12 Replies Latest reply on Feb 25, 2009 4:08 AM by ageofem

    Fireworks or Photoshop?

    worxxx Level 1
      In our team, until now all Website - Prototyping is done solely in Photoshop (I am not the designer, but the project manager) We have no experience in Fireworks at all, everything is done in photoshop only. On the other hand, to me it looks like as if prototyping in photoshop is very slow and we are wasting a lot of time here - when reseraching i found fireworks and i think we could safe heaps of time using it, so i am thinking about making this the new tool of choice for our team - both for me (mockups) as well as for our designers. What i don't quite understand is if we make all the hard work of putting together a really nice layout in fireworks, do we later on still throw it all away and start all over in photoshop in order to create teh "real" webdesign - or do you guys have ways of using whatever you've created in Fireworks in order to get the html / css code for your project?

      i hope this makes sense and i would appreciate any practical advise
        • 1. Re: Fireworks or Photoshop?
          Level 7
          Do all of your layout work in FW. Slice your design and export the images.
          Build the page with its images in DW. Don't even think of using FW or PS to
          export HTML. The result is OK for prototyping but never for production.

          Taking a Fireworks comp to a CSS-based layout in Dreamweaver
          http://www.adobe.com/devnet/fireworks/articles/web_standards_layouts_pt1.html
          http://www.adobe.com/devnet/fireworks/articles/web_standards_layouts_pt2.html


          --
          Murray --- ICQ 71997575
          Adobe Community Expert
          (If you *MUST* email me, don't LAUGH when you do so!)
          ==================
          http://www.projectseven.com/go - DW FAQs, Tutorials & Resources
          http://www.dwfaq.com - DW FAQs, Tutorials & Resources
          ==================


          "worxxx" <webforumsuser@macromedia.com> wrote in message
          news:gmrn9t$gi1$1@forums.macromedia.com...
          > In our team, until now all Website - Prototyping is done solely in
          > Photoshop (I
          > am not the designer, but the project manager) We have no experience in
          > Fireworks at all, and I kind of feel that our designers are not keen on
          > changing the way they are used to work - photoshop only. On teh other
          > hand, to
          > me it looks like as if prototyping in photoshop is soooo slow and we are
          > wasting a lot of time here - when reseraching i found fireworks and i
          > think we
          > could safe heapy of time using it, so i am thinking about making this the
          > new
          > tool of choice for our team - both for me (mockups) as well as for our
          > designers. What i don't quite understand is if we make all teh hard work
          > of
          > putting together a really nice layout in fireworks, do we later on still
          > throw
          > it all away and start all over in photoshop in order to create teh "real"
          > webdesign - or do you guys have ways of using whatever you've created in
          > Fireworks in order to get the html / css code for your project?
          >
          > i hope this makes sense and i would appreciate any practical advise
          >

          • 2. Re: Fireworks or Photoshop?
            Paevo Kelley Level 2
            I can't imagine anything more hellish than prototyping in PS. FW is much more intuitive and gives you far greater control over everything (no more endless rummaging around in the layers palette--just point and click). You'll be able to whip out a prototype in no time. I use PS as a photo manipulation tool and repository of artsy-fartsy artwork in the form of brushes, actions, etc. But import everything into FW during the prototyping process...
            • 3. Re: Fireworks or Photoshop?
              Level 7
              worxxx wrote:
              > In our team, until now all Website - Prototyping is done solely in Photoshop (I
              > am not the designer, but the project manager) We have no experience in
              > Fireworks at all, and I kind of feel that our designers are not keen on
              > changing the way they are used to work - photoshop only. On teh other hand, to
              > me it looks like as if prototyping in photoshop is soooo slow and we are
              > wasting a lot of time here - when reseraching i found fireworks and i think we
              > could safe heapy of time using it, so i am thinking about making this the new
              > tool of choice for our team - both for me (mockups) as well as for our
              > designers. What i don't quite understand is if we make all teh hard work of
              > putting together a really nice layout in fireworks, do we later on still throw
              > it all away and start all over in photoshop in order to create teh "real"
              > webdesign - or do you guys have ways of using whatever you've created in
              > Fireworks in order to get the html / css code for your project?
              >
              > i hope this makes sense and i would appreciate any practical advise
              >
              I've taught college students and industry people on how to use Fireworks
              as a design and prototyping tool. Many of the industry people have a
              PS or AI background and they are generally amazed at how quickly they
              can put together a page design using Fireworks, compared to PS or AI.

              As Murray said, do your image work in FW and use a text or web editor to
              assemble the HTML. FW HTML is fine for prototypes and for checking
              things like visually feedback and ease of use, but the code is far too
              rigid and clunky for production sites.

              The one ray of light is the new CSS and Images export feature, but it's
              new in CS4, and has some issues.

              Here are some worthwhile articles to read on the subject:

              Industry Trends in Prototyping
              http://www.adobe.com/devnet/fireworks/articles/cooper_prototyping.html

              Creating Standards-Compliant Web Deisgns in Fireworks CS4
              http://www.adobe.com/devnet/fireworks/articles/standards_compliant_design.html

              Designing Interactive Products with Fireworks
              http://www.adobe.com/devnet/fireworks/articles/cooper_interactive.html

              HTH



              --
              Jim Babbage - .:Community MX:. & .:Adobe Community Expert:.
              http://www.communityMX.com/
              ---
              .:Adobe Community Expert for Fireworks:.
              http://www.adobe.com/communities/experts/members/206.html
              ---
              • 4. Re: Fireworks or Photoshop?
                JoeDaSilva Level 4
                I agree with pretty much everything stated here. If I couldn't use Fireworks for my layout design I'd use Illustrator as the primary tool before I'd use Photoshop. Things have been tacked on to Photoshop to make web design more efficient, but Fireworks was built from the ground up with this purpose in mind.
                • 5. Re: Fireworks or Photoshop?
                  Old Jag
                  We've got a standard library with all the common items we use in interface design as library items. Since we're strictly in-house, everything is done to company standard colors, fonts, look and feel, etc. In addition, each library item has several states ascribed to it so we can change a set of radio buttons or checkboxes from inactive to active or selected to deselected with a simple click.
                  • 6. Re: Fireworks or Photoshop?
                    Panos Zygopoulos Level 3
                    Whether you change to Fireworks from Photoshop or staying with Photoshop, is your decision. Usually i see designers that are having a hard time to make a change like this, because they stick to what they have used to work with. It's really hard to change.
                    Generally i think Fireworks is the number one program for web design, especially after CS4 came out. Exporting CSS ia a fantastic new add which makes a big difference from the past.

                    Murray *ACE* wrote:
                    Do all of your layout work in FW. Slice your design and export the images.
                    Build the page with its images in DW. Don't even think of using FW or PS to
                    export HTML. The result is OK for prototyping but never for production

                    Taking a Fireworks comp to a CSS-based layout in Dreamweaver
                    http://www.adobe.com/devnet/fireworks/articles/web_standards_layouts_pt1.html
                    http://www.adobe.com/devnet/fireworks/articles/web_standards_layouts_pt2.html


                    I read the articles, but did not see where the actual disadvantage of exporting html from Fireworks is. Actually constructing div tags into Dreamweaver can be really time consuming. Besides the article is more about creating a css layout in Dreamweaver and adding images edited in Fireworks, and less about not exporting HTML with Fireworks.
                    • 8. Re: Fireworks or Photoshop?
                      Level 7
                      > Besides the article is more about
                      > creating a css layout in Dreamweaver and adding images edited in
                      > Fireworks, and
                      > less about not exporting HTML with Fireworks.

                      That's exactly the point of the articles. Use FW to produce your images.
                      Use DW to build your page from those images. Don't use FW HTML.

                      --
                      Murray --- ICQ 71997575
                      Adobe Community Expert
                      (If you *MUST* email me, don't LAUGH when you do so!)
                      ==================
                      http://www.projectseven.com/go - DW FAQs, Tutorials & Resources
                      http://www.dwfaq.com - DW FAQs, Tutorials & Resources
                      ==================


                      "pano_r" <webforumsuser@macromedia.com> wrote in message
                      news:gnahmt$9j4$1@forums.macromedia.com...
                      > Whether you change to Fireworks from Photoshop or staying with Photoshop,
                      > is
                      > your decision. Usually i see designers that are having a hard time to make
                      > a
                      > change like this, because they stick to what they have used to work with.
                      > It's
                      > really hard to change.
                      > Generally i think Fireworks is the number one program for web design,
                      > especially after CS4 came out. Exporting CSS ia a fantastic new add which
                      > makes
                      > a big difference from the past.
                      >
                      > Murray *ACE* wrote:
                      > Do all of your layout work in FW. Slice your design and export the images.
                      > Build the page with its images in DW. Don't even think of using FW or PS
                      > to
                      > export HTML. The result is OK for prototyping but never for production
                      >
                      > Taking a Fireworks comp to a CSS-based layout in Dreamweaver
                      > http://www.adobe.com/devnet/fireworks/articles/web_standards_layouts_pt1.html
                      > http://www.adobe.com/devnet/fireworks/articles/web_standards_layouts_pt2.html
                      >
                      >
                      > I read the articles, but did not see where the actual disadvantage of
                      > exporting html from Fireworks is. Actually constructing div tags into
                      > Dreamweaver can be really time consuming. Besides the article is more
                      > about
                      > creating a css layout in Dreamweaver and adding images edited in
                      > Fireworks, and
                      > less about not exporting HTML with Fireworks.
                      >

                      • 9. Re: Fireworks or Photoshop?
                        Panos Zygopoulos Level 3
                        Anyway, i'm really interested in that.
                        Why is fireworks OK for prototyping but not for production?

                        What is wrong to html code exported by fireworks?
                        Any related articles-links?

                        • 10. Re: Fireworks or Photoshop?
                          Level 7
                          pano_r wrote:
                          > Anyway, i'm really interested in that.
                          > Why is fireworks OK for prototyping but not for production?
                          >
                          > What is wrong to html code exported by fireworks?
                          > Any related articles-links?
                          >
                          >
                          Fireworks HTML and Image export produces a rigid table-based design made
                          completely of images. No real text and usually far more image slices
                          than an actual web site needs.

                          The new CS4 CSS and Image Export is a step in the right direction but
                          the feature is in its early stages. You'll get more usable and editable
                          mark up from this type of export but it stil needs a lot of tweaking
                          within Dreamweaver.

                          --
                          Jim Babbage - .:Community MX:. & .:Adobe Community Expert:.
                          http://www.communityMX.com/
                          ---
                          .:Adobe Community Expert for Fireworks:.
                          http://www.adobe.com/communities/experts/members/206.html
                          ---
                          • 11. Re: Fireworks or Photoshop?
                            Panos Zygopoulos Level 3
                            thank you very much
                            • 12. Re: Fireworks or Photoshop?
                              ageofem Level 1
                              As long as your websites dont require complex layouts / brushes then fireworks wont be a problem. Photoshop has an extensive list of 3rd party plugin / standard plugins in which fireworks does not have. But I think things can be done in fireworks, ive seen ps tutorials being converted into fireworks.