13 Replies Latest reply on Nov 12, 2015 1:48 PM by symmetricalMan

    How to modify the style of breadcrumbs - RoboHelp 11 won't behave?

    symmetricalMan Level 1

      Short version: Breadcrumbs in CHM files do not display the styles I've configured in RH.

       

      Long version:

       

      • Am running RH11.
      • Working in an HTML project, generating a CHM for output.
      • I have a Master Page for the project, in which I have generated a breadcrumb placeholder. I removed the formatting code from the placeholder, so what I have left looks like this:
        • <?rh-placeholder type="breadcrumbs" ph-align="0" sep-char="&gt;" home="Home" usetopicformat="0" ph-style="" ?>

       

      • This Master Page refers to the default CSS file: <link rel="StyleSheet" href="default.css" type="text/css" />
      • Each topic uses this Master Page.
      • Via the Project Manager, I double-click the default.css file in order to modify the appearance of the breadcrumbs. I make changes via these settings:
        Styles.gif
      • Upon saving this, RH places the following code into the default.css file. *Note (below) that it fails to specify the font I've selected - odd.

      a.breadcrumbs:link {

        font-size: 8pt;

        color: #808080;

      }

      a.breadcrumbs:visited {

        font-size: 8pt;

        color: #808080;

      }

      a.breadcrumbs:focus {

        font-size: 8pt;

        color: #808080;

      }

      a.breadcrumbs:hover {

        font-size: 8pt;

      }

      a.breadcrumbs:active {

        font-size: 8pt;

        color: #808080;

      }

       

      Issue: Upon generating the CHM file, the breadcrumbs are present and functional, which suggests to me that the Master Page is being administered correctly. However, none of the style settings I've specified for breadcrumbs get applied. Instead, the breadcrumbs adopt the same styling as the 'normal' style, as if to suggest that the breadcrumb style definitions in the default.css are being ignored. Note that if I manually-modify other styles within the default.css, such as the 'p' style, the changes are reflected in the output - i.e. I'm satisfied that I'm tweaking the correct css file. ...so why don't my breadcrumbs adopt the style(s) I've specified?

        • 1. Re: How to modify the style of breadcrumbs - RoboHelp 11 won't behave?
          Captiv8r Adobe Community Professional & MVP

          Hi there

           

          Can you double-click the Single Source Layout recipe and share a screen capture of the dialog?

           

          Thanks... Rick

          • 2. Re: How to modify the style of breadcrumbs - RoboHelp 11 won't behave?
            symmetricalMan Level 1

            As requested. Thanks.

            Note however, that I've been playing with these settings, and what you see here is the latest 'fumbling' where I'm applying the default.css to all topics. I've also tried combinations of applying the Master Page to all topics, or where I choose to not apply either of these options.

             

            An aside: I'm a bit confused as to why there are multiple mechanisms for applying a css and/or Master Page i.e. I can apply a Master Page to all topics from here, but why would I when each page is already using the Master Page as a template (which itself references the default.css for its styles).

            Untitled-1.gif

            • 3. Re: How to modify the style of breadcrumbs - RoboHelp 11 won't behave?
              Captiv8r Adobe Community Professional & MVP

              Thanks for the screen shot,

               

              As for the reason there is more than one way to apply a master page, I think it is because RoboHelp may be used in different ways. For example, I've been using RoboHelp for more than 20 years. In all that time I've only ever used the RoboHelp application itself to create and edit my content.

               

              But I'm aware that in recent years, Adobe acquired RoboHelp and now RoboHelp is offered in a package called the "Technical Communication Suite" and that package also includes another Adobe product known as FrameMaker. I believe FrameMaker had no ability to create on-line help and relied on third party applications to handle that aspect. I believe one such application was called "WebWorks". But when Adobe acquired RoboHelp and packaged it up with FrameMaker, there are now authors that do all their editing in FrameMaker and just use RoboHelp as a conduit for creating on-line outputs. So these folks would likely be very interested in configuring a Master Page or CSS at the time they generate from RoboHelp.

               

              So the question remains, if you disable that "apply to all topics" by clearing the check box, do the breadcrumbs finally adhere to what you want?

               

              Cheers... Rick

              • 4. Re: How to modify the style of breadcrumbs - RoboHelp 11 won't behave?
                symmetricalMan Level 1

                Thanks for the explanation.

                 

                Re the check box, once cleared, the result is this:

                Untitled-1.gif

                Notice that the 'Home' link does in fact reflect the style definition I've asked for (8pt Calibri), but the remaining links reflect the style(s) used in the body of the topic (10pt Calibri), as if the style definition I'm using for links with my topic content is overriding the breadcrumbs style.

                • 5. Re: How to modify the style of breadcrumbs - RoboHelp 11 won't behave?
                  Amebr Level 4

                  I think you need to set the breadcrumbs to use the topic style. So in the Breadcrumb Options dialog box, tick the Use Style from Topic checkbox.

                  • 6. Re: How to modify the style of breadcrumbs - RoboHelp 11 won't behave?
                    symmetricalMan Level 1

                    Thanks for your suggestion, but I'm confused about it.

                    If I tick the Use Style from Topic check box, which style from the topic will the breadcrumbs use?

                    ...and I'm not sure why I'd want it to do that anyhow, when what I'm trying to do is have the breadcrumbs use a specific style definition that is not used in the topic.

                     

                    As it happens, I've tried ticking this box before, and from what I can tell, all it does is change the breadcrumb placeholder code in my Master Page from

                    <?rh-placeholder type="breadcrumbs" ph-align="0" usetopicformat="1" home="Home"  sep-char="&gt;" ?>

                    to

                    <?rh-placeholder type="breadcrumbs" ph-align="0" usetopicformat="1" home="Home" sep-char="&gt;" ph-style="font-weight: normal;font-style: normal;text-decoration: none;" ?>

                    And the end result is the same regardless (see my previous post for an example of the resulting breadcrumb appearance).

                     

                    Thanks, but this hasn't resolved the issue for me.

                    • 7. Re: How to modify the style of breadcrumbs - RoboHelp 11 won't behave?
                      Amebr Level 4

                      It should use the breadcrumb styles you defined in the stylesheet applied to the topic (whether that's on the topic specifically, or defined for the whole project).

                       

                      My setup:

                      Topic: masterpage assigned. stylesheet not assigned

                      Master page: stylesheet not assigned, breadcrumbs using style in topic

                      SSL: Apply to all topics set to the css I defined the breadcrumbs in.

                       

                      Also, to style the non-link breadcrumb text, you need to set the breadcrumbs style in the Paragraph section of the Styles dialog box.

                       

                      DarkandStormy.png

                       

                      Hope that helps

                       

                      (Hmm, although I just noticed that this time some of the breadcrumb links took the p font, rather than the a font. weird...)

                      • 8. Re: How to modify the style of breadcrumbs - RoboHelp 11 won't behave?
                        symmetricalMan Level 1

                        Re your setup: when I apply those settings to my project, all custom styles are removed from the project itself, leaving only the default RH styles in place. This means I have work 'blind', only seeing the styles applied when I compile the CHM file. Is this correct? ...not sure I like it too much. Regardless, I seem to get the same output anyhow, which leads me to...

                         

                        Re your example: lol uh-huh yep. I'm glad it's happening to you too, sort-of.

                         

                        *I'm still trying variations of your setup. Will report back.

                        • 9. Re: How to modify the style of breadcrumbs - RoboHelp 11 won't behave?
                          Captiv8r Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                          Hi there

                           

                          Out of curiosity, why are you modifying the Master Page to remove the formatting of the breadcrumbs?

                           

                          I tried configuring the font using the placeholder and it sailed on into my CHM file with no issues. I tested using Comic Sans.

                           

                          Cheers... Rick

                          • 10. Re: How to modify the style of breadcrumbs - RoboHelp 11 won't behave?
                            symmetricalMan Level 1

                            Out of curiosity, why are you modifying the Master Page to remove the formatting of the breadcrumbs?

                             

                            I tried configuring the font using the placeholder and it sailed on into my CHM file with no issues. I tested using Comic Sans.

                             

                             

                            Just to see if it would make any difference to the output.

                            Configuring the font using the placeholder? More detail please.

                            • 11. Re: How to modify the style of breadcrumbs - RoboHelp 11 won't behave?
                              Amebr Level 4

                              If you apply the stylesheet to the topics as well, that should also work and you'll be able to see your styles as you edit. I wasn't sure from your description how your topic was set up, so I just tried the least configuration.

                              I figured out why the second and third links aren't styled. In chm output, the class 'breadcrumbs' is only applied to the first link, whereas in the multiscreen output, the class is applied to all styles.

                              • 12. Re: How to modify the style of breadcrumbs - RoboHelp 11 won't behave?
                                Captiv8r Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                I'm assuming that you created a Master Page, then inserted a Breadcrumbs Placeholder into that. So your editor would look like this:

                                 

                                tmp1.png

                                And if you double-click the placeholder you should see this dialog allowing you to configure the Breadcrumbs.

                                 

                                tmp2.png

                                 

                                That dialog is what I'm referring to. Seems that if I choose the font and font size there, RoboHelp fully respects what I've selected and it ends up looking as I hoped in the CHM file.

                                 

                                tmp3.png

                                 

                                Cheers... Rick

                                • 13. Re: How to modify the style of breadcrumbs - RoboHelp 11 won't behave?
                                  symmetricalMan Level 1

                                  Many thanks, people. With your suggestions, I've managed to resolve this.

                                   

                                  Here's what I did:

                                  (being thorough for the sake of anyone dropping in)

                                  1. Make a backup of the default.css.
                                  2. Open default.css in an external text editor.
                                  3. Erase all the style definitions from it.

                                   

                                  Then, in RoboHelp;

                                  1. Open the Master Page, and delete the breadcrumbs placeholder from within in.
                                  2. With the Master Page still open, add a new breadcrumbs placeholder, ensuring that the Use Style from Topic check box is ticked. Ignore all other settings.
                                  3. Click the breadcrumbs placeholder, so it's selected. Then, locate the "breadcrumbs" style in the Style and Formatting pod, right-click it, and select Edit. Define the style you want for your breadcrumbs. I'm not sure if this step was necessary.
                                  4. Switch to HTML view (of the Master Page) and manually modify the breadcrumb's style definition (I needed to change the font type and size for my project). I'm not sure if this step was necessary either.
                                  5. Within the Project Set-up pod, locate and right-click the Master Page in question, and select Properties.
                                  6. Within the Properties window, select the Appearance tab, and ensure that the default.css is the selected style sheet.
                                  7. Open the Topic List pod, select all topics, right-click the list, and click Properties.
                                  8. Within the Properties window, select the Appearance tab, and ensure that None is selected. Click Apply. It may take a moment for RH to apply this setting to all your topics. This ensures that none of the topics are directly influenced by a style sheet.
                                  9. Within the Properties window, select the General tab, and ensure that the Master Page drop-down list displays the master page you edited earlier. Click Apply. It may take a moment for RH to apply this setting to all your topics. This ensures that every topic is based on the Master Page, and hence, by proxy, any style sheet that the Master Page is associated with.
                                  10. Within the Properties window, select the Appearance tab again. Notice that the selected style sheet now reads default.css*, despite having just specified that we wanted no style sheet selected. The * here indicates that the default.css style is being applied, but indirectly, via the Master Page we applied to all the topics.
                                  11. Click OK on the Topic Properties window. Again, it may take a moment for RH to apply this to all your topics. Note that because I deleted all the style definitions from my default.css, each topic in my project (and the Master Page itself) now displays the default styling of RH i.e. it has no other style definitions to work with - it's reading an empty style guide.

                                    Now to build the styles...


                                  12. Open default.css in an external text editor.
                                  13. Open the backup default.css you made at the start.
                                  14. Copy from the backup to the default.css each style you want to use in your project. I copied over all the styles I wanted to use, and ignored all the others (styles I wasn't using in this project). As you copy the styles over, save the default.css, and flick back over to RH, and you should see your saved style definition(s) being added to the Style and Formatting pod.

                                   

                                  Then, I had to do a little manual tweaking of the breadcrumbs style definitions in the default.css, using the text editor. For my needs, my breadcrumbs work, based on these definitions:

                                   

                                  a.breadcrumbs:link {

                                    font-size: 8pt;

                                    color: #808080;

                                  }

                                  a.breadcrumbs:visited {

                                    font-size: 8pt;

                                    color: #808080;

                                  }

                                  a.breadcrumbs:focus {

                                    font-size: 8pt;

                                    color: #808080;

                                  }

                                  a.breadcrumbs:hover {

                                    font-size: 8pt;

                                  }

                                  a.breadcrumbs:active {

                                    font-size: 8pt;

                                    color: #808080;

                                  }

                                  p.breadcrumbs {

                                    font-size: 8pt;

                                  }

                                   

                                   

                                  Thanks again, people.

                                  Have I missed anything?

                                   

                                  ...sorry, am running out the door.