9 Replies Latest reply on Sep 3, 2016 7:07 AM by Skittlepop

    Planning build for 4K. New to Premiere and have questions.

    Skittlepop

      I've been flying drones for a couple years and now need to move up to Premiere and 4K for work purposes, so I have a budget of up to $4k for a fast PC that will have some future proofing. Up till now, I've been using GoPro Studio on a laptop. I'm pretty happy with my choice of CPU, MB (Thunderbolt board is a plus), PSU, GPU (already purchased). I'm guessing I could go with just 32GB of RAM? I'm really confused about what I need for storage. I don't want to sacrifice speed but also want to make sure I have enough room to work on large files. I think I may be overestimating how much space I need and how to best use what I have planned (Reading too much, not enough time with Premiere to know what I need). My finished projects will rarely be more than 10 minutes in length. My storage plans thus far are as follows:

      C:- Samsung 850 EVO 500GB OS and frequently used programs on this drive.

      E:- Samsung 950 M.2 512GB Media Cache and as a Scratch disk

      F:- (Either 4TB RAID0 or 1TB SSD) Current project's Media Files and Project Files

      G:- (Either 4TB RAID0 or 1TB SSD) Current project's Preview Files and Export Files

      H: 6TB Standard HDD - Long term data storage.


      Build:

      Intel i7 6850k

      Corsair H100i v2

      Asus X99 Deluxe II

      G.Skill Trident Z 64GB (4x16GB) DDR4-3333

      C: Samsung 850 EVO 500GB

      E: Samsung 950 PRO M.2 512GB

      F: Either Samsung 850 EVO 1TB or (2) WD Caviar Black 2TB RAID0

      G: Either Samsung 850 EVO 1TB or (2) WD Caviar Black 2TB RAID0

      H: WD Black 6TB 7200rpm

      Asus GeForce GTX 1080 Strix OC

      Fractal Design Define R5

      EVGA Supernova 850W 80+ Gold

      Microsoft Windows 10 Home

      I'm open to all suggestions so please feel free to comment. I haven't owned a desktop in years and realize I don't know much at this point. This will be my only PC for work and some play (a few games and possibly VR).

      I have read through these and several other forms and clicked on all the recommended links. I'm just still a noob at editing (for now) and have some questions. Hope to build this PC and live on it learning Premiere. Any helpful replies are greatly appreciated.

        • 1. Re: Planning build for 4K. New to Premiere and have questions.
          RoninEdits Most Valuable Participant

          cpu and mbd: if you think you might be loading up on pcie devices, or just want the option to future proof, the 6850k and deluxe motherboard will be a decent combo. picking the motherboard may be the more difficult task as there are many ways they can split the 40 cpu pcie lanes. the new version of the asus deluxe appears to trade in one of the gen 3.0 x16 slots to gen 2.0 in favor of u.2 ports. if you are looking for ultimate expansion the new asus X99-E-10G WS has room for expansion beyond 40 lanes and also has dual 10gb ports. if you want to invest more into the cpu, the 8 core i7-6900k would be a nice upgrade for 4k projects.

           

          ram: 32gb should be ok and you could always upgrade later if needed.

           

          cpu cooler and psu: if you are going extreme overclocking, you may want a 280mm rad and higher watt, possibly even platinum psu. for medium to low overclocking a noctua d15s cooler will be enough, quieter, and avoid the possibility of leaks or pump failures. make sure the evga supernova is the G2 or P2 model. the corsair rmx and rmi are also good.

           

          storage: you may want to stick with ssd's as much as possible and only use a hdd for misc storage, archived projects, and backups. with ssd's you do not need as many drives to split-up each function, and using the 950 pro only for cache/scratch is wasteful. if you are using highly compressed media like gopro footage, a single 950 pro 512gb should be able to handle everything (os/apps/cache/previews/projects/media). if you need more space for lots of media, then you might want to skip the 950 pro and use some samsung 850 evo's. one for os/apps/cache/previews and the other for projects/media. if the media is somewhat higher bitrate, you may want to raid-0 two samsung 850 evo's. if its lower bitrate media but you need lots of space, then raid-0 hdd's may be fine. for the 6tb archive/backup hdd, i would suggest an enterprise drive. they do cost a bit more, but are more reliable. if the data is really important you should have a second copy of the data somewhere.

           

          the new intel 600p m.2 512gb or 1tb may be a better option over a sata ssd like the samsung 850 evo, to use for a os/apps/cache or projects/media drive. it costs a bit more than a sata ssd like the samsung evo, but is much cheaper than the 950 pro and has a larger 1tb model. it has 1800 mb/s read spec vs sata ssd 550mb/s, but sata like 560 mb/s write spec and lower rated endurance. its also too new to know how well it really works.

          1 person found this helpful
          • 2. Re: Planning build for 4K. New to Premiere and have questions.
            Skittlepop Level 1

            RoninEdits, thank you for the detailed answer. It gives me lots to think about. I've recently moved up from just from the gopro and now also have a Panasonic GH4 and an Inspire 1 drone (MPEG4/AVC/H.264 max resolution 60 Mbps@4096x2160 (25/24p)). Had to go back and watch a video about the gen. 2 vs gen. 3 pci. At least this stuff is fun to relearn, but it's been about 10 years since I built a PC and kept up with the technology. Also going to look further into your cooler recommendation. I don't plan a major overclock and that might be a quieter way to go without the possibility of a leak.

             

            As as far as storage goes, I'm still a little confused, but that is from my lack of understanding terminology. As I learn more by using Premiere, I'm sure it will all become clear. I think I am failing to understand cache/previews/projects/media/export in the terms of how they are used by Premiere and how much space/speed each needs. Would it would it be practical to use a 500GB SSD for os/apps, another 500GB SSD for cache/previews, and a 1TB SSD for projects/media with an external 2TB hot swap HDD for backup/archive purposes? Am I thinking in the right direction?

            • 3. Re: Planning build for 4K. New to Premiere and have questions.
              JFPhoton Level 3

              Considering your source material and possibility of multiple , high resolution.....and high frame rate.....videotracks on your potential timelines, the first thing to consider is CPU " horsepower " . These highly compressed codecs are intensive for the CPU, the more processing cores you have available coupled with a higher clock speed, ( over 4Ghz with overclocking), the better.

                 With a $4k budget, you should start at the top with a Broadwell E 6950X to give you 10 physical cores, ( 20 "logical" processors), AND the ability to overclock above 4Ghz for best CPU performance. There goes $1,700.....but, you will get a good measure of "future proofing" with this.

               

              Next, your chosen NVidia GPU should work just fine.......in 3 to 6 months a 1080ti version is expected that is so powerful, you may want to sell the 1080 to upgrade. You would then be close to Titan X performance at a much lower price.

               

              As memory is cheap, compared to the other components, it may be better to go with 64GB of the  DDR4 memory on a cheaper Asus Deluxe II MOBO....not sure about your more expensive MOBO choice, may not be necessary.

               

              As for drives......once the OS and programs are loaded, they become " memory resident" and the speed of the boot drive is not relevant, except for the action of the Windows page file. For this reason it is recommended to use a 500GB SATA III, Samsung 850 Pro as your boot drive which should contain OS, programs and Windows page file ONLY. The Evos have a bad write performance and are not as durable as the 850Pro model. Bill Gehrke, from this forum, has tested placing the media cache files and cache files of PPro on the SSD boot drive and has found NO difference in performance. This allows an easy erasing of these files once a project is complete...no worry, PPro recreates these if ever needed again.

               

              For best performance with PPro, all other files should go on an NVMe PCI SSD connected to the Gen. 3 PCI M.2 port. Project files,previews,exports, and all media belong here. Currently, the Samsung 950 Pro is the best for this. The only caveat is that it is only available in a 500GB capacity. Toshiba and Intel have larger ones, but, their performance is not as good. Samsung should be releasing a 1GB model soon,though. The great advantage is that the read and write speeds are extremely fast,preventing any potential bottlenecks while editing. The NVMe drives are "bi-directional", meaning that they can read and write data AT THE SAME TIME !! This also improves performance. SATA drives can only do ONE operation at a time...not BOTH.

               

              Large enterprise level SATA III hard drives can serve as your backup and as an archive for all your media and project files....a place to "offload"  active projects and media once a project is completed. These are not expensive and they work well. 7200 RPM models which have a 128 MB cache can perform at over 200MB per second and can be " mirrored" in a RAID 1 for extra data security. Of course, these drives would NOT be used in the editing process.....the NVMe PCI SSD is TEN TIMES FASTER !!

               

              Good Luck !

              1 person found this helpful
              • 4. Re: Planning build for 4K. New to Premiere and have questions.
                RoninEdits Most Valuable Participant

                when i brought up the gen 2 vs 3, its also that the cpu pcie lanes aren't used for the gen 2 slot. they instead are split to handle more m.2 and u.2 connections. the old version of the motherboard didn't have as many device options, so all x16 slots were connected to the cpu pcie lanes. the manuals can be a little tricky to decipher, but its in there.

                 

                a 500gb 850 evo should be enough space for os/apps/cache/previews. if you think you will need 1tb for projects/media, you could raid-0 two 850 500gb evo's. people had problems with the 840 evo, but samsung did a great job with the 850 evo. an external hdd is a good option for archive/backup, being external and powered off is a bit safer. i would only consider more and/or faster drives after budgeting for a faster cpu. intel has kept cpu performance stagnant and prices high, so its normally a worthwhile long term investment.

                1 person found this helpful
                • 5. Re: Planning build for 4K. New to Premiere and have questions.
                  Skittlepop Level 1

                  So, you guys both seem to put the emphasis on cpu and storage speed for working files. This gives me better ideas about how to manage my budget. I'm starting to understand the needs of Premiere so the drive selection isn't such a mystery. Thanks for taking the time to spell it out for me.

                   

                  At this point, my MB choice is the only thing I am waffling on. I'm just going to ask straight out, if this was your build, which MB would you use? I don't want to create any bottlenecks and, as you pointed out RoninEdits, the manuals ARE a little difficult to decipher.

                  • 6. Re: Planning build for 4K. New to Premiere and have questions.
                    RoninEdits Most Valuable Participant

                    you need to think about what devices you know you are going to install and what devices you might add later. like possibly a second gpu, thunderbolt 2 or 3 card, display i/o card, raid card, one or more m.2 ssd's, u.2, usb devices, etc... then look at the motherboard manual to see if and how it would work with all those devices. if you have questions about how a motherboard will work with several devices, i can try to answer.

                    1 person found this helpful
                    • 7. Re: Planning build for 4K. New to Premiere and have questions.
                      Skittlepop Level 1

                      Thanks for the response RE. My plan right now is to run one GPU, one TB3 card, and one M.2. The Deluxe II has good ratings so far for reliability and comes with the TB3 card and an additional M.2 card, should I ever need it (No plans for it at this point). It looks to me like it can handle those needs without compromise, unless I'm missing something.....

                      • 8. Re: Planning build for 4K. New to Premiere and have questions.
                        RoninEdits Most Valuable Participant

                        it appears at best you would be left with slot x16_3 at x8 and both u.2 ports active for future expansion. if you never use u.2 drives, 8 of the 40 lanes would be wasted with that setup and the asus deluxe ii. without a m.2 drive it might be possible to move the gpu to slot x16_3 and have two available slots at x8 and one active u.2 port.

                        1 person found this helpful
                        • 9. Re: Planning build for 4K. New to Premiere and have questions.
                          Skittlepop Level 1

                          Thank you once again RE. Using your explanation, I went back to the manual and understand what I was missing about how the board allocates lanes and the speed of those lanes. This whole exchange has been very educational for me. Now on to a little more research, then the build! Appreciate all the help.