10 Replies Latest reply on Jun 22, 2016 3:13 PM by urrod

    New PC build: Invest in NVME M.2 worth it?

    xencreative Level 1

      Hi guys,

       

      I'm about to build a new pc mainly for PS / ILL / ID.  So far I've compiled the following list of parts:

       

      Intel Core i7-6700K

      AsRock Fatal1ty Z170 Mobo (3 nvme sockets)

      64gb G.Skill 2400-15 Ripjaws V K2

      Asus Strix GTX 960 4GB

      Corsair RM650x 650w psu

       

      Now the problem is the drives, my budget allows to add:

       

      OS: Samsung 950 Pro 512 GB

      Scratch / Libraries / ...: Samsung 950 Pro 256 GB

      Project Files: Samsung 850 Pro 512GB

       

      But, Ive been reading a lot about NVME ssd's and some claim they would help a lot with io-intensive operations, but would not give a big speed boost i.e. when handling big files in ILL / PS.

       

      So the question is:  If I were to buy them, how many, for what use (os/scratch/project files), and if not is the money better spent on another upgrade?

        • 1. Re: New PC build: Invest in NVME M.2 worth it?
          Bill Gehrke Adobe Community Professional & MVP

          I guess you do not know that the Samsung 950 Pro SSD's are M.2 NVME SSD's

           

          (There is no such thing as a NVMe socket)  Be careful because the use of those M.2 connectors disable SATA ports

           

          I think you are treading on dangerous ground from these oversights trying to build your own computer.

          • 2. Re: New PC build: Invest in NVME M.2 worth it?
            RoninEdits Most Valuable Participant

            some drives only hit their top rated speeds when read/write multiple files, as you mention. the samsung 950 performs well with single and multiple files, its one of the best drives, which is why its recommended so much here.

             

            if you are able to fit the os/apps, cache, and media all on one 512gb samsung 950, then it makes sense to buy one to hold everything. if you need more space, you should be fine using 2-3 samsung 850 sata ssd drives instead.

             

            you can check the manual for which sata ports are tied to which m.2 port, for lane conflict/sharing as bill mentions.

            • 3. Re: New PC build: Invest in NVME M.2 worth it?
              Bill Gehrke Adobe Community Professional & MVP

              Hey forum friends guess what?  Samsung has new family of up to 1TB M.2 PCIe Gen 3.0 X4 NVMe drives and they will soon available.  It is the SM961, a follow-on to the SM951 OEM style drives.  This means the warranty is up to the seller.  The sequential read speed is stated at 3200 MB/s, write speed is 1800 MB/s.  In a couple of weeks I should have one for testing.  I doubt that in my Premiere Pro Benchmark (PPBM) that it will test any faster that the 500 GB SM951 or the 950 Pro that I have but then it is a true 1 TB capacity! 

              • 4. Re: New PC build: Invest in NVME M.2 worth it?
                xencreative Level 1

                Thanks for your replies.  When I said sockets i really meant connectors.  The mobo i selected has 3 m.2 connectors, and I know you lose sata ports.  Won't be a problem.

                 

                So the advice of spreading os+apps / scratch / work files won't have a big difference when you use an nvme ssd?  I'll be ok using one for os/apps/scratch?  btw, yea i can fit all those on 512gb.

                 

                thanks!

                • 5. Re: New PC build: Invest in NVME M.2 worth it?
                  JFPhoton Level 3

                  The speed and lack of latency on the new NVMe PCI SSDs is nothing short of revolutionary compared to that of SATA III SSDs and the now stone age spinning hard drives of old.

                   

                  They are "bi-directional", which means they read AND write data at the SAME TIME,completely unlike SATA SSDs which can only read OR write....not both at the same time. This makes the "latency" of the NVMe drive FAR less. With read speed over 2GB persecond and write speeds of 1.5GB per second, there is NO fear of any "bottlenecking" because of storage drive speed.

                   

                  However, using these new drives as a "boot drive" is really a waste because once the OS and programs are loaded into the system memory, they become "memory resident" and the boot drive speed does not matter much except for the activity of the Windows page file.

                   

                  With NVMe drives there no longer is a need to have separate drives for "scratch", previews, exports,or, anything really. Newer NVMe drives are out, and are coming out, that have 1TB capacity to ease storage concerns. Your source footage needs to be on the fastest drive for best performance and one NVMe drive will provide that. Users can now use conventional SSDs to backup, or, archive projects, original footage, and other source material. Even cheaper, large "enterprise level" spinning hard drives may be used for this task. The good ones offer 4,6,or even 8 TB capacity at a decent read and write speed of over 200MB/sec when they have a 128MB cache on board.

                  • 6. Re: New PC build: Invest in NVME M.2 worth it?
                    Bill Gehrke Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                    My feeling exactly!  My X99 architecture has been a simple SATA III SSD for the OS/Applications/Media Cache and my M.2 is my project/work SSD.  Hard disk drives only for backup and archiving

                     

                    I ordered my new SM961 1TB from RamCity.

                    • 7. Re: New PC build: Invest in NVME M.2 worth it?
                      urrod Level 1

                      It is therefore more meaningful to run the operating system on a slower Samsung SSD 850 EVO. And all the data e.g. of a Premiere Pro project on a quicker Samsung SSD 950 Pro M.2 NVME?

                       

                      I just build a computer: 6700k, Asus z170 Pro (one NVME place), 512 MB 950 Pro M.2 NVME32, 1Tb Samsung 850 Evo and a lot of HDs. I Thought, I run the OS (Windows Pro 10/64) of the NVME SSD. But that seems the wrong idea, as far as I understand.

                       

                      All the best.  Uli

                      • 8. Re: New PC build: Invest in NVME M.2 worth it?
                        Bill Gehrke Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                        Uli,

                        Yes, once you have Windows running it is mostly memory resident while your large sequential media files are best off on the fastest device you can provide. The fact that the newer devices are NVMe instead of AHCI seems to have little bearing on our editing because now days we are using SSD's instead of hard disk drives where the rotational latency is the real problem.

                         

                        Talking about SSD's there is a new SSD that I just tested the Crucial MX300 750 GB SATA III drive which is selling for only $200!  I just tested it with CrystalDiskMark and directly from Premiere.  Here are the CDM results:

                        Crucial MX300.png

                        Exporting my disk intensive test file from Premiere I get 562 MB/second.Write rate to this SSD.  I then copied that same large file (after restarting the computer to clear any buffering) from this device to a much faster M.2 device and got this Read rate:

                        Crucial MX300 Read.png

                        For only $200 for a 750 GB SATA III SSD it is a Fantastic drive!

                        • 9. Re: New PC build: Invest in NVME M.2 worth it?
                          RoninEdits Most Valuable Participant

                          that Crucial MX300 750 GB ssd is getting mixed reviews, including poor read benchmarks. its a value drive at a value price. if anyone is looking for value ssd's there are several brands around 750gb to 1tb for close to $200, that should perform similar or better than the crucial mx300.

                           

                          anyone looking for good performance and quality drives, should look at the samsung drives. the samsung 850 evo 1tb does cost more, 30 cents per gb vs the crucial's 26 cents, but its a larger and much better drive.

                          • 10. Re: New PC build: Invest in NVME M.2 worth it?
                            urrod Level 1

                            Hi Bill,

                             

                            thanks for the detailed explanation. I did not realize that the OS itself - once loaded - is mostly in RAM. I will build the system as:

                             

                            C: \ - 1TB Samsung 850 Evo OS (Windows 10 Pro) and - hm - too large, any ideas?

                             

                            D: \ - 512 GB Samsung SSD 950 Pro M.2 NVME as my project and work drive on which I edit complete Premiere Pro and Photoshop projects.

                             

                            E: \; F: \; G:\; H:\; Four HGST 4TB HDs, 7200, to store my data an finished projects. I already have about 7,5 TB photo and video files. Hm, 4 HDs as a RAID??

                             

                            I: \; J: \; K:\; Three (or four) 4TB HGST Hard Drives as backup

                             

                            The data from the Crucial SSD are impressive. They sell the Crucial in Germany for about 185 Euros.

                             

                            Thank you and all the best, Uli