25 Replies Latest reply on Mar 30, 2017 10:41 AM by Foreshots

    Lightroom CC running very slow

    toodumbforthis1 Level 1

      Lightroom for PC has gotten so clunky.  So clunky.  Lightroom mobile on my old iPad 3rd gen is faster than lightroom on my computer for editing and swiping through pictures.  My surface pro 3 is much faster than that old iPad too at everything else (I have 1 second delays when typing on iPad 3, that's how slow it is now)

       

      So, it's time to move on.  Any alternatives out there that are recommended?  I really do like the mobile app for lightroom and hate to lose it, especially for my phone, but I need a smooth PC version.

       

      Oh, I still love photoshop and love the crosstalk with Lightroom and Photoshop.  If I drop Lightroom, unfortunately I'm also dropping photoshop.  So any advice on a photoshop replacement would be nice too.

       

       

      Thanks for any advice.

        • 1. Re: What are best lightroom alternatives?
          JimHess Adobe Community Professional & MVP

          I don't share your experience with poor performance. I'm using Lightroom CC 2015 on a Windows 10 desktop PC. Performance is comfortably snappy. Why would you give up Photoshop? Photoshop and Camera Raw can give you the same raw editing capabilities. What version of Photoshop have you been using?

          • 2. Re: What are best lightroom alternatives?
            D Fosse Adobe Community Professional & MVP

            You could try Capture One and see if that works better. Personally I prefer Lightroom, but there's no doubt C1 is an excellent piece of software. It doesn't have full integration with Photoshop, but the "edit in" equivalent basically works and there's no need to give up Photoshop.

             

            One person's "snappy" is another person's "glacially slow". Things like preview rendering and 1:1 focus snap will always have a slight delay - some are bothered by it, others not. My impression is that it's the achilles heel of parametric editing, seemingly impossible to eliminate completely.

             

            I have Capture One and was determined to give it a serious try as an alternative to Lr. But in the end they're pretty much the same performance-wise, and this over two entirely independent machines/systems. I'll stick with Lr and live with the small delays.

             

            (and just for the record my main system specs are i7 3820 / 32GB / all SSD, which is plenty fast enough for anything).

            • 3. Re: What are best lightroom alternatives?
              robgendreau Level 3

              Without knowing your computer specs, hard to say what will work. Assuming you are using previews correctly in Lr, it might be that your machine is having trouble displaying the images, and that the same images on a faster computer might be just as slow. Being fast on a mobile device isn't an indication that it's just Lr's problem, since the previews are generated optimally for each device.

              • 4. Re: What are best lightroom alternatives?
                whsprague Adobe Community Professional

                No offense intended.  But, a reality check from a different direction may be in order!

                 

                Some tidbits from the "Business Wire" about two weeks ago:  (1) "Adobe achieved record quarterly revenue of $1.38 billion, representing year-over-year growth of 25 percent."  (2) "Strong Creative Cloud adoption drove Digital Media Annualized Recurring Revenue (“ARR”) to $3.13 billion exiting the quarter, an increase of $246 million."

                 

                Another article somewhere said that Creative Cloud users have grown through 6 million.  I've not figured out how many of those are Lightroom users, but I'll guess it is at least 3 million. 

                 

                Logic tells me that most, if not all, of the people who have trouble end up reading and posting to this forum.  How many are having trouble?  A few hundred?   Math suggests that Adobe's products perform well enough for most users with 99.99% success rate. 

                 

                That's not to say that real people don't have real problems that have to be solved.  But to suggest it is universally "clunky" seems inaccurate to me when millions continue to pay their fees!

                • 5. Re: What are best lightroom alternatives?
                  toodumbforthis1 Level 1

                  I have the creative cloud.  I'm using the i5 version of surface pro 3.  I have an old second gen i7K processor in a computer as well, and that guy does really well for exporting photos.  The thing is, I now sync my files and edit them on my iPhone because the editing experience is just better than the surface pro 3.  It has nothing to do with iPhone being faster than my surface pro 3.  It has everything to do with the software (lightroom mobile) on iOS being optimized (that is my opinion at least).  I tried to create "smart previews" to see if that would speed up the editing process, as I thought the RAW files are too large.  But it is still just as slow.  By the way, lightroom takes up 40-70% of my CPU when flipping between photos.  I'm not editing, manipulating or anything.  I'm just scrolling through them. That is why I now use my iPhone.  Scrolling through them on lightroom mobile is extremely snappy.  How can this be?  I'll give capture one a try and see how it performs.  Don't get me wrong guys.  I love lightroom, but it give me anxiety attacks with it's slow chunkiness and high CPU usage for doing mundane tasks.

                   

                  Photoshop is snappy still.  No problems editing files with surface pro 3 in photoshop.  At least for the given CPU.

                   

                  By the way, I'd give up photoshop so I don't have to pay the subscription fee.  If there is a better alternative.

                  • 6. Re: What are best lightroom alternatives?
                    trshaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                    toodumbforthis1 wrote:

                     

                    By the way, lightroom takes up 40-70% of my CPU when flipping between photos.  I'm not editing, manipulating or anything.  I'm just scrolling through them.

                    If you're scrolling through image files in the LR desktop app Develop module it will be slower. The Develop module renders each image file individually on-the-fly. The Library module uses Standard and 1:1 Previews that are created on import. These pre-built renderings allow faster previewing of images than possible in the Develop module. If scrolling is also slooooooooooooooow in the Library module there are two things that can cause it:

                     

                    1) Image file Library previews are not  "automatically" updated, which will cause slower scrolling and preview rendering until they are all updated. After each Develop module editing session select all of the image files in the folder(s) you were working on and in the Library module go to menu Previews> and select 'Build Standard Previews.' If you need to scroll through and review images at 1:1 View select Build 1:1 Previews, which will build both Standard and 1:1 Previews. Only files that were changed will have their previews rebuilt.

                     

                    2) When the Library module 'Metadata' panel is set to display 'EXIF and IPTC' data it can cause sloooooooooooooow scrolling. The solution is to change that setting to 'Default' or or even uncheck the panel, whichever you prefer.

                     

                    Left-click any Library module panel and uncheck 'Metedata.'

                    There are also numerous other "fixable" things that can cause slow LR performance. If the above does not resolve your performance issues we'll be glad to try and help you further. Please provide specs for your PC including, OS version, 32bit or 64bit, CPU model, Memory amount, monitor model, and camera model(s) image files being imported.

                    • 7. Re: What are best lightroom alternatives?
                      2drumstix Level 1

                      I don't meant to crash your thread.... But I'm curious what suggestions you have for performance when in Dev? I've been using LR since V1, I shoot for a living, often several edit jobs going on at once. About a month ago I finally decided to move off LR5 and start using LRCC 2015 5.5. I find it just overall slow when in DEV, the crop, grad filter, radial filter,  pretty much every tool or adjustment just has a slower response than LR5 on the same PC. Sure I'm talking seconds or partial seconds of slow response, I mean its I suppose tolerable. But, I work fast, often using mouse and keyboard shortcuts to fly through editing, jumping around quickly between tools, adjustments sliders, applying presets and then tweaking those, undo, redo, and adjust again. Those seconds and partial seconds add up over the course of a 3-4 hours edit session.

                       

                      I believe my machine is pretty lightening fast, I built it around video editing considerations, for which it is amazingly fast. It's a new build as of last November; Win8.1, 64bit, i7 5960x, 64g memory, GTX980, 850Pro SSD for OS, 950Pro M.2 for video projects, 2-12TB raids for storage, two Dell ultra sharp 24", 2 Nikon D810s, shoot in RAW.

                       

                      Any PC tweak ideas would be appreciated.

                       

                      Thanks,

                      Donnie

                      • 8. Re: What are best lightroom alternatives?
                        2drumstix Level 1

                        Should have included that I've unchecked use GPU. My Catalog preview cache is at Auto 1920, high, discard after 30 days.

                        • 9. Re: What are best lightroom alternatives?
                          trshaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                          Have you tried the standard suggestions:

                           

                          1) Uncheck 'Use Graphics Processor' in LR Preferences> Performance tab.

                          2) In LR Preferences> File Handling increase the Camera Raw Cache Settings> Maximum Size to at least 20 GB.

                          3) If using a 2nd display for the LR Loupe try making the window smaller (i.e. not full-screen). Also try using the Develop module without the 2nd Display.

                          4) Update the graphics drivers to the latest version. Regardless of whether 'Use Graphics Processor' is checked or NOT checked the driver (and driver settings) can cause performance issues! Always check 'Clean Install' in the driver update prompt screens and don't make any changes to the default driver settings after the update.

                          • 10. Re: What are best lightroom alternatives?
                            trshaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                            2drumstix wrote:

                             

                            Should have included that I've unchecked use GPU. My Catalog preview cache is at Auto 1920, high, discard after 30 days.

                            The LR Library Previews are not used in the Develop module. The Develop module previews are created on-the-fly to update adjustment changes real-time. The larger the Develop Loupe window size the longer it will take to refresh the preview. Also the larger the image file (i.e. D810 36.3 Megapixel) the longer it will take to update the screen with adjustment changes (i.e. control lag).

                            • 11. Re: What are best lightroom alternatives?
                              2drumstix Level 1

                              Thanks for the tips. I had GPU unchecked. But I'll try increasing the Camera Raw Cache to 20g. And I'll try fiddling with 2nd monitor window size - when in dev I always have the 2nd window in grid, hardly ever use loupe on 2nd monitor, sometimes I use survey and less often compare. Does 2nd monitor window size impact response when in grid?

                               

                              Updating GPU driver - yeah there have been times in the past (albeit with a different editing machine) that updating the NVIDIA driver reeked havoc. With this new machine I've updated it rather often without problems - however if I have a major video project in edit mode I never update anything, especially GPU driver - maybe an old habit of a bit of paranoia...

                               

                              With regards to GPU NIVIDA driver, I've always read and done, setting "Adjust image settings with preview" to "Use my preference - performance" , and under "Manage 3D settings" set "Power management mode" to "Prefer maximum performance". But you're saying leave the driver at default? Is that with consideration to video editing in Premiere as well, or just a LR tip?

                              • 12. Re: What are best lightroom alternatives?
                                trshaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                2drumstix wrote:

                                I'll try fiddling with 2nd monitor window size - when in dev I always have the 2nd window in grid, hardly ever use loupe on 2nd monitor, sometimes I use survey and less often compare. Does 2nd monitor window size impact response when in grid?

                                It shouldn't, but if your having performance issues in the Develop module (sluggish sliders) I'd try closing the 2nd display window. If it doesn't make a difference then you've answered your own question.

                                 

                                2drumstix wrote:

                                With regards to GPU NIVIDA driver, I've always read and done, setting "Adjust image settings with preview" to "Use my preference - performance" , and under "Manage 3D settings" set "Power management mode" to "Prefer maximum performance".

                                Yes, try LR with the driver "defaults," which will be loaded if you do a driver update with 'Clean Install' checked. You can make changes to the settings for specific apps with 'Use the adavanced 3D image settings' and then go into 'Manage 3D settings.' Select the program (Premiere) and then make changes to the settings. The setting changes will only be used with that specific app.   For example I use this with Cyberlink Power Director to turn OFF CUDA - GPUs, which causes slow rendering with my Quadro 600 GPU. But you shouldn't have video editing issues with the GTX980 using the default settings so try that first before making any changes.

                                • 13. Re: What are best lightroom alternatives?
                                  toodumbforthis1 Level 1

                                  I'm using the surface pro 3, 64 bit I5 version.  I'm increasing the cash to 10GB.  It was set at 1GB.  Maybe that will speed things up.  I'll play with it and see.

                                  • 14. Re: What are best lightroom alternatives?
                                    trshaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                    Are you installing updates on a regular basis?  Apparently there are some performance issues that require firmware and driver updates to correct:

                                     

                                    http://www.winbeta.org/news/surface-pro-3-surface-3-snag-updated-graphics-drivers-new-firm ware-update

                                     

                                    Microsoft’s Surface line of products is incredibly well-designed and innovative, pushing the 2-in-1 Windows 10 market forward in some pretty exciting directions. At the same time, Microsoft has been struggling as of late with some performance and reliability issues typically involving display drivers, CPU sleep states, and others that require firmware to resolve. Yesterday, it appears that Microsoft issued a firmware update for the Surface Pro 3 and Surface 3 iterations,

                                    • 15. Re: What are best lightroom alternatives?
                                      2drumstix Level 1

                                      Thanks again trshaner for all the suggestions and ideas. As of last night, upping cache to 20g didn't do much, putting GPU back to default didn't really make much difference, but - making my 2nd window smaller appears to have made a little difference. Which is great but also unfortunate, I use the 2nd window in grid with library filters and the metadata tab option open with specific columns, one of my filter categories is lens for quick access to filter images by lens type. Loosing that to gain a second in speed editing performance isn't a great trade off really. Nor is having no grid open, to see and navigate to images, to select for compare, to select for copy or sync settings, to sort by filter. I doubt that a smaller 2nd window to gain some performance when in Dev is how LR CC is designed to work, perhaps there is some other tweak that does the same trick? who knows...

                                       

                                      I don't know if Adobe is reading these posts or not, but if they should, and then offer a solution or look into it for a fix. I cant be the only one who uses LR CC in a professional capacity, and who has noticed a slight decrease in efficiency and performance in Develop tools. And I don't know about others who use LR CC, but for me as a professional I don't need Book or Map, I'd prefer pro editing performance in my photo editing software, and leave the fluffy toys out of it.  

                                      • 16. Re: What are best lightroom alternatives?
                                        trshaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                        Many have complained that changes made to implement GPU support have affected things like the Local tools that aren't GPU accelerated even with 'Use Graphics Processor' unchecked:

                                         

                                        GPU notes for Lightroom CC (2015)

                                         

                                        BTW- I'm using a 6-year old HP desktop with a 2.8GHz i7-860 quad core processor, 12GB memory, 2560x1440 monitor, and 21 Mp 5D MKII raw files with no major issues using LR CC 2015. The 1.9GHz i5-4300u processor in your Surface Pro 3 coupled with the larger 36.3 Mp D810 raw image files will cause LR to run at less than 1/2 the performance of my desktop system.

                                         

                                        36.3/21 Mp = 1.73x more pixels to process

                                        5096/3750 PassMark Score= 1.36x processing power

                                        Estimated performance difference = 1.73 x 1.36 = 2.35x faster (My system)

                                         

                                        To make a comparison I downloaded some Canon 5DS R 50Mp raw files and tried processing them in the LR CC 2015.4 Develop module. There is ~.5 Sec. lag using any of the Basic panel sliders or Local controls, which is still usable. This should be about equivalent to you processing 36.3 Mp D810 files on your Surface Pro. I'm not seeing seconds of delay. Does this correlate with what you're seeing?

                                        • 17. Re: What are best lightroom alternatives?
                                          D Fosse Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                          At this point I'd like to repeat what I said above:

                                          One person's "snappy" is another person's "glacially slow".

                                          The half second delays - whether it's preview focus snap or slider response - can be nothing to worry about, or they can be real show-stoppers. It really depends on what you do and how you normally work. A half second could just as well be a half minute if you have a high volume shoot to sort through. It kills the flow.

                                           

                                          Now, personally, I've never seen actual slider delays. But I keep tearing my hair out over these small delays in on-screen rendering.

                                           

                                          It wouldn't matter if I sat there with a single image to process. With a couple of hundred, and a tight deadline on top, it's a whole different story. So this is why I think some people are perfectly happy, and some say the application is useless.

                                           

                                          They're experiencing the same thing, a half second here, a half second there. But the context is different.

                                           

                                          But as I said, Capture One isn't really any better. So that's why I think this is down to the parametric editing process more than the actual application.

                                          • 18. Re: What are best lightroom alternatives?
                                            2drumstix Level 1

                                            trshaner - nice to hear other have seen similar lack of responsiveness while in Dev mod. I'm not the person on Surface Pro so I don't relate to those numbers. I am however the guy shooting with two D810s, and yes they are large RAW files.

                                             

                                            In the bigger picture, my Win 8.1, i7 5960x, 64g mem, I suppose really does, what others might see as, a very fast job of on the fly rendering of 36mp RAW files. But as D Fosse points out, its all really in the expectation of the person, their machine, and how fast they think the software is working for them. I fall into the "show stopper" if I had to choose, in that I've been in LR since it's inception, I shoot for a living lots of high volume jobs. Since LR1 I have or have used at least 4 different editing machines over that time. My last PC is a 5 year old machine, and it with LR5 was faster in some Dev tasks than my new high-end built for speed gamers machine. Heck, even LR5 on my new machine handled some Dev tasks with more pep than LR CC on the same machine (too bad LR versions catalogs aren't backwards compatible, or forwards compatible for that matter).

                                             

                                            Overall, for me, I don't have time for new learning curves most of the year, unless its February... So I'm sticking with LR. But D Fosse is right, that with high volume work flows, these few micro-seconds of waiting for my preview or crop tool to decide its ready - kills the flow.   

                                            • 19. Re: What are best lightroom alternatives?
                                              trshaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                              2drumstix wrote:

                                               

                                              trshaner - nice to hear other have seen similar lack of responsiveness while in Dev mod. I'm not the person on Surface Pro so I don't relate to those numbers. I am however the guy shooting with two D810s, and yes they are large RAW files.

                                              Sorry about that confusion! I went back and checked 'Use Graphics Processor' to see the effect on processing large 50Mp Canon 5DS R on my i7-860 system. The Basic panel control lag is completely gone! It's like greased lightning, but now the Fit view preview takes 5 seconds when switching to the next image file in the Develop module. This shouldn't affect the speed of processing images since I start with the Basic panel and work down through the other panels. You don't need a "tack sharp" image to start making tone adjustments over the first 5 sec. Then the image is fully rendered it stays sharp and responsive to any control adjustment with no discernible lag! This surprised me because I'm using a relatively low-performance Nvidia Quadro 600 GPU. Perhaps something was changed in one of the CC 2015 updates because I don't recall seeing this performance increase on my system with GPU Support enabled. I've been using LR with it unchecked since CC 2015.0 because it seemed to slow things down. So I have no idea when or if something changed with GPU Support....or something changed on my system. Just an FYI.

                                              • 20. Re: Lightroom CC running very slow
                                                Jao vdL Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                The GPU acceleration has been gradually improving over the last few versions. It's to the point now where indeed if you use mostly basic sliders it is quite nice and smooth even on fairly low-end GPUs. It still really slows down when you tart brushing though and you get the lag when switching images in Develop.

                                                • 21. Re: Lightroom CC running very slow
                                                  trshaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                  After doing some more testing with 'Use Graphics Processor' checked I discovered it slows down the Luminance NR slider response by a factor of 2x to 3x. With the 50Mp 5DS R raw files it takes 3 to 4 seconds to render the slider change, which makes it near impossible to properly adjust it. Except for that everything else in the Develop module is faster or the same.

                                                  • 22. Re: Lightroom CC running very slow
                                                    toodumbforthis1 Level 1

                                                    After the lightroom update I think it changed it back to "use GPU".  I unchecked it and it is working much better now as well.  From now on, I'll look at that after each lightroom update.  But still, touch mode on surface pro 3 is much slower than on ipad or iPhone.  I like the comment somebody else made about Map/Book/slideshow/etc.  Lightroom CC on PC is just loaded with stuff.  It is just a much heavier set of software as compared to lightroom mobile.  Because it is so bloated, it's probably got a lot of coding in it that has made things slow.  When I switch it into "touch mode" it's nice but very clunky and slow as compared to the smooth transitions I see on iOS.  Maybe Adobe should develop a "Lightroom Light" for those who just want the navigator/library/collections and the develop module.  Cut out the rest of it.  Thanks for all of the recommendations and advice.  It has been uselful. 

                                                    • 23. Re: Lightroom CC running very slow
                                                      trshaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                      toodumbforthis1 wrote:

                                                       

                                                      I like the comment somebody else made about Map/Book/slideshow/etc.  Lightroom CC on PC is just loaded with stuff.  It is just a much heavier set of software as compared to lightroom mobile.  Because it is so bloated, it's probably got a lot of coding in it that has made things slow.

                                                      Actually when you launch LR the only module that is loaded is the one that it opens with. The other modules are only loaded as you select them one-by-one. You can prevent modules from ever being loaded by right-clicking on the module selector bar and unchecking the modules you don't want to use:

                                                      • 24. Re: Lightroom CC running very slow
                                                        cliff colgate

                                                        To say Capture One Pro is faster would be an understatement.. I've been using Lightroom since its incarnation, and in its latest CC form its ridiculous to say the least. Just download the C1 Pro demo and try. Scrolling is slick, everything is snappy, moving between and using modules is swift.

                                                         

                                                        Lightroom is at a crawl on all of my machines, both Windows and Mac in comparison.. not sure what's going on, but Adobe aren't leveraging any part of my high powered systems at all. Windows draw slowly, windows scroll slowly... It exports fine, but as for editing.. switching quickly between grid and develop... it's not conducive to a refined workflow at all and is now becoming pretty annoying.

                                                        I want to stay due to many years of muscle memory and some of the transform functions that i use frequently in my workflow, but tethered capture speed, UI speed in general across the board? Gah, i'm so wanting to switch to C1 at the moment...

                                                        • 25. Re: Lightroom CC running very slow
                                                          Foreshots

                                                          Jumping in this post.  I just bought a custom built PC with 128GB Ram and SSDs.....I have never seen LR so "Clunky", slow to render images and let's not even discuss trying to use the Adjustment brush.  Did the common tries, Turn Off GPU, Increase Cache, etc....not much difference.

                                                           

                                                          Just got off the phone with Adobe, they are telling there is an issue with LR if you are operating with over 24 GB Ram.  They hope to have it resolved in the next update.  Should I put faith in this?  Do I convert to Capture One or try On1 RAW Editor?