Hey there Thomas this is the together team
useful technical information you forgot to point out and is more important than anything: Current Version of Ae (full number) and OS
you need to check what goes on that rebellious frame 7012. it could be corrupted file (I notice there's no Video so maybe the Audio). there maybe a deadly combination of effects that is crashing your software and only by eliminating the stack of effects one by one, you could find the problem and work them out it another way in terms of workflow.
about AME - the reason you are not seeing the MB is because the master switch is probably off. AME does not get it's render settings from Ae prior to 13.8 (they added the ability to get the render settings in the latest version of 13.8 by choosing "Queue in AME" in the Render Queue"). this means that if you are sending your composition to AME the usual way (Ctrl+Alt+M) you need to toggle the master switch for MB in your main composition before you send it to AME to actually render it out in AME.
BTW - maybe MB is the cause of this? that's the variable that is missing and gives you the ability to render... you should look into it.
more on rendering in Ae vs AME and what to watch out for (prior to "Queue in AME" function) here in my tutorial:
skip to 04:12 if you want the render settings explanation (MB and other things)
Without knowing what happens at frame 7102 nobody can tell you much. Provide a screenshot of the segment with the relevant properties untwirled. Aside from motion blur this could be anything like a specific effect kicking in on this frame or exceeding a critical value just liek this could be some obscure bug. Even really nerdy stuff like AE using a wrong memory pointer when running on its own vs. being sandboxed with limited memory inside an AME process is something I could imagine. Eitehr way, we need more info.
Thanks for your Answer
I'm using Windows 10 and the leatest AE CC Version 188.8.131.52.7.
I can't see anything strange at frame 7102.
ATM I'm rendering the comp again with the motion blur in AME but it takes a while till i get to frame 7102 so i cant say if its working now or not.
Here are some screenshots (in german) and the full project incl. files.
I see. it is best to copy paste your screenshots here. many people won't click on other links. it would be better to see the whole interface and not piece by piece. there's a missing piece of the puzzle - the composition window. just take a screenshot at that specific frame next time so it will be easier to see problems. I opened your project and was able to render the range that include this frame with ease. but did get an expression error and I don't have the Twitch plugin so these two can be the cause or not . this is the expression error:
try these steps - if one doesn't work - try the next.
1. Clear all your cache - edit ->Purge->All and also edit - preferences these two:
2. Convert your Mp3 file to WAV. select it in the project window and send to render queue and choose WAV, re-import it and replace the Mp3 file.
3. try Preview on the part that crashes on full quality 100% magnification. see if it crashes.
4. set your work area to just the range of frames that gives you trouble - 7100-7105 for example, and render it out.
if it crashes, remove an effect, and another, and another until it stops crashing. we'll find the sucker eventually
Okey i will keep that in mind for next time
I think the error comes from the language difference from our AE. If you replace "Schieberegler" with "Slider" it should disappere. "Schieberegler" is the german word for "Slider".
ATM the AME passed the critial frame of the project!
After that i will follow these steps and look if it fixes my problem. I will come back here as soon i have the results
Great. thanks for keeping us informed.
I concur with Roei. The expression stuff is quite likely the issue.
seems like a waste of time to render the whole thing over and over just to see it crashes at a specific point. if you render just the problematic area - you could figure this out very fast. (unless it doesn't crash this way)
M suggested this could be an expression issue - if you narrow things down, and did all the steps suggested before and come to that the expression is making it crash - try baking the key-frames - expressions can be very heavy on memory. you can bake the expression by right clicking on the property and in the menu -> Animation->Key frame Assistant -> Convert Expression to Key frames (if you have a keyframe there, you can right click too and get Key frame Assistant)
Yes but why did the AME crashed at another point? For me it sould like a ressource problem or failur of hardware so i want to try it on my gaming rig and on the laptop i try the other stuff
First i will deactivate the Twitch effekt because i heard alot about a Twitch freeze bug.
Then deactivate the MB and after that the expressoins.
Sound like another good idea to try
I see. o.k we'll be here
So both PC and Laptop passed the freeze frame with no changes. I will try to render the last part of the project to look if it freezes there like the AME before. Maybe the changes I'v done to the motion blur changed the position of the freezing frame.
PC stoped at: 09:00:27
Laptop at: 09:00:27 too
Will do some changes on the laptop and give a feedback in a few minutes
Looks like converting the expressions in keyframes did the trick for this one
I have to render all over again to say if it was the solution. I will do it in 1/4 of original resolution so it would be a little faster (1/4 causes the freeze too, i'v tested it).
EDIT: wow it takes much longer to render it with only keyframes...
apparently at this crossroad a certain combination of effects and expression and also MB turns sour - remove one by one until you get to the bottom of this.
Even on 1/4 it says about 5hrs to render.
It's pretty long and i will render it over night so i will poste the results in about 10hrs
you know... you don't really have to render all over again if it get stuck at certain point. you can render a sequence so if it stops you can continue from where you left off. use PNG Sequence and render your composition. if it crashes you have already the previous frames and you can check in the next render under Render Settings the "Skip existing files"
this way the render will skip all the way to new frames and you can finish your render, and then import the PNG, add the soundtrack and render again and it will be very very fast I promise
Yes i know but to "Problem" with this is at the end this should be a template where i can change the song reanalyse the audio keys and render it out with no changes.
If i want to render it once okey this would be the solution to go but not for a template.
EDIT: wow it takes much longer to render it with only keyframes...
actually this is supposed to speed up your render time considerably.
you got me. not the expression expert. I am sure M could help you if he is here. try to PM him.
At first i will try to solve it on my own. its the fastes way to learn new stuff
For now i decreased the self multiplications to three times and devided it with a higher number to get a smaller value. I hope this will fix mix problem for now i will see it tomorrow morning and will give a short feedback about the results and if it fails i will write him and ask for some help (again)
But for now i need some sleep
Your expressions are probably recursive which means the longer they run more memory they eat up.
Your troubleshooting procedure was, please don't be offended, a little nuts. Your composition is awfully long, I'm assuming it's just one shot. If you have multiple shots and you have render problems immediately break the composition up into more than one shot. More than 90% of my compositions, even though they may have 100 layers, are seven seconds or less because I use after effects to build shots not sequences.
Anytime I suspect there may be a problem with the render or I have a render that is going to take more than just a few minutes I will render that composition to an image sequence. If I get a failure I can start from the failed frame and fix everything very quickly without resorting to another 10 hour render. If I suspected one of my projects would take 10 hours to render there is no way I would ever run that render to a movie format which can be so easily corrupted on render failure.
Your original project, if it was included in the one drive file, could not be downloaded because of the antivirus scan one drive does on all files. I don't know exactly what expressions may have been giving you the problems but another option for troubleshooting would be to open up the secret panel in your preferences by holding down the shift key when you open Preferences and then setting purge cash to every 10 frames or so.
it's a little too late but I hope this helps on future projects.
Yes, if failed in the first 1/3
Some random thoughts i had this morning:
- Should i try the render the two particle system first and then put them in to the project as a mov/avi file, because as we know only if the MB is on the render fails and only the two particle systems have the MB on it.
- I was thinking about to get a test version from the Particle system from Red Giant Software and try it with this one
Thanks for your answer.
Yes this would be the best way if the rest of the project stays the same. But if i chang only on number the whole project changes because its all automatet with the soundlevel of a song.
num = (comp("MiniMix - 01").layer("Audioamplitude").effect("Both Channels")("Slider"))/18;
I will give the soundlevel divided by 18 to this variable (num) and multiply it with num it self by three times.
So let me list uf what i'v found out:
- If Twitch effect off or on same result = freeze
- Render with no Motion Blur = no freeze
- Changing the expressions = freeze occours on another frame
The problem is if i change the expression the whole scene changes and i have to rerender all over anyway to find the freezeing frame or the honor of a finaly rendered scene with no fail
So anyway i uploaded the Project unpacked on OneDrive again so you can take a look on it.
If you have any other ideas how to sovle this problem, please tell me i will try anything (yes i have red this with the secret option and i will try it )
So i did a few tests:
first i isolated the two particle systems on a single comp and rendered it with no changes -> Fail
second i turned off the MB on both particle systems -> Success
third i turned on only one MB -> Fail
Is there another way to get Motion Blur on a particle system?
you could pre-comp the particles (Move all Attributes) and add CC Force Motion Blur (bundled with Ae). it will analyze the pixel motion and give you MB based on the settings you apply in the effects. great for effects that don't come with built in MB.
Thanks for the answer
I did this changes to the my project and now its rendering on a external server to speed it up a litte because of this Force Motion Blur it takes much longer to render. In 1h i will know more.
It sounds to me like you are running out of resources. I would guess that if you modify the Secret settings in Preferences to Purge every few frames your project would not fail. Ctrl/Cmnd + Shift when opening the preferences will get you to the screen:
I also repeat my admonition to render an image sequence any time you have a project that is going to take hours to render. If you crash because of resource problems on frame 791 then you have 790 good frames in the can that you don't need to re-render. Just purge and start at 791 and you have lost nothing.