1 2 3 Previous Next 168 Replies Latest reply on Aug 18, 2017 11:11 AM by R Neil Haugen Branched to a new discussion.

    Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility

    Seneca_lives Level 1

      The latest PPro update (2015.3, updated today) creates project files that can't be read by the latest version of Speedgrade (not updated today or since whenever). It also removes the "Direct Link to Speedgrade" option from its menus. This means, that as of today, Adobe is effectively without a color grading solution.

       

      The new PPro does provide support for Tangent control surfaces - including full customization through the Tangent Mapper application - which is in itself a very good thing. However, this was apparently enough for Adobe to decide that Direct Link and Speedgrade are no longer needed and this is simply not the case.

       

      This leaves any remaining Speedgrade users and colorists in general with very few options:

       

      1. For now, I recommend you reinstall the 2015.2 versions of Premiere/AE/AME through Creative Cloud to finish any current projects - they can exist side by side, at least - but that still means missing out on any new features and compatibility with client files. This is clearly not a sustainable solution. And Premiere versions are linked to After Effects versions, so you'll also lose out there...

       

      2. Use Speedgrade the old-fashioned way, in native mode, using EDLs or exporting DPX. Which was never an ideal solution back in de CS6 days, but the world has moved on even if Speedgrade hasn't, and Speedgrade has no way of dealing with many more recent file formats (MXF being the most prominent). Sad to say this is simply not an option on many projects. Never mind that the roundtrip functionality and flexibility of Direct Link is gone, which was really Speedgrade's biggest selling point.

       

      3. Try to grade in Premiere. Not really an option for serious work: Premiere's Lumetri implementation currently lacks support for layers (other than by clumsily stacking Lumetri effects), grading shadows/midtones/highlights separately as well as setting their ranges, and basic 2-up/3-up/snapshot functionality. I'm sure I can think of many more. Point is, as a color grading application the Lumetri Panel is a joke, a slightly better version of the plug-in effects that amateur colorists used to apply per-clip.

       

      4. Jump ship. I've resisted this for a long time, as it would mean investing in new control surfaces, but Adobe's neglect has gotten to a breaking point. I'd resigned myself to the fact that Speedgrade would continue as a zombie application, never updated and slowly forgotten. Alas, even that was too much to ask.

        • 1. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
          Peferling Level 4

          I would say to roll back to what works for your pipeline, unless your priorities dictate otherwise.  I've been on 2014.2 for some time now, and do plan to test a move up to 2015.3 for proxies in lieu of 4k.  However, stability is my top priority with regards to getting paid.  Should 2015.3 prove otherwise, then rolling back is the only option as other options would involve drastic changes and introduce their own set of issues.  No thanks.

          • 2. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
            Seneca_lives Level 1

            Absolutely agree. The proxies for 4K work were my main reason for trying 2015.3, but I'd got used to making proxies manually. There are also some very interesting speed benefits to using After Effects 2015.3, so I suppose I'll be looking at using AE without Dynamic Link (exporting the effect and importing into older versions of Premiere).

            • 3. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
              R Neil Haugen Adobe Community Professional & MVP

              Interesting. Down at NAB, I asked about whether Sg would still be available Direct Link from PrPro in 2016, and well, no one would answer directly, but implied, probably yes, for now ... sort of.

               

              Much of the 2016 functionality seems to have rolled out with 2015.3 ... which is ... intriguing ... and you're right, there's no Sg Direct Link ... just don't know what to say right now.

               

              Neil

              • 4. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                ToolzVFX Level 1

                Hi all, not sure how may this will help but if like me and may others upgraded to 2015.3 but want to roll back to 2015.2 you can check out this forum post i had an adobe staff member put up FAQ: How do I reinstall Premiere Pro CC 2015.2 (9.2)?  not sure how many this will help but sure helped me get back to work

                I guess yelling on twitter has it's upsides

                 

                Update: the adobe rep says  "This isn't an issue; it is by design. Direct Link is no longer available in Premiere Pro 2015.3. " personally i think it is a real bad move making this pro app feal more like a lite version

                2 people found this helpful
                • 5. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                  Seneca_lives Level 1

                  While there are some unattractive workarounds (grade in Premiere for "less serious" work, continue using the older versions with manual proxies if needed, export through Sg with EDLs, etc.), the frustrating thing is that you'd have to make this call upfront for each individual project. And then there are situations where there's no simple solution at all - e.g., if a client provides a 2015.3 or newer PPro project file, especially if the source files are MXF. And I'm 99% certain that something like that will be coming my way in the coming year.

                   

                  Already looking into lossless transcoding or remuxing utilities to convert MXF files to MP4 or MOV, just to keep the EDL route open for now.

                  2 people found this helpful
                  • 6. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                    CineCicale45

                    Just to clarify, the Dynamic Link feature with Ae and Au are still available in the new release. However SG Direct Link is very unfortunately gone.

                    • 7. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                      CineCicale45 Level 1

                      Has anyone heard anything official from Adobe as to what their plans are for Speedgrade??

                       

                      I upgraded looking forward to the new features just to learn that I need to roll back for most projects due to this feature loss. I like the lumetri panel for minor touch ups and the new HSL secondary feature is useful, however the current state of Lumetri Panel does not really compete with a dedicated Color Grade software.

                      • 8. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                        Seneca_lives Level 1

                        Also, a little experiment: I tried to "emulate" Speedgrade's functionality in Premiere. Created a new workspace that matched my own Speedgrade layout and mapped my control surface the best I could.

                         

                        Well, it works, sort of, in a very clunky way:

                         

                        - There's still a lot of clutter, even if you close all the non-essential panels. Shortcut keys may or may not work depending on what windows you last clicked in. However, by mapping the control surface wheels to work in every mode, I can, at least, simply select a clip and perform basic grading.

                         

                        - By combining the Program Monitor / Reference Monitor / Source Monitor I can create basic 2-up / 3-up / snapshot functionality (not through Mercury Transmit, though).

                         

                        - The convenient Numpad-0 key to Bypass in Sg can be emulated either through the control surface or keyboard, BUT it will only work when the Lumetri Color panel is active. I mapped another key on the control surface to "make Lumetri Color active". I haven't managed to get Solo Mode to work, or I'm misunderstanding how it works in Premiere.

                         

                        - Layer functionality can be achieved by stacking Lumetri effects, but since each Lumetri effect consists of six "modes", it's incredibly hard to see what a particular effect is actually doing. Confusingly, the layer order is the opposite of what it is in Speedgrade (top-down rather than bottom-up). No grouping of layers, no sharing of masks. I strongly suggest renaming each effect.

                         

                        - You can assign the various Lumetri sliders to the control surface knobs. Unfortunately, the documentation in Premiere is clear as mud as to what they do. It seems that temperature is a basic blue/orange control, tint a basic green/magenta and saturation is INPUT saturation (since Premiere processes the sliders before the color wheels). Contrast is a basic pivot control, or maybe a gamma control that mainly affects the midtones? Exposure brightens or darkens the entire image, but "soft-shoulders" to reduce clipping. Shadows/Highlights are gamma controls that only affect the shadows and highlights respectively and Blacks/Whites are gamma controls near the edge of clipping.

                         

                        In all, not exactly a great grading experience, putting it mildly. Worse, a few things which absolutely do NOT work:

                         

                        - Separate grading of Shadows / Midtones / Highlights and setting their respective ranges. This is the real dealbreaker. At the moment, there's just no way to get these controls in Premiere. I'm sure their "effect" can be approximated, at least in terms of luma, by using the shadows/highlights/whites/blacks/contrast/exposure sliders, but it's a fundamentally different approach in that it logically precedes the colorwheel grading rather than acting as a refinement to it. Also, it feels like giving up a lot of control and speed. I don't think there's a way in which the effect can be approximated for chroma. (I don't even want to consider using HSL secondaries for this!)

                         

                        - Mask controls for control surfaces. Premiere has it own mask controls and they're mouse-driven and cannot be mapped onto the control surface. I'm a bit torn about this one, because while I really miss the trackball-and-ring adjustment of masks, Premiere's mask functionality (and especially its keyframing and tracking) is a lot more robust than Speedgrade's and works like other Adobe products.

                         

                        - Copying grades is tricky. Browsing saved .look files is very inconvenient. It's not possible to export a single .look or .cube for a stack of effects. Also, you need to watch the order in which effects are applied.

                         

                        On the positive side:

                         

                        - Grading is finally possible on master clips for merged clips

                        - Grading not brought to its knees by LUTs or complex timelines (DirectLink was always a terrible slog)

                        - Premiere's masking engine is easier, better than Speedgrade's ever was

                        - Many of Premiere's effects are superior to Speedgrade's

                        - Easy vignetting

                         

                        If Adobe could somehow add ranged grading to the Lumetri effects (perhaps hidden behind a checkbox) and make stacking grading effects more manageable and transparent, it would be almost usable. I'd have enjoyed giving it a try in CC 2017. But to lose Speedgrade DirectLink for this... very infurating.

                         

                        EDITED: I originally wrote that multiple effects couldn't be stacked into a single preset, which fortunately isn't the case.

                        2 people found this helpful
                        • 9. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                          CineCicale45 Level 1

                          Just spoke to Adobe Support and while they couldnt give me details on the fate of Speedgrade, they did say Direct Link would not be making a comeback. So my guess is if you have Speedgrade 2015, you can put it on the shelf next to Final Cut Pro 7, cause neither look to be getting updates in their lifetime.

                          • 10. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                            Seneca_lives Level 1

                            Thanks for contacting Adobe, CineCicale45. No real surprise, was always afraid of that, but I'd assumed the basic functionality would stay at least until Speedgrade had been completely absorbed into Premiere.

                            • 11. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                              David_V_Clarke Level 3

                              You can save multiple effect presets.  Just select multiple effects in the effects control window by selecting one, holding ctrl and selecting a second and then choose save preset.

                              • 13. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                tclark513 Level 3

                                CineCicale45 wrote:

                                 

                                Just spoke to Adobe Support and while they couldnt give me details on the fate of Speedgrade, they did say Direct Link would not be making a comeback. So my guess is if you have Speedgrade 2015, you can put it on the shelf next to Final Cut Pro 7, cause neither look to be getting updates in their lifetime.

                                 

                                What a major CROCK!  I don't subscribe to the CC model but like to check in once in a while to see what the new versions bring and I can't believe ADOBE would remove this feature let alone not tell anybody in advance.

                                If I remember correctly that was a huge selling point when announced.

                                 

                                I feel sorry for the people who used that major feature and have it ripped from them.

                                Let's hope there is more to the story.

                                1 person found this helpful
                                • 14. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                  Kevin-Monahan Adobe Employee

                                  CineCicale,

                                  Just spoke to Adobe Support and while they couldnt give me details on the fate of Speedgrade, they did say Direct Link would not be making a comeback.

                                   

                                  Right. We in support can give no info on the future of any application, feature set, etc. and that's under NDA. Sorry about that.

                                   

                                  So my guess is if you have Speedgrade 2015, you can put it on the shelf next to Final Cut Pro 7, cause neither look to be getting updates in their lifetime.

                                   

                                  We haven't made any announcements along these lines. You can still file feature requests and bug reports. Feel free. You can also contact support for any issues.

                                   

                                  Thanks,
                                  Kevin

                                  • 15. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                    Kevin-Monahan Adobe Employee

                                    TClark,

                                    I can't believe ADOBE would remove this feature let alone not tell anybody in advance.

                                    If I remember correctly that was a huge selling point when announced.

                                     

                                    I feel sorry for the people who used that major feature and have it ripped from them.

                                    Let's hope there is more to the story.

                                     

                                    Most of the basic functionality with Direct Link is available in the Lumetri panel. You can still use SpeedGrade via traditional import methods (EDL, etc.). We know we still have work to do to make the Lumetri panel more workable. File bugs and feature requests here.

                                     

                                    Thanks,
                                    Kevin

                                    • 16. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                      taeke63 Level 1

                                      It's sad to see this Directlink disappear, as I prefered using Speedgrade above Lumetri. It's also possible to do an export to Resolve, so I think that'll bemy option from now on. It's really a shame though.

                                      • 17. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                        capitalk Level 1

                                        it's really a shame, as much as I appreciate adobe and the efforts that they put to better their products. I could have used a bit of a heads up. I could see that they were trying to transfer all the tools to premiere but at least they could have tried to let speedgrade be compatible to these new updates and on top of that               no heads up.                          Come on guys please dont become apple

                                        1 person found this helpful
                                        • 18. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                          gjamesmoore Level 1

                                          This is absolutely wild...to my mind, I cannot think of another time when Adobe downgraded their products with an update.  Always been pleased with upgrades.  Direct Link was the ONE thing Speedgrade had going for it over Resolve.  This will force 100% of our color grading into Resolve.  Absolute lunacy.

                                          1 person found this helpful
                                          • 19. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                            Seneca_lives Level 1

                                            I’ve been getting a sinking feeling that Speedgrade was about to be ditched or deprecated for a while now, but I figured it would still be usable, like other abandoned Adobe software (Encore).

                                             

                                            And sure, Adobe still provide the old version of Speedgrade to finish existing work in - but since Creative Cloud comes with free updates, most Premiere users will soon be working in 2015.3 and there's just no way to get a 2015.3 Premiere edit into Speedgrade.

                                             

                                            Resolve, meanwhile, is pretty much free. I can see why this may seem a threat to Adobe and I completely understand why they'd want to compete with Blackmagic's "grading application that now doubles as an NLE" by turning Premiere into an "NLE that now doubles as a grading application". Problem is, it's just not there yet.

                                            • 20. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                              nathaningalls Level 1

                                              I think that the best route to take now is to send our feedback to Adobe via the "Feature Request" form. Perhaps if they get enough backlash to this downgrade they will rethink things. I agree with gjamesmoore that this is totally crazy and will force almost all of my projects into resolve, even smaller ones. The lumetri controls in Premiere just aren't anywhere near up to par. In case anyone is interested, here is the feature request that I sent to Adobe:

                                               

                                              "Why is this feature important to you?

                                               

                                               

                                              My name is Nathan and I am a filmmaker (primarily documentary and short form) based in Los Angeles. I felt the need to reach out to the Adobe CC Premiere/Speedgrade team to voice my concern for the most recent update (2015.3).

                                               

                                               

                                              Our generation remembers Final Cut 7 as a wonderful piece of editing software. It was a fantastic interface that created an awesome editing experience. It was an incredible tool. Then Apple introduced Final Cut X. They abandoned the professional (and even semi-professional) editor in favor of an editing system that allowed you to take your vacation videos and add some really cool, pre-built titles, transitions and filters. This slight exaggeration is sad because it is just that - a slight exaggeration. Final Cut became a joke, and the fact that it was once a space that embraced filmmakers rather than repulsed them certainly marred its legacy. 

                                               

                                               

                                              In the midst of that dark time - filmmakers around the world began to search for an alternative. And you, Adobe, stepped in. You rallied behind filmmakers and created an editing suite that embraced the Final Cut community while remaining your own platform. You truly innovated - creating tools that worked together so seamlessly. CS, and eventually CC, allowed us to create things within different programs each designed to expertly accomplish one part of the creation process. Individual, specialty parts that combined to make a beautiful whole. This truly was innovative.

                                               

                                               

                                              I think that innovation is an important part of any company's product. Innovation often allows for more imagination, more creativity and better art. But there comes a point, if a company caters more to "the new" than "the effective," that innovation ceases to inspire. It instead tears a hole in a healthy, functioning system.

                                               

                                               

                                              This is my current frustration with CC 2015.3. I work on many different projects at any given time. I appreciate some of the elements that have been brought into Premiere to make it a one-stop shop of sorts. Some projects really benefit from this. However, your decision to remove the "direct link" between Premiere and Speedgrade is proving detrimental to my workflow (as well as many others based on your own forums). And not only did you remove the direct link between these two programs that worked so well together, but you failed to incorporate many of the elements that make Speedgrade an effective coloring solution.

                                               

                                               

                                              If I am unaware of a new feature that allows the two programs to integrate as seamlessly as they did before, I would really love for you to bring it to the CC community's attention. If not - please consider reincorporating this feature. The need for excellent coloring on a tight schedule is so important in this age of different cameras, different media formats, log, RAW, etc. Premiere's coloring capabilities are not sufficient to create a quality, final product.

                                               

                                               

                                              I don't mean to rant and I hope this is read as an earnest request from a customer who loves the work that your team does. Thank you for hearing my request.

                                               

                                               

                                              Best,

                                              Nathan"

                                              4 people found this helpful
                                              • 21. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                                benjamino5

                                                Even though Adobe is keeping silent about this, I think the only safe conclusion to draw is that SpeedGrade has very likely been discontinued, and they haven't (for whatever reason) chosen to publicly announce that yet.

                                                 

                                                It's sad, because Dynamic Link to a color correction app was such a cool feature. But it seems like they'll spend the next couple of years integrating more and more of SpeedGrade into Premiere. Whether it will ever match SpeedGrade or not, who knows...

                                                 

                                                At least we all have Resolve to use instead!

                                                • 22. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                                  Seneca_lives Level 1

                                                  Update: In case anyone was thinking of going the EDL route with a current project, I recommend you save yourself a lot of frustration and just... don't:

                                                   

                                                  - It doesn't work at all with many current formats, i.e. .mxf files in general, but also certains .mov files, depending on the codec

                                                  - You must flatten the edit to a single video track, everything else is ignored

                                                  - You must remove every transition, effect, title and mask, or Speedgrade won't open the file

                                                  - Render and Replace won't work to avoid this (because it produces .mxf and .mov files that Speedgrade can't read)

                                                  - ...so you must either pre-render and replace manually (only thing I could come up with: replace with AE composition, render AE composition in a format Speedgrade can read, import back into Premiere)

                                                  - It's a one-way trip. Want to make the slightest change to the edit and you can start grading all over

                                                   

                                                  Or, if you have a few hours and a few TB to spare, you can export your projects as DPX files. You'll lose all the edit and source file information in the process, but it should work...

                                                  • 23. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                                    Seneca_lives Level 1

                                                    And some more findings on trying to use Lumetri:

                                                     

                                                    - The color wheels act as Lift/Gamma/Gain controls, whereas Speedgrade provides Offset/Gamma/Gain. This accounts for what "feels" to me like a lack of control in places. There are no Offset controls anywhere in Lumetri. (Well, ok, I suppose you can use Curves to draw and shift a straight line with a slope of 1, but that's not exactly how I'd use Offset...)

                                                     

                                                    - There is no output saturation control. (Well, ok, if you select nothing in HSL Secondaries and then Invert, you get an extra level of control within Lumetri, which could function as output saturation. Much more of a hassle than turning a knob...)

                                                     

                                                    - The range of the luma sliders for the color wheels is limited to what's visible in the interface. In Speedgrade, you can keep turning the rings/knobs on your control surface, but in Lumetri they just... stop. This means that when the source video has low dynamic range, it's really not possible to grade using the color wheels only. Apparently, Basic Corrections are expected to do the heavy lifting, Color Wheels are the refinement.

                                                     

                                                    - Unchecking "Clamp signal" on the scopes is meaningless in most situations, since Lumetri normally never lets you exceed 1.0 or drop below 0.0. You can see if there's detail blown out by checking HDR and keeping the scopes set to Float. (But this disables any LUTs you may have, so it's self-defeating.) Even in HDR mode, you will never see any detail below 0.0, because there are no Offset controls.

                                                     

                                                    - Various settings which can be assigned to control surfaces (Bypass, Master Clip...) only work if Lumetri Color is the active panel. You can assign a keyboard shortcut to switch to Lumetri, but that's still two keypresses where one sufficed in Speedgrade.

                                                     

                                                    - The HSL Secondaries mode lets you switch between one and three color wheels, with one being the default - regardless, if you've assigned HSL color wheels to your control surface, they _will_ work without switching to three first.

                                                     

                                                    - Solo mode is about de-cluttering the Lumetri panel, not turning effects on or off individually.

                                                    • 24. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                                      David Bullock Level 1

                                                      Er, well I guess I'll un-install Sg then (which is still offered by my CC panel as being an app worth installing after I'd installed the latest Pr), and I'll forgo watching the rest of the tutorial (which links to this forum, but contains no notice that it is not possible to use Sg with the latest version of Pr).  And generally just curse Adobe wasting my time with its poor communication?

                                                       

                                                      Seriously, I DO expect a note somewhere saying something like 'Recent releases of Pr are moving away from the Direct Link technology, which has the consequence that Sg will no longer work as described in this tutorial.  While we are working furiously to improve the grading experience in Pr, we recommend using the native grading tools available in Pr for new projects.  If you already have an active project which relies on Sg, we suggest you downgrade Pr."  That's just common courtesy.

                                                      • 25. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                                        Kevin-Monahan Adobe Employee

                                                        Hi David,

                                                        Seriously, I DO expect a note somewhere saying something like 'Recent releases of Pr are moving away from the Direct Link technology, which has the consequence that Sg will no longer work as described in this tutorial.

                                                         

                                                        Thanks. I've forwarded your concerns to the product team.

                                                         

                                                        Regards,
                                                        Kevin

                                                        • 26. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                                          dummergold Level 4

                                                          thank-you Seneca_lives for your post and generating other voices with this Direct link to SpeedGrade being removed from Premiere Pro 2015.3

                                                           

                                                          I am now mostly updated in the Adobe Creative Cloud Apps to the Premiere Pro 2015.3, with the After Effects,  Audition, but greatly missing SpeedGrade.

                                                           

                                                          I have followed link to future request to add my voice

                                                          • 27. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                                            lukaszbanach Level 1

                                                            Abandoning speedgrade will cause my drift for davinci resolve and canceling cc subscription (exept ps perhaps). Speedgrade direct link was the most powerful tool for real speedgrading. Current state of lumetri in premiere is not enough, and there will never be multiple playheads in premiere. So many people is now raging about your decision to ditch sg direct link, you will surely see it in sales' statistics. Perhaps there is some adobe's internal financial problem with sg team, optimization of dev costs, or some legal issues generating too much costs of keeping sg an active piece of CC, but end-users will never know the real reasons... Direct link made grading lightspeed. Now it is clumsy and premiere will need 5 years to recover this great asset with lumetri. Good bye Multiple playheads guys...it was such a great invention. And most recent reports with huge lumetri memory leaks in 2015.3 makes premiere such an crippled tool. Someone in your company will be fired for this decision, in 2017, I presume ;) Ive filled feature request, but I am certain that sg direct link is dead forever. What is the next step? To make photoshop an nle soft? There is timeline already there and more video features in PS... Who knows the plans of Adobe, premiereshop perhaps? Sure, You can make a hammer with a chainsaw feature, but...

                                                            • 28. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                                              patshiPJZ Level 1

                                                              Hi All!

                                                               

                                                              I posted this in another adobe thread already but I think it is important to post it here too.

                                                               

                                                              The idea of developing Lumetri Panel further towards a serious grading panel is ok, but not like this way by locking out Speedgrade completely by making some changes in the project file format to make it incompatible to Speedgrade.

                                                               

                                                              Why not making a smooth transition by have them booth, Speedgrade AND Lumetri Panel so users can use what they need.

                                                              Adobe needs better communication to it's user base and make clear statements that Speedgrade is coming to an end and that Lumetri Panel will replace it some time in the future. But Speedgrade needs to stay compatible for people whowants the power of Speedgrade which Lumetri Panel does not have!

                                                               

                                                              Please Adobe if you want to keep users using your software and not alienating people revert the Premiere Project File format to the previous one, or just release a patch for speedgrade to make it readable again (I'm sure it's mainly a versioning thing) and we can keep using Speedgrade (even the current version) until the Lumetri Panel is ready for primetime.

                                                               

                                                              I've written about my thoughts about this on my blog too:

                                                              Adobe, why do you kill Speedgrade?

                                                               

                                                              Greets,

                                                              Patrick

                                                              1 person found this helpful
                                                              • 29. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                                                Kevin-Monahan Adobe Employee

                                                                Hi lukaszbanach,

                                                                Ive filled feature request

                                                                 

                                                                Thanks for your feedback.

                                                                 

                                                                Regards,
                                                                Kevin

                                                                • 30. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                                                  Kevin-Monahan Adobe Employee

                                                                  Hi Patrick,

                                                                  • Why not making a smooth transition by have them booth, Speedgrade AND Lumetri Panel so users can use what they need
                                                                  • Adobe needs better communication to it's user base and make clear statements that Speedgrade is coming to an end and that Lumetri Panel will replace it some time in the future.
                                                                  • Speedgrade needs to stay compatible for people whowants the power of Speedgrade which Lumetri Panel does not have!
                                                                  • If you want to keep users using your software and not alienating people revert the Premiere Project File format to the previous one, or just release a patch for speedgrade to make it readable again (I'm sure it's mainly a versioning thing) and we can keep using Speedgrade (even the current version) until the Lumetri Panel is ready for primetime.

                                                                   

                                                                  Please compile your ideas in a bug report and send it along to the team. They probably won't read this forum post, but they will read a bug report.

                                                                   

                                                                  Thanks,
                                                                  Kevin

                                                                  1 person found this helpful
                                                                  • 31. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                                                    Seneca_lives Level 1

                                                                    Hi Patrick,

                                                                     

                                                                    Absolutely agree. Alas, a patch will probably mean restoring a lot of code to Premiere that's been removed in this version (because in Direct Link, Premiere does a lot of the heavy lifting and passes the frames on to Speedgrade), so I'm not very hopeful that this can be fixed by Speedgrade ignoring the PPro version in the file.

                                                                     

                                                                    it's a textbook "New Coke" case... I expect Adobe got positive feedback on the planned changes to Lumetri, but the question they asked was probably closer to "Do you like these changes?" or even "If you could use a control surface in Premiere, would you be able to grade like this?" I'm pretty sure they didn't ask: "If we make these changes, are you ok with losing Speedgrade and using this exclusively?"

                                                                     

                                                                    I still get Adobe's strategy here, but I think they've made a terrible tactical error. They've managed to create a number of situations where it's possible that there's suddenly no realistic way to meet a client's needs within the Adobe environment. Worse, everyone is upgrading at once, increasing the risk of such a client showing up, meaning that colorist need to start taking measures today to find some non-Adobe plan B. (I think the past week accounts for more mentions of Resolve on this forum than all the previous years combined.)

                                                                     

                                                                    It's possible that Adobe just considers the "pro colorist" or "serious colorist" market to be too small to matter. Which might be an understandable business decision, but then maybe they shouldn't have included a pro colorist tool in their suite and marketed it as such...

                                                                    1 person found this helpful
                                                                    • 32. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                                                      Shane P Level 3

                                                                      I think Speedgrade and Prelude are both getting sent to the "Trash/Recycle Bin". As soon as Adobe starting advertising that they integrating Proxy workflows into Pr and AME, and with introduction of Lumetri in PR last year, I think the writing was on the wall for Speedgrade and Prelude.

                                                                       

                                                                      Hopefully they will rethink the SG integration. Reminds me of what happened with Audition about 10 years or so ago. I recall Adobe dumped Audition in favor of the watered down Soundbooth then a few years later Audition was back.

                                                                       

                                                                      I too feel like this version of PP (2015.3) was a step forward but also took a step backward. I just can't wrap my head around where on Earth Adobe would think the the Lumetri color panel is a replacement for SpeedGrade.

                                                                       

                                                                      I mean really....Photoshop, Illustrator, After Effects have been industry leaders for a couple decades now. Adobe wanted Premiere to be "The Photoshop of Video"...well they have been making good headway on that over the last several years and now they pull this nonsense?

                                                                      • 33. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                                                        Seneca_lives Level 1

                                                                        Yep, I remember (the old) Audition, Encore, OnLocation... but you could still use the software to import/export whatever you were working on, just minus some of the linking functionality. Audition never got its MIDI back, but it didn't break any workflows. Lots of alternatives to Encore, both pro mastering and freeware. It's unprecedented what Adobe did here.

                                                                        • 34. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                                                          lukaszbanach Level 1

                                                                          I am finishing a 4 years work on 2-hour feature/documentary film and this

                                                                          I've started to play around with davinci resolve studio 12.5 yesterday (I have studio version for some reason). It is very easy to learn to the point that simple grading tasks are possible - it is faster than sg in 4k smooth playback via gpu. Adding/removing grain is very fast, task which was unable at all in speedgrade. And seems to be more stable, but worse in digesting various formats. There is many things located in different parts of menus, but I think after one week you can easily switch from adobe to davinci to be able doing simple grading/editing. You can be sure that blackmagic is not going to make such a movement in the future because of more ad and movie industry professionals are using davinci nowadays. Blackmagic cant afford for such a movements and for years they just polish and consistently upgrade Davinci without any negative revolutions.  Adobe seems it can't decide with premiere - to be for pro industry or just as a fast editing solution for bloggers. Ditching Speedgrade link and going lumetri seems to be their slowly drift towards bloggers and less demanding users (on the other hands, bloggers rarely edit in 4k), which was the bad case of Final Cut we all remember from the past.

                                                                           

                                                                          I think you should give it a try and decide for yourself. Davinci is free in standard version, which is huge anyway.

                                                                          It's just reaction for their unprecedented revolutions

                                                                          • 35. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                                                            Seneca_lives Level 1

                                                                            To be honest, main reason why I'm not moving all color work to Resolve right now is that it doesn't support my CP200 setup and I don't want to have to spend around $3500 to get more or less the same functionality from the Element or "downgrade" to the Wave.

                                                                             

                                                                            Also, my biggest gripe with the Lumetri Panel is that it doesn't support Speedgrade's ranged grading... but then, neither does Resolve (except through secondaries and selections, which takes the intuitiveness out of it).

                                                                             

                                                                            Not sure if Adobe is really trying to appeal primarily to the blogger / occasional editor / Elements crowd with this. Of course they want to get as many new users as possible into Creative Cloud (and then keep them there, with new goodies like the Lumetri Panel), but seems to me there's no point in chasing casual users that aren't likely to spend $600/year on software. But with or without Speedgrade, most of us on this forum will probably still need the CC ecosystem for other work. So we're not really a "flight risk" they have to worry about.

                                                                             

                                                                            (And if you're exclusively a colorist, working in a larger studio and without the need for the rest of CC, I suspect you're probably not using Sg in Direct Link mode anyway...)

                                                                            • 36. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                                                              warrenr16841418

                                                                              Adding my voice here that this was a very unwelcome "upgrade" and the lack of communication is frustrating.

                                                                              • 37. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                                                                gjamesmoore Level 1

                                                                                How is this applicable to this discussion?  And why was it labeled the "Correct Answer"?

                                                                                • 38. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                                                                  Seneca_lives Level 1

                                                                                  In addition to my earlier litany of complaints about Lumetri as a grading solution - and if anyone else wants to submit these as feature requests, I'm encouraging you to do so! - here's some more wonderful surprises:

                                                                                   

                                                                                  - Lumetri "protects" a novice colorist from taking the image "too far" using the various Basic Corrections; most of the controls seem to "roll off" or "soft shoulder" aggressively rather than just behaving as advertised.

                                                                                   

                                                                                  - Which means that there is no way to push information out of bounds (where you can see how much detail is crushed or blown out), not even temporarily, say while you work on another part of the image. You just have to trust that Lumetri knows what's best. Weirdly, you can still reach illegal color saturation levels, if you really try hard. And in my experience, those have a larger chance of generating unpredictable results. Not sure how any of this relates to Premiere's "video limiter" effect and media export settings.

                                                                                   

                                                                                  - The ranges of the controls that _do_ somewhat behave as advertised are limited to the point of being useless (luma sliders on color wheels). It seems that their range has actually decreased vs. PPro 2015.2.

                                                                                   

                                                                                  - Any changes made through the control surface don't have an "undo"! It means that you can't make multiple changes to a color setting and step back through your changes, you have to reset the entire "mode". And if you hit undo out of habit, you'll probably just undo your last keyboard action. Hope you can remember what that was and hope you even notice the change right away.

                                                                                   

                                                                                  - The control surface will only ever affect the lowest Lumetri Effect in the stack. No way around this.

                                                                                   

                                                                                  - Which means that, if you want to grade using a control surface, you're limited to ONE primary and ONE secondary. Or maybe just one primary, period, because you may need to use the secondary to reach an acceptable range for your basic controls. Or maybe not even that, if you want to use a mask.

                                                                                   

                                                                                  I've tried to keep an open mind, but I just can't imagine doing any kind of semi-serious or client work in this environment. And even for dead simple work, I find myself wondering why I'm wasting all this energy on accomplishing something I could literally do with the spin of a wheel in a dedicated application. So I've begun to advise my regular clients not to start any work in PPro 2015.3 at all for now, just to keep an escape route open. In fact, I'm advising them not to install it to begin with, just to prevent any accidental "upgrades" of project files. The reason I sadly have to give is:

                                                                                   

                                                                                  "Adobe currently provides NO way to perform ANY kind of quality color grading on Premiere Pro 2015.3 projects. Oh, there is a cumbersome, unreliable workaround that will cost either or both of us a lot of time and effort; and for it to work, your project ideally shouldn't have any effects or transitions, and it absolutely cannot contain .mxf files, or .mov or .mp4 files in the wrong codec, say, ProRes, or Cineform, and it also requires you to have a 100% picture lock. And if you're unfortunate enough to have already started work in 2015.3, the simplest and, yes, cheapest alternative is to export the whole project to grade in a rival NLE that Adobe would presumably prefer you didn't use."

                                                                                   

                                                                                  Madness.

                                                                                  4 people found this helpful
                                                                                  • 39. Re: Warning: Premiere Pro 2015.3 removes Speedgrade integration and has no backward compatibility
                                                                                    Kevin-Monahan Adobe Employee

                                                                                    Hi Seneca_lives,

                                                                                    Madness.

                                                                                     

                                                                                    Please copy/paste these shortcomings into a bug report. Thanks for your excellent feedback.

                                                                                     

                                                                                    Regards,
                                                                                    Kevin

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