16 Replies Latest reply on Jan 17, 2016 7:59 AM by rob day

    CC 2015 Createspace cover nightmares

    matthewdee Level 1

      This has to me something I'm doing wrong, it's driving crazy and I need to solve as I'm using cc2015 to submit cover artwork. Underneath the submitted artwork in a layer is a template that is EXACTLY the same dimensions as the cover art. Yet I keep getting proofs back that Createspace had to adjust and the adjustment proof looks terrible. Tather then keep sending new artwork and waiting then seeing the proof come back incorrect I thought I would ask here as I'm not a printing expert but do have common sense and need someone who can let me know if what I'm doing is correct.

       

      My document size is set at 5.06 x 7.81, as you can see the template is 5.06 x 7.81 but I notice that even though I have the correct page amount ( 236) the template says 234 BUT MOST IMPORTANT the message I got from createspace was that some artwork was outside the safe zone so they cropped the artwork in the proof I got back and it also said that the following

       

      "The spine content was too large for the page count so we reduced the size and centered it, ensuring that there is at least 0.0625" of room on either side to prevent the content from wrapping onto the front or back cover when printed. We recommend you review a physical proof of your book to ensure you are satisfied with the adjustments made."

       

      But the template spine size is 0.55.

       

      Main concern here is how do I size the template in the document?

       

      When I place the template in the doc the orange borders line right up with the black document lines perfectly ( looking in PREVIEW mode)

       

      screenshot is a template the exact size ( its back cover , spine and front cover ) and the doc set up.

       

      I have the bleed set to 0

       

      NOW

      DO I line up all artwork WITHIN the dotted black line?

      or line up with the outside of the ORANGE?

       

      common sense tels me that any artwork within the black dotted will print

      dont put any text up against or outside the white ( which is the safety zone)

       

      Is this correct?

       

      anyone?

       

      designss2.png

        • 1. Re: CC 2015 Createspace cover nightmares
          Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

          Please show us screen shots of the Pages panel and the document itself in the workspace. I'm not exactly sure what you've done at the moment.

          • 2. Re: CC 2015 Createspace cover nightmares
            rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

            Looking at the template dimension notes they say the black dotted line is the cover trim, which is 10.67 x 7.81. The template shows both the trim and the bleed, so your doc would need to include a bleed. I would think the doc setup would be like this (Document Setup Width & Height equals the trim):

             

            Screen Shot 2016-01-16 at 1.12.02 PM.png

             

            In that case the black dotted line of the template will lie on the document's trim edge:

            Screen Shot 2016-01-16 at 1.20.21 PM.png

             

            When you export the PDF include the bleeds

            • 3. Re: CC 2015 Createspace cover nightmares
              matthewdee Level 1

              OK I appreciate your input but in your document settings you have the pages set to 1 if I do that then I will have ONE page with those dimensions. For this I need 3 pages, back cover 5.06 x 7.81 spine 0.55 front cover 5.06 x7.81

               

              here is the document with an 0.25bleed ( the white area ) now do I reset the template so the WHITE AREA INSIDE THE ORANGE rests on the black document line?

               

              I DONT THINK SO because when I place the document template inside the indd doc the black dotted line lines up with the document edges but is this correct?

               

               

              0.25bleed.png

              • 4. Re: CC 2015 Createspace cover nightmares
                matthewdee Level 1

                Here is a screenshot of a document in Photoshop which is 5.06 x 7.81 as you see the black dotted line is exactly on the document edge, so according to this I would have to add the artwork making sure that no , text or images go over into the orange area correct?

                 

                If so anything on the outside of that will not be printable?

                 

                if so THEN what do I set the bleed of my indd file to?

                 

                if I leave it as ZERO which it is now will this effect the way the pdf generated would print?

                 

                pshopwtemplate.png

                • 5. Re: CC 2015 Createspace cover nightmares
                  rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                  Are they requesting a 3 page document somewhere in their specs—that would be very unusual for a book cover. They are explicitly stating that the document trim size should be 10.67 x 7.81 in the dimensions list.

                  • 6. Re: CC 2015 Createspace cover nightmares
                    Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                    The only reason for doing this as three pages is to allow for a change in the spine width (and they ought to be able to give you a revised template if you give them the correct page count).

                     

                    I suspect that either they are not happy with three pages or more likely, you didn't extend your images that bleed out to the outer edge of the red zone.

                    • 7. Re: CC 2015 Createspace cover nightmares
                      matthewdee Level 1

                      trimareimage.png

                      So do I leave MY indd document trim size set to ZERO?

                      Will it effect the way the doc prints?

                      • 8. Re: CC 2015 Createspace cover nightmares
                        matthewdee Level 1

                        Ok so what you mean is I could have made the document 1 page with the 10.67 x 7.81 dimensions ( I understand that)

                        BUT the question here for me is

                         

                        Only the artwork inside the white area will be viewable?

                        Do I keep my document settings trim set to ZERO?

                         

                        R

                        • 9. Re: CC 2015 Createspace cover nightmares
                          Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                          "Trim Size" is the finished size of your page after it has been trimmed, not the amount that is cut off. Your document setup should match the trim size. The area that gets cut off is the bleed area.

                          • 10. Re: CC 2015 Createspace cover nightmares
                            Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                            matthewdee wrote:

                             

                            Only the artwork inside the white area will be viewable?

                             

                            No. The red are extends inside the trim to help you keep important information from being cut off in the case where the sheet is not properly aligned in the cutter. In theory, everything inside the black line will show, but if there is a cutter misalignment, you will see a shift, with part of the image in the red zone inside the black line cut off, and an equal amount on the opposite edge from outside the black line will show.

                            • 11. Re: CC 2015 Createspace cover nightmares
                              rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                              InDesign's View>Screen Mode lets you view everything including the pasteboard (Normal), trim and the bleed (Bleed), and the trimmed page (Preview)

                               

                              Screen Shot 2016-01-16 at 2.13.21 PM.pngScreen Shot 2016-01-16 at 2.13.40 PM.pngScreen Shot 2016-01-16 at 2.13.32 PM.png

                              • 12. Re: CC 2015 Createspace cover nightmares
                                matthewdee Level 1

                                Ok I think I understand now,

                                So I created a new doc with the 10.67 x 7.81 dimensions like the template says

                                ( last time I created a 3 page document with the 5.06 .055 and 5.06 pages as a spread

                                 

                                Now when I place the template inside  the white boxes inside now match the document size

                                so now I placed the artwork up to and over the orange area

                                made sure any text is within the white boxes.

                                 

                                QUESTION : is it OK to se the trim size in the doc to ZERO?

                                 

                                QUESTION : WILL IT MAKE A DIFFERENCE IF I USE THE 3 PAGE DOC OR SINGLE PAGE DOC?

                                • 13. Re: CC 2015 Createspace cover nightmares
                                  Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                                  I decided to see what the real template looks like, and went to create space to make a new one.  hey seem to use the same template for all books from 233 to 240 pages (I'm guessing on the 233, but clearly it's the same for 234, 236, and 240 which implies they use 8-page signatures.

                                   

                                  Now, for how you should set this up. As the template actually says on the very first item in the upper left, your document should be set up as 19 x 13 inches landscape. I would set margins to 0, and you don't need a bleed.

                                   

                                  Place the PDF template at 100% size. It will fill the entire page, with the guide area at the bottom center. That's where it should be, probably for the laminating machine or die cutter, or maybe for the 3-knife trimmer to cut the finished book. In any case, that's where it belongs and the document is going to look a little funny to you with all that white space around it. Don't worry about it.

                                   

                                  Now, add a new layer, or layers for your content, using the template as a positioning guide. Any object that extends to the edge of the finished cover needs to extend all the way to the outside of the pink line. Anything that is important not to be cut off needs to be inside the inner white area. Spine text needs to stay inside the spine area.

                                   

                                  That's it. No three-page file, no 10.67 x 7.81 file. One page, 19 x 13, with a lot of page are you will not be using.

                                  • 14. Re: CC 2015 Createspace cover nightmares
                                    rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                    Peter, check their submission PDF pages 53-56

                                     

                                    https://www.createspace.com/ServicesWorkflow/ResourceDownload.do?id=1583

                                     

                                    I think the paper size listed on their template is misleading—I don't think they want you to include the paper size in the document.

                                    • 15. Re: CC 2015 Createspace cover nightmares
                                      Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                                      OK, I didn't see that yesterday. There is a LOT of ambiguous and contradictory information on the site.

                                       

                                      CreateSpace: Self Publishing and Free Distribution for Books, CD, DVD says the page can be set up any size, as long as it's larg enough to accomdate the full cover and bleed, and the art is centered (yet their own template is not).

                                       

                                      So what to do? Maybe try using their calculation guidelines to calculate the spine yourself:

                                       

                                      Your cover must be a single PDF, formatted to the trim size of your book, which includes

                                      the back cover, spine, and fr ont cover as one image.

                                      Spine Calculation:

                                      To format your cover you will first want to calculate the spine width of your book. To do so,

                                      multiply the total page count with the spine multiplier associated with your book’s paper

                                      type below:

                                      • For black and white-interior books:

                                      • White paper: multiply page count by 0.002252”

                                      • Cream paper: multiply page count by 0.0025”

                                      • For color-interior books:

                                      • Multiply page count by 0.002347”

                                       

                                      Add the calculated dimension to 10.12 and use that for document width in page setup, use 7.81 for height, and add a .125 bleed all around. I would add column guides for two columns (the front and back covers) and set the gutter equal to the calculated spine width. Set the margins to a minimum of .125 to define the safe zone.

                                       

                                      You can place the template centered horizontally and aligned so the bottom of the template aligns on the bottom bleed line, and it will be close, but the spine probably will be wider on the template, and the template image would be correspondingly wider than your side bleeds.

                                      • 16. Re: CC 2015 Createspace cover nightmares
                                        rob day Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                        The illustration on page 55 of the guide is helpful. This is how I've always set up covers:

                                         

                                        temp.png