11 Replies Latest reply on Dec 13, 2015 12:55 PM by carls1

    Handling of JPEG metadata during export

    carls1

      Good morning all -

       

      I normally work with raw photos in LR.  However, I have a series of JPEG photos taken with a GoPro that I would like to edit.  In doing some research, I understand how LR writes edits to the metadata of the original JPEG - thereby offering nondestructive editing of JPEG files.  This works great as I can really treat a JPEG as I would any of my raw photos.

       

      Where I get confused is when I try to export the file for a use other than being opened in LR.  I go through and export as JPEG just as I would with a raw file, and create a new file (example GOPR10001_edited.jpg).  However, when I view the recently exported file in LR, shouldn't the edit sliders be zeroed? (because my LR edits should have been incorporated into the new JPEG instead of applied via metadata)  I guess what I'm trying to confirm is that the edits will appear when the new file is opened with a non Adobe piece of software.  It appears to me that the export feature is simply making a duplicate copy of the original JPEG. 


      Can anyone clarify the operation for me?


      Thanks,

       

      Carl

        • 1. Re: Handling of JPEG metadata during export
          Mrinmay Majhi Adobe Employee

          Hi Carl,

           

          Greeting!!!

           

          While exporting the images from Lightroom, it applies all the settings you provide in the export dialog box and creates new files in the destination folder location.

          Refer : How to export photos from Photoshop Lightroom

           

          Once the export is completed, the images are still available in the catalog for you to continue editing and further.

          After export, Lightroom does not resets the changes in the catalog.

           

          Also, on your computer, you will find two versions of image files :

          > Non Edited (Original) Images

          > Edited (Exported) Images

           

          Hope this helps.

           

          ~Mrinmay

          • 2. Re: Handling of JPEG metadata during export
            carls1 Level 1

            Thank you Mrinmay -

             

            I am able to observe everything that you are saying.  However, if LR is actually applying my settings to the image pixels themselves, shouldn't the sliders reset rather than reading image corrections from metadata?  As an example, if I open the exported image in Photoshop, and then exit WITHOUT saving, I get the following dialogue asking me which metadata settings to use.  Now if I click "Overwrite Settings", the sliders go back to the positions that I had set them in prior to export.  If I select "Import Settings from Disk" the sliders zero out and the image loads as I would have expected it to.  Keep in mind, this dialogue appears even though my Photoshop changes were not saved.  There is something funny going on with the metadata.  And by funny - I mean that I simply don't understand what is happening.

             

            Thanks anyone for additional clarification,

             

            Carl

             

            Capture.JPG

            • 3. Re: Handling of JPEG metadata during export
              carls1 Level 1

              And as a follow up - when I export a raw image to JPEG using my normal workflow, the sliders all zero (in the newly exported JPEG) rather than keeping any adjustments that I had made to the raw file - which is exactly what I would expect since the changes have been written into the JPEG itself.

              Capture.JPG

              • 4. Re: Handling of JPEG metadata during export
                ssprengel Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                There are several loose ends in what you're saying that make it hard to understand exactly what you're seeing and whether it's just a misunderstanding of what you should see or if something incorrect is occurring...

                 

                In your first post you say "shouldn't the sliders be zeroed?" of the exported (_edited suffix) version of the jpg.  This implies that they are not zeroed but you don't actually say this.  The only specific example of metadata being changed is the LR popup.  If the sliders are not zero in the exported jpg then are they the same as the original jpg you exported from or are they something else non-zero?

                 

                In your first post you say "when I try to export the file for a use other than being opened in LR".  This implies that you open exported JPGs in LR.  By "exported jpgs" do you mean the master photo that you export from or the jpg that is the result of the export, that would have an _edited suffix by what you say in another sentence?  If the latter, do you have both the master photo and the export result image imported into LR?  What purpose do you reimport the exported result for?

                 

                If you open these exported jpgs in PS, does the Camera Raw plug-in open in the way into PS or not?  How are you opening the jpgs in PS, are you using LR's Edit in PS or are you opening Bridge or PS on the folder with the JPGs and use Open without initiating PS from LR?

                 

                What are your Treat JPGs like Raw Files settings in PS Preferences: Never, jpgs with Settings, or All jpgs?

                 

                The general answer to your question is that the jpgs that result from exporting a raw file or a jpg from LR should act similar, and it should be possible to explain what is occurring with enough specific detail of what you're doing and what you're seeing.

                • 5. Re: Handling of JPEG metadata during export
                  carls1 Level 1

                  ssprengel,

                   

                  In typing a response to your questions, I think that I'm answering most of my issues...

                   

                  After exporting (I use separate folders - "Capture" and "Export" to house my files), I wanted to view the new files for comparison to the originals (since I've never really done much non-raw work with LR before).  Exported files don't automatically appear in the catalog so I have to use the "Synchronize Folder" command to get them to appear.

                   

                  When I view any of the exported images (_edited suffix) in the Develop module, it appears that only the tone control sliders are zeroed.  The Tone Curve and Detail sliders are exactly as I had left them in the original image.  Sidenote:  When I made the original post, I did not realize that some sliders had been zeroed and some had not.  I checked the tone curve and detail panels for a few images and noticed the trend.  In writing this response, I see that the tone sliders have all been zeroed in my exported images.  But...  The Detail and Tone curves have not.

                   

                  Now onto PS.  In PS, I have set "Open Jpegs with Settings," which is why I'm getting the the ACR popup when opening my exported jpegs in Photoshop.  When the jpegs open in ACR, everything appears to be zeroed with the exception of any Presence (vibrance, clarity, saturation) settings that I may have made.  The only way I'll get the metadata mismatch popup in LR is if I make changes using PS's ACR plugin.  This makes sense as any changes made in PS/ACR are changing the metadata, so the mismatch popup is doing exactly what it is supposed to do.

                   

                  So...  my original question is almost all the way answered.  The tone sliders are in fact reset on the exported / (_edited suffix) images.  However, the presence, tone curve and detail sliders remain unchanged (As do any Lens Corrections).  Any thoughts as why some would reset and some would not?  The attached image below is of the Detail sliders from one of the exported / (_edited suffix) images.

                   

                  Thanks for your help on this guys..

                   

                  Carl

                   

                  Capture.JPG

                  • 6. Re: Handling of JPEG metadata during export
                    ssprengel Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                    When you import your original GoPro JPG are the sliders ALL zeroed or not?  It's possible that you've set your LR Defaults FOR JPGS to something non-zero for these other-than-toning sliders and if so these sliders would start out non-zero just after import.  LR applies default settings upon import, whether you're importing new photos from your camera or new images created by an export.  To test what your default settings are click Reset on a photo and see what the sliders reset to.  All Zeros is the Adobe Factory Default but you can customize these defaults, yourself, which you may have done.

                     

                    You can import your exported files immediately by checking Add to Catalog up in the Export Location section:

                    • 7. Re: Handling of JPEG metadata during export
                      carls1 Level 1

                      Great to know about importing exports automatically!  That'll definitely save me some confusion down the road.

                       

                      Immediately after import, all of the sliders are zeroed (as is shown in the detail tab of one of the GoPro images that I have not edited).  I do have some general develop settings that I usually apply automatically to my raw image imports - but not to these jpg's.

                       

                       

                      Capture.JPG

                      • 8. Re: Handling of JPEG metadata during export
                        ssprengel Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                        So if you import a new GoPro jpg, change the Toning Exposure to +5 and Sharpening Amount to +150, then Export it to a subfolder with Include in Catalog set, then examine the settings of this export-import jpg what do you see from Exposure and Sharpening settings?

                         

                        I don't have a GoPro but if I try this exercise with my phone's JPGs it works as expected:

                         

                        Here is the original master jpg showing the settings adjustments:

                         

                        Here is the resulting exported-to-a-new-subfolder then reimported resulting jpg that has all it's sliders zeroed:

                        • 9. Re: Handling of JPEG metadata during export
                          carls1 Level 1

                          Steve,

                           

                          You are spot on.  I failed to have the "Show import dialog before importing" option checked and LR was automatically applying my *.NEF general develop settings to all of my exported JPG's (perhaps doubling many of my corrections?).  This explains everything...

                           

                          Thank you again - I very much appreciate your help.


                          Carl

                          Capture.JPG

                          • 10. Re: Handling of JPEG metadata during export
                            ssprengel Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                            So you were unknowingly applying an import preset normally used for NEFs to your imported JPGs.  That explains it. 

                             

                            I have customized my LR defaults to have my preferred sharpening, noise-reduction and lens corrections settings applied to all my raw files and don’t apply develop presets during import.

                            • 11. Re: Handling of JPEG metadata during export
                              carls1 Level 1

                              In fact - I've always used the workflow of:

                               

                              1) Making changes

                              2) Exporting to JPEG

                              3) Using "Synchronize Folders" to re-import the newly exported files into my catalog.

                               

                              If it was in fact applying additional corrections to my newly exported JPEG's, I've been having an issue with this ever since I first started using LR.

                               

                              Guess the fun part is that I get to learn something new every day.....