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Flash Player is Crashing/Freezing My Display Adapter

Guest
Dec 25, 2015 Dec 25, 2015

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Adobe Flash Player is crashing and freezing my display adapter. Whenever I'm viewing flash content, my entire computer freezes. The screen is frozen, but it has these weird black bars across the display. There is nothing I can do at this point, so I'm forced to do a hard reset. I had opened a ticket with Dell, and they had a hardware technician check out my computer. They concluded the problem was not a hardware problem. I then contacted Intel to report a driver problem. However, they claimed the problem was not caused by their drivers, but by Adobe Flash instead.


I can confirm this specifically happens when I use Adobe Flash. I've watched HTML 5 videos on YouTube for hours, and my computer does not freeze or crash. However, when I switch to Flash (using this utility), my computer usually freezes within a half hour of constant YouTube video watching. If I'm viewing more system intensive Flash content, such as a flash video game, my computer can freeze in as little as 10 minutes.


My System Specs:


Windows 10 Pro (x64)

Intel Pentium CPU N3540 @ 2.16GHz

8.00 GB RAM

Intel HD Graphics

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Guest
Jan 05, 2016 Jan 05, 2016

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Here is a picture of what I am seeing:

0106160035.jpg

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Adobe Employee ,
Jan 07, 2016 Jan 07, 2016

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Yep, that sure looks like a graphics driver problem. 

If you have the latest available drivers for your hardware, your best recourse is just to turn off hardware support in Flash.

Please work through the video troubleshooting guide.  In particular, see the part about disabling hardware acceleration.

https://helpx.adobe.com/flash-player/kb/video-playback-issues.html

If you're still stuck, then you have a *weird* problem, and we'll have to talk about it more.

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Guest
Jan 12, 2016 Jan 12, 2016

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I've disabled hardware acceleration, and the problem seems to have gone away. However, flash gaming is laggy as hell. Do I need to wait for Intel to update the drivers? Or do I need to wait for Adobe to update Flash? Who exactly is responsible for the crash?

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Adobe Employee ,
Jan 12, 2016 Jan 12, 2016

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The issue is with your graphics card drivers.  With hardware acceleration disabled, you're not hitting the driver problem, but Flash isn't offloading graphics processing to the GPU, so you're seeing the performance impact of doing everything in software on the CPU.

You'll want to follow the directions in the troubleshooting guide about finding updated drivers for your GPU.  If none are available, you'll want to report the issue to Intel and/or wait for an update from them.

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Guest
Jan 13, 2016 Jan 13, 2016

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Adobe Employee ,
Jan 13, 2016 Jan 13, 2016

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Sorry that your support experience with Intel wasn't great.  The bottom line is that this is a driver issue, and not something that we have any way to fix from our end. 


We don't really interact with the graphics hardware (or drivers) directly.  We're dealing with abstractions provided by the operating system (i.e. the DirectX subsystem).  We have two rendering paths to choose from -- hardware acceleration or software rendering.  When you disable hardware acceleration in Flash Player, you're not technically disabling hardware acceleration across the machine (which was the point the Intel guy was making) -- you're telling Flash to use the software rendering path and avoid hardware.  By disabling hardware acceleration in Flash, you're really telling Flash to avoid using the hardware path.

If there aren't newer drivers available for your hardware at this point, there's not much you (or we) can do about it.  Our recourse is to blacklist the hardware/driver combination, which is effectively the same result as you're getting by disabling hardware acceleration.

If you want to post your dxdiag info, I can try and find a comparable machine and reproduce it, or at least see if I can identify some additional options for you (like newer drivers, etc).

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Guest
Jan 13, 2016 Jan 13, 2016

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jeromiec83223024 wrote:

Sorry that your support experience with Intel wasn't great.

To be honest, I didn't expect it to go well in the first place. Remember, I had contacted them once before. As soon as I said it happens whenever I'm viewing Flash content, they immediately blamed Flash. So I posted this here to appease their rep saying I should contact Adobe first. And surprise, surprise, even after they know that the fault is with the driver; they still refuse to help. Intel's customer service is as bad as Dell's. Customer service is starting to be a thing of the past.

jeromiec83223024 wrote:

We don't really interact with the graphics hardware (or drivers) directly.  We're dealing with abstractions provided by the operating system (i.e. the DirectX subsystem).  We have two rendering paths to choose from -- hardware acceleration or software rendering.  When you disable hardware acceleration in Flash Player, you're not technically disabling hardware acceleration across the machine (which was the point the Intel guy was making) -- you're telling Flash to use the software rendering path and avoid hardware.  By disabling hardware acceleration in Flash, you're really telling Flash to avoid using the hardware path.

Yeah, but can you tell my Intel support guy this? He can't seem to get this simple concept through his thick head.

jeromiec83223024 wrote:

If there aren't newer drivers available for your hardware at this point, there's not much you (or we) can do about it.  Our recourse is to blacklist the hardware/driver combination, which is effectively the same result as you're getting by disabling hardware acceleration.

Darn. I was hoping someone higher up from Adobe could contact Intel. They clearly won't listen to me, but maybe they might listen to an Adobe rep.....

jeromiec83223024 wrote:

If you want to post your dxdiag info, I can try and find a comparable machine and reproduce it, or at least see if I can identify some additional options for you (like newer drivers, etc).

I'll post the dxdiag info tomorrow. I'm typing this post on a different computer. However, the exact setup I have is this:

Inspiron 11 3000 Series 2-in-1 | Dell

I use it mainly for college. That's why I'm not on it now.

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Adobe Employee ,
Jan 14, 2016 Jan 14, 2016

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I took a look, but I can't do much with the system specs.  The dxdiag will be useful.

I'll take a look once you post them.

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Guest
Jan 14, 2016 Jan 14, 2016

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Adobe Employee ,
Jan 15, 2016 Jan 15, 2016

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Okay, it looks like Dell doesn't have newer Win10 drivers, but these Intel ones match your chipset:

https://downloadcenter.intel.com/download/25188/Intel-HD-Graphics-Driver-for-Windows-10-64bit-3rd-Ge...

There's also a BIOS update available for your notebook that might help.  It's light on details, but it includes some microcode updates for the processor itself.

http://www.dell.com/support/home/us/en/19/product-support/product/inspiron-11-3147-laptop/drivers/ad...‌

If those don't help, I think you've exhausted your meaningful options for Windows 10 at the moment. 

Intel does seem to be updating the drivers pretty regularly on Win10 still -- patches seem to be landing every few weeks.  Alternatively, if you don't want to wait, you could consider moving back to Windows 8.1 if things were working well for you there. 

The drivers there are probably better tested and a little more mature.  You might have better luck reporting the issue to Intel through their support forums: Forum: Graphics | Intel Communities, but include the dxdiag, screenshot, and step-by-step instructions on how to reproduce the problem.  That gives them an actionable set of information, and at that point, you just have to be prepared to wait for the problem to get noticed and addressed. 

As an aside, if your machine is under warranty with Dell still, they're really the right contact for the graphics issue.  They buy the chips from Intel, but the relationship is probably such that Dell is really on the hook for direct consumer support for their laptops, which might explain part of that perfunctory support experience you saw earlier. 

While you might have better luck talking to Dell, calling into tech support tends to just raise my blood pressure.  For the most part, common support issues will show up in a Google search, so I tend to just search around for myself and assume that it's a bug if I can't find an answer.  There's the remote possibility that something is going on with the underlying hardware on that machine, but my expectation is that you'd then see that across other hardware accelerated software (high-end desktop games, maybe your browser if you're looking at WebGL content or something). 

In Chrome, if you go to chrome://gpu, Google will enumerate all of the various driver bug workarounds that they employ for your particular hardware.  It's common to see a few listed there, but it would be interesting to see if any of them correlate to the symptoms you're seeing.  It doesn't really help, but Google has a huge distribution and really excellent telemetry, so they're really good at cataloging and managing these kinds of problems in the field.  If they've disabled most of the GPU features, that would be an interesting data point.

I'm not seeing anything in my Google searches indicating that other people are complaining about this problem, so I'm not holding out a lot of hope that this is a situation where there are a flood of complaints coming into the Dell support line. 

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Guest
Jan 26, 2016 Jan 26, 2016

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Sorry for the delay in response. I was working some heavy overtime last week (among other things). However, now that college has started back up, I'll have a lot more free time (if that makes any sense).

jeromiec83223024 wrote:

Okay, it looks like Dell doesn't have newer Win10 drivers, but these Intel ones match your chipset:

https://downloadcenter.intel.com/download/25188/Intel-HD-Graphics-Driver-for-Windows-10-64 bit-3rd-G...

Sadly, that's an old driver. The latest one (and the one I currently have installed) is this one:

Download Intel® HD Graphics Driver for Windows® 7*, 8.1*, 10 (3rd Gen & BYT)

jeromiec83223024 wrote:

here's also a BIOS update available for your notebook that might help.  It's light on details, but it includes some microcode updates for the processor itself.

http://www.dell.com/support/home/us/en/19/product-support/product/inspiron-11-3147-laptop/ drivers/ad...

Unfortunately, this didn't help either. I appreciate your effort in finding all this stuff for me though.

jeromiec83223024 wrote:

Intel does seem to be updating the drivers pretty regularly on Win10 still -- patches seem to be landing every few weeks.  Alternatively, if you don't want to wait, you could consider moving back to Windows 8.1 if things were working well for you there.

You mean the auto-updates? I turned those off via the Group Policy Editor, and used the Windows Show/Hide updates program to install Windows only updates. I only install verified drivers from either Dell or Intel's website directly as I've had bad experiences with the generic hardware drivers pushed by Windows Update (such as loss of manufacture's driver customizations [i.e Waves Maxx Audio Pluggin for the Realtek audio driver], malfunctioning/crashing of the drivers, and even an incorrect driver installed!!). And that was on a Windows 7 system. I fear the damage that could be done on my Windows 10 system.

As far as switching back to Windows 8.1 goes, I unfortunately can't do that. I bought this computer from Dell with Windows 10 pre-installed. The key on the sticker on the bottom of my laptop is for Windows 10 only. I don't have a Windows 8 key. (I have Windows 7 keys, but unfortunately, nobody makes drivers for that operating system any more ).

jeromiec83223024 wrote:

As an aside, if your machine is under warranty with Dell still, they're really the right contact for the graphics issue.  They buy the chips from Intel, but the relationship is probably such that Dell is really on the hook for direct consumer support for their laptops, which might explain part of that perfunctory support experience you saw earlier.

While you might have better luck talking to Dell, calling into tech support tends to just raise my blood pressure.

You and me both. Dell's tech support makes Intel's look like the epitome of perfection (having contacted Dell prior to this post, I can expect my call to go something like this). However, I'll open another ticket later this week. I'll try email this time so I can include a link to this forum so they can see the work we've already done (providing they actually read it).

jeromiec83223024 wrote:

There's the remote possibility that something is going on with the underlying hardware on that machine, but my expectation is that you'd then see that across other hardware accelerated software (high-end desktop games, maybe your browser if you're looking at WebGL content or something).

All ready had a computer technician check out my hardware (first time I contacted Dell). It came back clean.

jeromiec83223024 wrote:

I'm not seeing anything in my Google searches indicating that other people are complaining about this problem, so I'm not holding out a lot of hope that this is a situation where there are a flood of complaints coming into the Dell support line. 

Well, I had more success. I actually found someone else who's been having the same problem as me. Get this, his computer uses the exact same driver as mine! Although we have different processors, we do indeed have the exact same graphics cards. You can read more about this here (uh...just ignore the anti-Adobe rants at the end 😞

Shockwave Flash crash - Audio and Video

So as you can see, this problem may be common among people who have my exact graphics card (it seems to be used mainly on "low end" systems with such processors as  Atom, Pentium, Celeron, etc.)

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Adobe Employee ,
Jan 27, 2016 Jan 27, 2016

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Yeah, with the netbooks and low-power devices, GPU acceleration is really crucial to being able to play back H.264 video.  It was the market shift towards inexpensive low-end and/or low-power hardware that was a big driver in taking on hardware GPU support.  It's much more difficult for us to support, and Flash ultimately gets the blame when things go poorly, as people conflate hardware driver issues with Flash issues.  It's totally understandable -- people just want it to work and they don't care about the internals -- but It's one of those situations where we can't guarantee that things will work perfectly -- we're totally dependent on the underlying systems, and when encoding problems are involved, the hardware is less forgiving.

For the guy in that other thread, if things like Youtube (which is all HTML5 video at this point) are automatically throttling down to 144P, they're detecting and adapting to low throughput from them to the client.  It's quite possible that the guy has 38Mbps to his ISP, but is hitting something slow along the route from his ISP to the YouTube end-point that he's connecting to, or he has 38Mbps when sitting right next to his wireless router, but not in the dead spot in his other room, his neighbor has a '90s-era 5Ghz frequency-hopping spread spectrum cordless phone, he's under a flight path, etc, etc... there are a ton of unpredictable variables, but it sounds network-related.

For your situation, all I can do at this point is suggest that you experiment with the available drivers (Dell's customized drivers, Intel's drivers, the generic Microsoft drivers) to see if you find a combination that works okay.  I should probably just start pointing people to the Intel auto-detection tool for drivers, because I'm pretty confused by the documentation on their driver pages as well.  I'm 0 for 2 this week.  It's really not clear what the latest most appropriate version is, and I read that page carefully a couple times.

From Flash's perspective, the only lever that I have to pull is to disable hardware acceleration for that card and driver combination, but because it's so prevalent on low-end and low-power devices, the cure seems worse than the disease.  It's not generating a ton of complaints at the moment, so we feel like it's better to just leave it enabled.

Fortunately, my engineer that has the engineering relationship with folks at Intel is back today, so I've asked her to forward this over to our counterparts to see if we can get a little traction there.

Thanks again for the patience in working through this.

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Guest
Feb 11, 2016 Feb 11, 2016

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They say miracles don't happen in these modern times. Yet one just did as Dell Technical support actually helped solve my issue (I hope). Apparently, the problem was with Dell Foundation Services. And I'm not entirely sure what Dell Foundation Service does, but according to Dell it helps with "technical support functions". However, according to forum posts, it apparently also has functions that deal with hard drive encryption. Whatever it does, I do know one thing about it..........it also crashes display adapters. Anyways, he recommended I check to make sure I have the latest Dell Foundation Service installed at least once a month, and while I'm there; update any other drivers on my system as well. Decent advice I guess. 

Anyways, I turned Hardware Acceleration back on; and left my computer running for around three hours with a resource intensive Flash game running in the background. When I checked on my computer after my college class, it still had not crashed and was running great. So I'm assuming the problem is solved for now.

jeromiec83223024 wrote:

Yeah, with the netbooks and low-power devices, GPU acceleration is really crucial to being able to play back H.264 video.  It was the market shift towards inexpensive low-end and/or low-power hardware that was a big driver in taking on hardware GPU support.  It's much more difficult for us to support, and Flash ultimately gets the blame when things go poorly, as people conflate hardware driver issues with Flash issues.  It's totally understandable -- people just want it to work and they don't care about the internals -- but It's one of those situations where we can't guarantee that things will work perfectly -- we're totally dependent on the underlying systems, and when encoding problems are involved, the hardware is less forgiving.

It gets even worse when the problem is caused by Dell crapware. That stuff is the least forgiving of all.

jeromiec83223024 wrote:

For the guy in that other thread, if things like Youtube (which is all HTML5 video at this point) are automatically throttling down to 144P, they're detecting and adapting to low throughput from them to the client.  It's quite possible that the guy has 38Mbps to his ISP, but is hitting something slow along the route from his ISP to the YouTube end-point that he's connecting to, or he has 38Mbps when sitting right next to his wireless router, but not in the dead spot in his other room, his neighbor has a '90s-era 5Ghz frequency-hopping spread spectrum cordless phone, he's under a flight path, etc, etc... there are a ton of unpredictable variables, but it sounds network-related.

Well, that's probably true as for why he's getting 144p. However, it doesn't explain the crashes. So what I'll probably do is recommend he try the "Dell Tech Support Foolproof Plan of Solving Every Issue Your Computer Might Have". And by the I mean having him throw all his manufacturer's driver software at his computer and see if any of them stick.

jeromiec83223024 wrote:

Fortunately, my engineer that has the engineering relationship with folks at Intel is back today, so I've asked her to forward this over to our counterparts to see if we can get a little traction there.

I really appreciate this. However, this time Intel was actually innocent. It was Dell's fault (which I suppose at this point in time should surprise nobody). But I'm glad to see that Adobe really cares about its customers.

jeromiec83223024 wrote:

Thanks again for the patience in working through this.

No, thank YOU for helping me through this. You've been nothing shy of helpful throughout this whole ordeal. I must say, this is the most pleasant customer support experience I've had in literally years! If I could give your overall support a numerical rating it would EASILY be an 11/10. HUGE thank you for all the help you have provided. I must say, this has indeed changed my perspective on Flash. Sure I complained about it before, called it a nightmare, wished all other websites would use HTML5; but now I see Adobe actually puts work and effort into developing it. And as such is the case, I've forced YouTube to play all my videos utilizing Adobe Flash now. Eventually, I suppose YouTube will completely drop support for Flash; but you can bet that from now on, I'll be watching all my videos in Flash until the day that happens.

Again, huge thanks!

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Adobe Employee ,
Feb 11, 2016 Feb 11, 2016

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No problem.  We've seen some changes this week in Windows 10 preview builds that resolve stability issues for at least one of the really problematic Intel GPU problems we've been tracking, so I'm optimistic that things will hopefully get a lot better for everyone in the next couple months.

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