8 Replies Latest reply on Jun 14, 2016 4:01 AM by Abambo

    Page shuffling question

    joet082964 Level 3

      Good day folks,


      Win 7

      InDesign build x64


      Our files come from Germany in A4 format.

      Two questions:

        1. I know they are positioned for a printing spread, but how and why would you shuffle them in this order? They are created as 6 individual A4 pages, and printed as a 3-panel brochure.
        2. When using Document Setup to change them to U.S. letter size, pages 4 and 5 (top left and bottom right pages - according to the Pages panel) maintain A4 size. I've done this many times before successfully.


      Any ideas on what could be causing this?

        • 1. Re: Page shuffling question
          Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

          You might need to use the page tool to resize those pages if they don't respond to document setup.

          2 people found this helpful
          • 2. Re: Page shuffling question
            Abambo Level 4

            You will organize the pages as this, because you want to print them as a 3 page folder (in French: 3 volets - 3 parts). For this to work, you need to shorten the inner sheets a little bit (1-2mm, verkürzt). When you change the page size, only standard pages will be changed. The 2 non-standard pages keep their size.

            • 3. Re: Page shuffling question
              Laubender Adobe Community Professional & MVP

              joet082964 wrote:

              … They are created as 6 individual A4 pages, and printed as a 3-panel brochure.


              I doubt that. At least that part, that is saying: "A4".

              You can only be accurate on identifying the size of all pages in a document, if you individually go from page to page with the Page Tool and check the dimensions of the selected page.


              You cannot define individual page sizes if you create a new document.

              Your screenshot is showing a layout where I assume that it was started with a new A4 document with non-facing pages where all pages are A4. Later the document was changed to show facing pages. I'm not sure, but the order of the shown masters in your screenshot is indicating that.


              Later in the process of building, two sections were made in the Pages Panel to reflect the numbering of the pages after the brochure is folded:


              Spread 1, pages: 5-6, 1, applied masters: G, H, A

              Spread 2, pages: 2-4, applied masters: B, C, F


              Section 1 contains pages 5-6

              Section 2 contains pages 1-4


              Please show all of your master pages in a screenshot. That would make it more clear what's going on.


              Why do not all pages respond, if you change the document to a new size?
              That's a question that is still not discussed in depth here.


              Only the named pages 1 and 2 should show the Letter format after you are changing the document's page size globally.

              InDesign will not override the individual sizes pages, if they are based on individual sized masters.


              See the following screenshot where I set up a situation like that.

              But with the difference, that I used "Facing Pages" from the start to minimize the number of necessary master spreads.

              Since InDesign will not allow of two spines in one spread, one could debate where the one allowed spine exactly should be positioned, but this discussion would be fruitless, I think.


              1. Started out with a 6 pages A4 document with two sections:



              2. Added some masters, changed the width of the masters, named all the masters accordingly:



              3. Changed the document page size from A4 to Letter:





              4. Here the result.

              Note, that as a next step I should change the width of master B and C and rename all the masters.




              To get the values for the individual width of your masters B and C consult your printers.



              • 4. Re: Page shuffling question
                Laubender Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                I said:
                "You cannot define individual page sizes if you create a new document."


                What I really meant was:
                "You cannot define several page sizes for several pages in one document, if you create a new one".



                • 5. Re: Page shuffling question
                  Laubender Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                  Important note:

                  With step 4 I only illustrated one possible workflow and I wanted to show, that individual sized pages will not follow the new document page size.


                  Warning: It's not wise to follow the workflow in step 4.
                  This is due to a bug with master pages where objects on the masters could change their position on the pages where the masters are applied.


                  Instead resize all the masters individually with the Page Tool.

                  Masters for the named pages 1 and 2 to the Letter format.

                  Masters for the named pages 6, 3 to a shorter width.

                  Masters for the named pages 5, 4 to an even shorter width than the masters of pages 6, 3.



                  The exact values will depend on the used paper and the cutting and folding workflow of your printing service.

                  Consult your printing service on that!



                  1 person found this helpful
                  • 6. Re: Page shuffling question
                    joet082964 Level 3

                    Thanks so much - your responses answer #2 about the pages sizes not all changing using Document Setup.


                    On my question #1 - I know how, but not sure why the [5-6-1 /  2-3-4] page order.   Is that simply because that's the understood order of panels in a folding brochure? For example, the front cover is 1 and the back cover is 6 in this case? If that's true, this is more of "good housekeeping" than necessity, correct?

                    • 7. Re: Page shuffling question
                      Laubender Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                      It'll be a necessity, if you communicate with the customer and the customer will likely name the title "page one". And the last one is likely to be named "page 6". And that's the one you can see, if you turn the brochure after it is folded. All other page names simply follow.




                      • 8. Re: Page shuffling question
                        Abambo Level 4

                        Exact. We have our folders [1-2-3] [4-5-6] and that works also. Only when creating the pdf without spread (pages) you need to keep in mind to do it the right order or you need to shuffle pages later in Acrobat.


                        I even was not conscious that this was possible. But I'm coming the whole way from Ventura to InDesign 1.0 up to InDesign CC. And a few month ago, I was still on CS5. May be it was not possible then. I need to investigate this.