18 Replies Latest reply on Aug 12, 2015 12:32 PM by rob day

    Imposing a file InDesign CC 2015?

    kcrossley Level 1

      I'm working on some short fold 4-color business cards. The unfolded size is 5.5" x 2". My printer would like me to setup the file so there are 14 cards on a 12" x 18" sheet. Apparently, their system is changing my screen build colors when they attempt to do it themselves with the printable PDF I supplied.

       

      Is there and easy way to do this? Also, how does one add crop marks to multiple art on a single page? BTW, each business card will bleed four sides.

       

      Thanks!

        • 1. Re: Imposing a file InDesign CC 2015?
          BobLevine MVP & Adobe Community Professional

          Create the 12x18 document, place the PDF with crop marks and use step and repeat.

           

           

           

          The easier way would be to find a printer that do this. Assuming the PDF was created properly, It’s their job, not yours.

          • 2. Re: Imposing a file InDesign CC 2015?
            kcrossley Level 1

            BobLevine wrote:

             

            The easier way would be to find a printer that do this. Assuming the PDF was created properly, It’s their job, not yours.

            Yeah, I know. It's a weird color problem that's being cause by the Canon RIP. They haven't been able to figure out why it's happening, yet. But these are good people so I don't mind.

            • 3. Re: Imposing a file InDesign CC 2015?
              BobLevine MVP & Adobe Community Professional

              Fair enough. Hopefully you get it straightened out.

              • 4. Re: Imposing a file InDesign CC 2015?
                Jeffrey_Smith Most Valuable Participant

                Apparently, their system is changing my screen build colors when they attempt to do it themselves with the printable PDF I supplied.

                Any chance the PDF contains spot colors. The DFE on the Canon could have a spot color library. And if present in a PDF, the DFE will use the 4C mix in the color library, as opposed to the mix in the file.

                • 5. Re: Imposing a file InDesign CC 2015?
                  rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                  Is your PDF DeviceCMYK—no profiles included, i.e. PDF/X-1a? Changing CMYK values usually means there's a profile conflict.

                  • 6. Re: Imposing a file InDesign CC 2015?
                    kcrossley Level 1

                    Rob, thanks for your response. Sorry for the delay in getting back to you. I've attached a copy of the PDF preset another printer provided me with. Does anything look out of sorts to you?

                     

                    http://idealynx.com/files/pdf_summary.txt

                    • 7. Re: Imposing a file InDesign CC 2015?
                      rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                      Does anything look out of sorts to you?

                       

                      Output

                        Color Conversion: No Color Conversion

                        Destination: Document RGB

                        Profile Inclusion Policy: Don't Include Profiles

                       

                      If you are trying to export your document's CMYK values unchanged, then setting the Output>Destination to Document RGB would be a problem—but if Color Conversion is set to No Color Conversion you can't set a destination, so the preset you linked isn't really possible.

                       

                      On your end all you can do is export CMYK values with no profile, which will show as DeviceCMYK in Acrobat. So if you only use CMYK colors in your document, then No Color Conversion and Don't Include Profiles works. Convert to Destination with the Destination set as Document CMYK also works, and the standardized PDF/X-1a or PDF/X-4 presets export document CMYK colors as DeviceCMYK.

                       

                      You can check your exported colors in AcrobatPro via Output Preview>Preview>Object Inspector by clicking on an object. Keep in mind Preview>Separations is a simulation so it doesn't tell you the actual color space and values—you have to use Object Inspector.

                       

                      If you check your PDF and confirm that the colors are DeviceCMYK, you know the colors are getting converted at the printer.

                       

                      Here is a 50% black fill exported as PDF/X-4 sampled via Object Inspector:

                       

                      Screen Shot 2015-08-12 at 9.45.55 AM.png

                      • 8. Re: Imposing a file InDesign CC 2015?
                        rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                        In Acrobat's Output Preview you can also filter by color space:

                         

                        So Show: All shows an RGB image along with the DeviceCMYK box:

                        Screen Shot 2015-08-12 at 10.02.42 AM.png

                         

                        DeviceCMYK hides the RGB image:

                         

                        Screen Shot 2015-08-12 at 10.02.50 AM.png

                        • 9. Re: Imposing a file InDesign CC 2015?
                          kcrossley Level 1

                          rob day wrote:

                           

                          Does anything look out of sorts to you?

                           

                          Output

                            Color Conversion: No Color Conversion

                            Destination: Document RGB

                            Profile Inclusion Policy: Don't Include Profiles

                           

                           

                          I see what you mean. Then would I be better off using InDesign's built-in Press Quality preset? And would I need to change the Destination Document CMYK to US Sheetfed Coated v2?

                           

                          Output

                              Color Conversion: Convert to Destination (Preserve Numbers)

                              Destination: Document CMYK - U.S. Web Coated (SWOP) v2

                              Profile Inclusion Policy: Don't Include Profiles

                          • 10. Re: Imposing a file InDesign CC 2015?
                            rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                            Then would I be better off using InDesign's built-in Press Quality preset? And would I need to change the Destination Document CMYK to US Sheetfed Coated v2?

                            All that matters is that you choose Document CMYK and Don't Include Profiles—Document CMYK isn't necessarily US Coated SWOP, it's whatever profile is assigned to the document. When the Destination is Document CMYK the Color Conversion choice can be anything Convert to Destination (Preserve Numbers) and Convert to Destination would produce the same result.

                             

                            But I would still check the PDF you sent out and had trouble with. If everything in the PDF is DeviceCMYK then you know the value changes are happening at the printer. If they place your PDF and step and repeat in a new InDesign document, then they have to watch out for profile conflicts when they export or print.

                            • 11. Re: Imposing a file InDesign CC 2015?
                              kcrossley Level 1

                              Where can I find that information in Adobe Acrobat Pro DC?

                              • 12. Re: Imposing a file InDesign CC 2015?
                                rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                View>Tools>Print Production click on Output Preview in the sidebar.

                                • 13. Re: Imposing a file InDesign CC 2015?
                                  kcrossley Level 1

                                  Here's what I get using the PDF Preset I posted a link to, which is weird because this is different than the preset specs.

                                   

                                  Simulation: US WEB Coated (SWOP) v2

                                  Transparency Color Blending Space: DeviceCMYK

                                  • 14. Re: Imposing a file InDesign CC 2015?
                                    rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                    If you set the Preview popup to Separations, you are not necessarily seeing the object's actual values—the Separation Preview is a Simulation and not the document's real values. You have to set the Preview popup to Object Inspector and click the object (see #7). If you are seeing something other than DeviceCMYK then the PDF includes profiles.

                                    • 15. Re: Imposing a file InDesign CC 2015?
                                      kcrossley Level 1

                                      Here's what I get. BTW, what app are you using for screen captures?

                                       

                                      Screen Shot 2015-08-12 at 1.40.58 PM.png

                                      • 16. Re: Imposing a file InDesign CC 2015?
                                        rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                        You have an RGB image with no profile (DeviceRGB), which means the export was No Conversion, No Profile.

                                         

                                        You never want DeviceRGB because it will have to be converted to CMYK somewhere and now it has no source profile-- it's appearance could be anything. If you really want no conversion use PDF/X-4. If you want to send all CMYK use X-4  and convert to Document CMYK. X-1A will also force all CMYK and flatten transparency

                                         

                                        I usually use OSX's screen capture. Sometime SnapZpro if I want capture he cursor.

                                        • 17. Re: Imposing a file InDesign CC 2015?
                                          kcrossley Level 1

                                          So, clearly the printer provided me with a PDF preset that could be part of the problem.

                                           

                                          So what do you recommend? Should I simply use the built-in Print Quality PDF and then make adjusts for bleeds and printer marks.

                                          http://idealynx.com/files/pdf_summary_print_quality.txt

                                          • 18. Re: Imposing a file InDesign CC 2015?
                                            rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                            So what do you recommend?

                                             

                                            Assign the correct CMYK press profile to your document and use PDF/X-4.

                                             

                                            If you want to force all color to CMYK on export, set Document CMYK as the Output Destination.

                                             

                                            If you want to flatten transparency on export then use PDF/X-1a again using Document CMYK as the Destination profile.