don't speed up library?
                                        trshaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                        Just rename the current LR6 Preferences file with a .OLD extension. If the problem persists you can delete the new preferences file and remove the .OLD from the current file to restore it. Close LR before renaming the file. LR will automatically create a new Preferences file with the default settings. Don't change any settings until you've run an Import test with 1:1 Preview building to see if the issue is resolved.

                                         

                                        • 17. Re: 1:1 previews don't speed up library?
                                          nathan_h Level 1

                                          Thanks for the recommendation on method.  I just went the simple route and chose the startup option to kill the old preferences file.

                                           

                                          And....yes, that seems to have done the trick. Importing and generating 1:1 previews all at once appears to have started working again.

                                           

                                          Maybe not the best test, because I ALSO updated to the .1 release. 

                                           

                                          So while I cannot definitively say what solved it, I can say that it had been solved.

                                           

                                          (And to answer the original question -- yes, when they are actually generated, those 1:1 previews load "instantly" off even a traditional internal HDD.)

                                          • 18. Re: 1:1 previews don't speed up library?
                                            trshaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                            LR 6.0.1 Update is a small hot-fix to correct the F1 and Help menu URL link.

                                             

                                            Is the 1:1 Previews issue for older previously imported images that have no edits fixed as well? On my system I'm still seeing 1:1 preview building when browsing older images that have no edits. I know for a fact that those images were imported with 1:1 Preview Building selected and were not edited:. I believe one (or more) of the LR upgrades may have (silently) corrupted the Previews database.

                                             

                                            • 19. Re: 1:1 previews don't speed up library?
                                              nathan_h Level 1

                                              No, it does not appear that old 1:1 previews were "restored" via any of my actions.  I wonder if they are still taking up space in my previews file?

                                              • 20. Re: 1:1 previews don't speed up library?
                                                trshaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                If you have 'Automatically Discard 1:1 Previews' set to 'Never' then the old outdated previews are still taking up hard drive space. Also be aware that even with it set to one of the "expiring" date options the 1:1 Previews may not be deleted. See this post as to why:

                                                 

                                                Why Deleting 1:1 Previews In Lightroom Doesn't Reduce Preview File Size - Lightroom Fanatic

                                                 

                                                If you've got plenty of hard drive space I wouldn't worry about it.

                                                 

                                                If you want to delete them change your Catalog Settings> Standard Preview Size to the lowest setting (1024 pixels), close LR, and then reopen LR to load the new setting. Select the folder(s) you want to delete the 1:1 Previews from and go to menu Library> Previews> Discard 1:1 Previews and select 'Discard All.' When done set your Standard Preview Size back to 'Auto' and then select 'Build 1:1 Previews, 'Build Standard-Sized Previews,' or do nothing and build the previews as required. Just be aware it can take a long time to build 1:1 Previews. On my system with 21Mp raw files it takes about 5 sec. or ~1.5 hours per 1,000 image files. Unless you have a need to go back and review those images at 1:1 Zoom view in the Library module I would rebuild just the Standard-Size Previews.