15 Replies Latest reply on Jul 25, 2016 9:45 AM by RoninEdits

    Using the Nvidia M5000

    glaustin Level 2

      Hi guys

      I'm agonising over another custom build. I've had a couple before and they've ended up more as noisy gaming machines. My projects are normally 15/ 20 web videos, with some Ae and Au enhancements, together with some Red Giant plug-ins applied. However I am branching into more complex documentary work with hour long features and much more colour correction on top. My source footage currently is a blend captured from a tape based Sony Z1 and Canon 550d (Rebel T2).

       

      My current configuration uses a Nvidia FX3800 and it is slow, a bit clunky and very noisy, which is a problem for my office and surrounding rooms and gets in the way of voiceovers. Often the 2nd monitor will stop working.

       

      Anyway, the guy I've been speaking to seems to grasp the nuances of my NLE needs and I'm looking at some specs for a newbuild being offered, based on the M5000. I know there are other factors I need to examine, but the graphics card is usually the key and I wonder has anyone been using this card in their editing and if so is its performance reliable, fast and quiet? Are there any Mercury Playback Engine or quality problems? (Is it true I can hook up more than 2 monitors without other interfaces?)

       

      I should really welcome any feedback.

      Graham

        • 1. Re: Using the Nvidia M5000
          ECBowen Most Valuable Participant

          What is your current system specs. The Geforce 980Ti would be far better than the Quadro M5000. However your system may not even be able to really push that card based on the current card you have. A 960GTX 4GB card would probably me more than enough for that media and your current system.

           

           

          Eric

          ADK

          • 2. Re: Using the Nvidia M5000
            glaustin Level 2

            Thanks, Eric

            As mentioned, this is a new build. Apart from the Nvidia M5000, the proposed specs are:

             

            Processor:

            Intel Xeon E5-2697 v3 (35M Cache, 14-cores, 2.60 GHz)

             

            Intel Lüfter CPU S2011/1366/115x, Intel Certified Liquid Cooling

             

            Operating System:

            Microsoft Windows 10 Home 64-bit

             

            RAM Memory:

            64GB DDR4-PC2133

             

            Hard Disk Drives:

            120GB SSD as boot drive / 2TB Seagate hard drive as data drive.

             

            I'm more creative than technical. I'm looking for an editing machine (some builders create gaming machines instead of editing) that will be quiet, run editing smoothly and render at a reasonable speed, with high quality exports. I want it to be future proofed as much as possible for the next 3 or 4 versions following Pr CC 2015 (the one I have was built for CS6). I'd welcome any feedback.

             

            Regards,

            Graham

            • 3. Re: Using the Nvidia M5000
              ECBowen Most Valuable Participant

              I would suggest Win 10 Pro and not Home and definitely the 980Ti card with that system. The Xeon 2697 V3's can definitely push that card with 4K media.

               

              Eric

              ADK

              • 4. Re: Using the Nvidia M5000
                glaustin Level 2

                Many thanks, Eric. Yes, I had the same idea about the OS. Out of interest, why are you definite the 980Ti would be better than the M5000 with this configuration (would it be quieter)? Are there any other points I should bear in mind? As I mentioned, I am lean to the creative, not technical and I really want to get it right this time after some of the gaming machines, instead of editing stations, I've ended up with.

                • 5. Re: Using the Nvidia M5000
                  xeca41

                  The M5000 is slower in video work then the 980ti and also carries a higher price tag. I run two 980 ti's in my system for editing and it has made a huge difference in video playback and rendering.

                  • 6. Re: Using the Nvidia M5000
                    ECBowen Most Valuable Participant

                    GPU acceleration in general ie Cuda and Open CL performance is decided by the raw specs of the cards ie cuda cores, core clock speed, ram bandwidth, and ram clock speed as well as bus width. This is the reason the Geforce cards outperform the Quadro cards in general when comparing for example the Quadro M5000 and the 980Ti card. The 980Ti as you can see has far greater amount of Cuda cores and the clock speed is normally higher on the Geforce cards as well since they don't throttle them as much to cool the GPU's. Then on top of this the 980Ti has more ram bandwidth in general which makes a huge difference on GPU acceleration. The Quadro M5000 is not really quieter since the cooling on the Quadro cards is often less than the Asus 980Ti cards for example. This means the Quadro cards heat up more which requires greater fan speed to maintain temps or greater throttling of the GPU. These reasons are why you want the 980Ti over the Quadro M5000. The Quadro M6000 would be the equivalent/greater card to the 980Ti but many times the price.

                     

                     

                    Quadro M5000 Specs

                     

                    CUDA Parallel-Processing Cores 2048

                    GPU Memory 8 GB GDDR5 Max

                    Graphics Bus PCI Express 3.0 x16

                     

                    Geforce 980Ti

                     

                    GTX 980 TI Engine Specs:

                    2816CUDA Cores

                    1000Base Clock (MHz)

                    1075Boost Clock (MHz)

                    176Texture Fill Rate (GigaTexels/sec)

                    GTX 980 TI Memory Specs:

                    7.0 GbpsMemory Clock

                    6 GBStandard Memory Config

                    GDDR5Memory Interface

                    384-bitMemory Interface Width

                    336.5

                    Eric

                    ADK

                     

                    • 7. Re: Using the Nvidia M5000
                      glaustin Level 2

                      Hi Guys

                      I'm still weighing up which way to go and trying to have a work station that is future proofed to some extent. I am leaning towards the advice here in relation to my options but if I go for the Geforce 980Ti, would it cope well with editing in 4k?

                      • 8. Re: Using the Nvidia M5000
                        JEShort01 Level 4

                        A GTX 980 Ti will work well with 4k video and the CPU that you are considering and as Eric stated, faster (better) and cheaper than the Quadro option.

                         

                        As you are building a strong and expensive workstation and wanting it to last for awhile, I would contend a system with more firepower in the drive area would be a more balanced system, provide better performance with 4k workflows, and better target your goal of carrying you for the next 3 release cycles.

                         

                        For example:

                        - system drive: (Windows Pro - 8.1 or 10): Samsung Pro 950 512GB (M.2) or Intel 750 400GB (PCIe)

                        - data & scratch/cache array: 4x RAID 0 SSD array (Samsung 850 Pro or Intel 730 SATA drives)

                        - in-system backup drive: 4TB 7200rpm (or, can you repurpose drive(s) from your current system for this?)

                         

                        Regards,

                         

                        Jim

                        • 9. Re: Using the Nvidia M5000
                          glaustin Level 2

                          Thanks, Jim, that's really helpful.

                           

                          It's taking me time to decide because I have had my fingers expensively burnt. I am currently with a noisy, clunky playback machine that also has AI characteristics because it always knows when to breakdown at the most critical time on a client project... FYI I am also looking at MAC Pro as well as they are reputed to be very quiet, which is a big consideration.

                           

                          Regards,

                          Graham

                          • 10. Re: Using the Nvidia M5000
                            ECBowen Most Valuable Participant

                            Just keep in mind the MPro's are a generation behind ie i7 Gen 3 and use DDR3 versus the current Gen 4 and Gen 5 of Workstation and Server for PC with DDR4. The performance different with DDR4 and 4k+ media is significant besides Nvidia GPU's such as the 980Ti that perform far better with Adobe especially in 4k+ work. These X99 systems can be quiet if they are built that way. We sell Pro Audio systems that are very quiet. You just have to get the right cases and cooling. The GPU fans and cooling are what they have to be though the Asus 980Ti cards are very quiet unless until the load requires greater RPM's.

                             

                            Eric

                            ADK

                            • 11. Re: Using the Nvidia M5000
                              glaustin Level 2

                              Hi Guys

                              I'm finally close to concluding my decision, but thought I'd fire the specs past you guys one last time in case of any comments. As I mentioned, I'm looking for as quiet a machine as possible, but one that seriously improves on the unstable, clunky performance my current PC provides running Pr (and Ae) CC 2015, so it's a balance between noise and performance (and future proofing):

                               

                               

                              Mainboard:

                              FUJITSU Extended Lifecycle Mainboard D3348-B (high performance ATX Board designed and manufactured for 24/7 continuous operation)

                               

                              Power Supply:

                              Seasonic 650W/80+ Gold/ 24-7 ATX 24pin

                               

                              Processor:

                              Intel Xeon E5-2697 v3 (35M Cache, 14-cores, 2.60 GHz)

                               

                              Intel Lüfter CPU S2011/1366/115x, Intel Certified Liquid Cooling

                               

                              Operating System:

                              Microsoft Windows 10 Professional 64-bit

                               

                              RAM Memory:

                              64GB DDR4-PC2133

                               

                              Hard Disk Drive:

                              Intel DC P3600 400GB SSD PCIe as boot drive / 2 x 4TB Seagate hard drives as data drives

                               

                              Graphics Card:

                              PNY GeForce GT 980 Ti 6144MB GDDR5 PCI-E 3.0

                               

                              Peripherals:

                              Samsung DVD-RW Optical Drive

                               

                              Keyboard / mouse

                               

                              IO Delock PCIe 2+1 Port FireWire 1394A inkl. LP

                               

                              Any thoughts out there welcome before I make my bank balance cry.

                              • 12. Re: Using the Nvidia M5000
                                Bill Gehrke Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                I believe that that Intel 400 GB drive is an overkill for your OS/Applications.  What specs made you select it?  You do not have a fast second drive for your exports and your media.  Edited!

                                • 13. Re: Using the Nvidia M5000
                                  RoninEdits Most Valuable Participant

                                  if you are going with these workstation/enterprise parts for higher quality and longer longevity, you should probably also invest in a higher watt power supply. seasonic is good, but 850w to 1000w platinum or titanium will be better built to last longer and less chance of failure. some of the seasonic's have a "hybrid" fan mode, which turns the fan off until enough power is drawn to need cooling, usually around 50%. so with a higher watt power supply with this hybrid fan feature will only rarely turn on the fan to reduce noise.

                                   

                                  if you are worried about reliable, trouble free, and quiet, you won't want a liquid cooler. they can leak and when they fail its alot more trouble to replace than a bad fan on an air cooler. noctua makes very quiet air coolers and fans, and air coolers have no pump noise. if you really want liquid, a 240mm or 280mm rad will be able to run two fans at lower rpm to be quieter than the single 120 fan on that intel cooler you listed. you should also check the liquid coolers warranty, to see how long it lasts and how much money it will cover in damages if it leaks and damages the system.

                                   

                                  the enterprise pcie ssd is in overkill territory as bill says, unless you plan on using it for multiple purposes besides os/apps. if you only plan on using it for os/apps you may want to look for a cheaper priced intel or samsung enterprise sata ssd's. make sure the hdd's you get are enterprise grade as well, some seagate non-enterprise hdd models have ridiculously high failure rates. hgst makes some of the most reliable hdd's.

                                   

                                  there were next gen parts released for the cpu and video card. these were known for months in advance and im kind of shocked no one has mentioned them in previous posts. the new intel broadwell-ep xeon v4's are slightly faster at the same clock speed, and usually have 2 more cores over the v3 model they replace. a E5-2690 v4 is similar to the E5-2697 v3. they have the same core count and same base clock speed of 2.6ghz, but the new E5-2690 v4 should cost a fair bit less, use slightly less watts, and be around 6-7% faster. the other big benefit is the faster ddr4-2400 ECC memory is supported by the xeon v4, which eric has said is the minimum for 4k video playback. the E5-2697 v4 has 18 cores, but a slower clock speed of 2.3ghz, below eric's minimum recommended 2.6ghz.

                                   

                                  the gtx 1080 and 1070 were just released, but a limited release, so they may be difficult to find in stock right now. they use less power than the 900 series, so they will help keep the fan noise down. the gtx 980 ti is 250w, the 1080 is 180w, and the 1070 is 150w. the gtx 1080 and 1070 also supposedly support 4k UHD/HDR monitors for some possible future-proofing, and also come with 8gb of vram vs the 6gb on the 980ti. a gtx 1070 is suppose to be similar to the gtx 980ti, while the gtx 1080 is suppose to be around 25-30% faster. these are new cards, so not everything is known about how well they will perform in adobe software or what kind of problems might come from the gtx 1000 series. so far there is a nvidia driver issue causing problems with r3d media, that driver issue is also causing problems with the gtx 900 series. the 900 series can use an older driver to fix it, but there is no older driver for the gtx 1080.

                                  • 14. Re: Using the Nvidia M5000
                                    glaustin Level 2

                                    Thanks for all your comments, guys.

                                     

                                    Below is pretty well what I'm going to run with. I hope it will be a quiet and smooth runner and be future proofed for a while:

                                     

                                     

                                    Case:

                                     

                                    TERRA Workstation 7500 Silent (designed for 3D simulations, visualization solutions, video

                                     

                                    editing, DTP, raytracing and all performance applications).

                                     

                                     

                                    Mainboard:

                                     

                                    FUJITSU Extended Lifecycle Mainboard D3348-B (high performance ATX Board designed and

                                     

                                    manufactured for 24/7 continuous operation)

                                     

                                     

                                    Power Supply:

                                     

                                    Seasonic SS-750XP2 Snow Silent 750W 80+ Platinum Certified White PSU

                                     

                                    Seasonic Patented Hybrid Silent Fan Control

                                     

                                    PSU 7 year warranty

                                     

                                     

                                    Processor:

                                     

                                    Intel Xeon E5-2697 v3 (35M Cache, 14-cores, 2.60 GHz)

                                     

                                    Intel Lüfter CPU S2011/1366/115x, Intel Certified Liquid Cooling

                                     

                                     

                                    Operating System:

                                     

                                    Microsoft Windows 10 Professional 64-bit

                                     

                                     

                                    RAM Memory:

                                     

                                    64GB DDR4-PC2133

                                     

                                     

                                    Hard Disk Drive:

                                     

                                    Intel DC P3600 400GB SSD PCIe as boot drive / 2 x 4TB Seagate hard drives as data drives

                                     

                                     

                                    Graphics Card:

                                     

                                    PNY GeForce GT 980 Ti 6144MB GDDR5 PCI-E 3.0

                                     

                                    Other:

                                     

                                    Samsung DVD-RW Optical Drive

                                     

                                    Keyboard / mouse

                                     

                                    IO Delock PCIe 2+1 Port FireWire 1394A inkl. LP

                                     

                                    Thank you for all very much for all your comments. They have been very helpful and as you will see we have modified the specs a lot from my original post. I did discuss all your comments with the guys that will build the PC and we've kicked them around. If we didn't adopt any suggestions, it is not because they've been ignored but because we needed to kept with the specs provided or something similar for pragmatic reasons.

                                     

                                    • 15. Re: Using the Nvidia M5000
                                      RoninEdits Most Valuable Participant

                                      as long as you are aware of the potential traps, then its your call in the end. some of the parts that are likely to be a problem will be easy/cheaper to upgrade, some will not.

                                       

                                      another potential problem i didn't mention in the last post is the 14 cores. depending on which media you are editing you may be better off with the E5-2687W V4, which has slightly less cores but higher clock speed. you may have to do some testing with hyper-threading on and off with your different projects to see which works better as premiere doesn't handle high core counts for certain media/projects. https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Adobe-Premiere-Pro-CC-2015-Multi-Core-Performan ce-Update1-806/

                                       

                                      also since my last post pudget did a test on the new gtx cards and they were faster than the old nvidia cards. so you would be better off with the gtx 1070 > 980ti, not only for lower noise but for better performance. the lower power draw on the gtx 1070 would also help keep the fan in the 750w psu off, while in hybrid mode.

                                      https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/GTX-1070-and-GTX-1080-Premiere-Pro-Performance- 810/