13 Replies Latest reply on Sep 7, 2016 10:03 AM by RoninEdits

    Seeking Workstation Advice (6950x or 6900K)

    rlr29711 Level 1

      I'm looking to upgrade my workstation to gain access to Thunderbolt 3 connectivity and increase overall performance when working with 2.5/4K+ footage. My core applications are Premiere Pro, After Effects and davinci resolve.

       

      The main question is determining whether to put resources towards the 10 Core 6950x or upgrading to a GTX 1080. I'd like this system to have some legs in regards to usage and am leaning towards the 6950x, as it is easier to upgrade a graphics card rather than a CPU. 80% of my work is editing and 20% Color Grading.

       

      Current Workstation:

      3970x

      Rampage Extreme IV

      Quadro 4000

      GTX 680 Classified

      LSI 9280 Raid Card

      64GB RAM

       

      Option 1:

      6900K

      Rampage V Edition 10 (would like X99-E WS but doesn't seem the ATX form factor will work)

      Quadro M4000 (need 10-bit color)

      GTX 1080 SC or GTX 1070 SC (what's the performance/value differential here?, Premiere Pro 2015.3 Pascal GPU Performance - Puget Custom Computers seems to suggest it is negligible)

      LSI 9280 Raid

      64GB RAM 2133

      ThunderboltEX 3

       

      Option 2:

      6950X

      Rampage V Edition 10 (would like X99-E WS but doesn't seem the ATX form factor will work)

      Quadro M4000 (need 10-bit color)

      GTX 680 Classified

      LSI 9280 Raid

      64GB RAM 2133

      ThunderboltEX 3

       

      Thanks!

        • 1. Re: Seeking Workstation Advice (6950x or 6900K)
          RoninEdits Most Valuable Participant

          if you plan on keeping the system a long time, i think the investment in the 10 core i7 can make sense. intel makes small performance jumps at similar price points, while nvidia has been making bigger jumps in performance each gen. i would at least get ddr4-2400 memory, as that is supported by the broadwell-e natively, but would recommend something closer to ddr4-3000.

           

          i'm not sure if its possible, but if a quadro and gtx can work together as dual gpu, you might be able to run the gtx 680 and quadro m4000 together as dual gpu. (you could test that on your current system if needed, and gpu-z to monitor the performance of both cards.)  the quadro m4000 is slightly faster, but as long as the gtx 680 has 4gb it shouldn't hold back performance in premiere too much. that could be a temporary solution until you upgrade the gtx card later and then use the quadro only for display/gui. if you only need the newer quadro for a 4k monitor, there are newer k and m series quadro cards around $160-$440 that will handle 4k monitors, and then you could put the extra money into buying a gtx 1080 or 1070.

           

          the puget article shows only minor difference between the gtx 1070 and 1080, but that is with their test project. they explain what kind of timeline and effects were used for the test project in the article. the more gpu effects that are used, and more layers of raw media that need debayering, the bigger the performance difference will be between the two gtx cards. when picking which gpu, you also need to take into consideration the performance you want in davinci resolve.

           

          the rampage V manual says it can split 40 lanes to x16/x8/x8/x8. that would use all cpu lanes to run 4 pcie cards with the gtx at x16. if you were to use a thunderbolt 2 card, it may run in the pcie gen 2.0 slot using pch lanes. it would appears to disable some of the usb ports to use that slot at x4, but would free up one of the x8 slots. if you needed thunderbolt 3 and were worried about future expansion, the asus WS motherboard with its plx chips would allow for more expansion. there was a new version of the asus WS motherboard just announced, it has dual 10g lan ports.

          • 2. Re: Seeking Workstation Advice (6950x or 6900K)
            rlr29711 Level 1

            Hi Ronin,

             

            Thanks for the advice. A couple changes to my build:

             

            6950x

            Asus x99 E WS-3.1 ( I spoke with Asus and this is confirmed to work with ThunderboltEX 3 and maximizes pci lanes. 4x16, or 5+ (x16, x8,x8,x8 etc.) Strangely, the newer x99 E WS - 10g does not have a Thunderbolt Header. This is a little frustrating as it has a USB 3.1 Type-c adapter as opposed to the x99 E WS-3.1.

             

            Corsair 2800 mhz 64gb (fastest 64gb kit on the QVL)

             

            I'm still trying to determine which GPUs to purchase. I'd prefer not to spend $800 on the Quadro, but I'm not sure if I can get around it.

             

            I will be using it for 10-bit color display/gui in Premiere/AE/Resolve. Is it possible to, via the Nvidia Control Panel, specify the Quadro as the display card and GTX as a compute card? Is there a loss in performance? If this is the setup, will the GTX card be utilized for generating preview files and applying effects? I'd be open to the m2000 (or any other recs you have) but would like to confirm I'm not limiting the performance of the machine.

             

            Thanks!

            • 3. Re: Seeking Workstation Advice (6950x or 6900K)
              RoninEdits Most Valuable Participant

              good catch, i didn't realize the new WS 10g didn't have any thunderbolt support.

               

              sticking with QVL isn't always necessary, but it is a good idea. ddr4-2800 should still be a nice upgrade over 2400.

               

              i have never tested a quadro + gtx, but supposedly the nvidia control panel program settings can limit premiere pro's .exe to use cuda only on the gtx card. then as you describe, premiere should be using the gtx card for all the gpu workload. davinci resolve has a built-in setting to control this, "use display gpu for compute". i don't remember if there is a limitation for this with the free version or not.

               

              since you already have a quadro and gtx, you may want to check these things with premiere and davinci resolve to confirm they work, to help decide which gpu's to purchase. again you can use gpu-z to confirm the quadro isn't being used (very low gpu load %) and the gtx 680 shows some gpu usage.

              • 4. Re: Seeking Workstation Advice (6950x or 6900K)
                rlr29711 Level 1

                Checked GPU-z tonight while editing. It appears that my GTX is functioning as the compute card and my Quadro is simply the GUI card. This seems promising. Any reason I should be concerned using the dual GPU's is causing a loss in performance in 'translation'?

                 

                Considering this, it's almost better to purchase the lower cost M2000 and balance it with a Titan X as opposed to a Quadro M4000/GTX 1080 combo.

                • 5. Re: Seeking Workstation Advice (6950x or 6900K)
                  RoninEdits Most Valuable Participant

                  other than it can be tricky to install quadro and gtx drivers together, i don't recall reading downsides to that kind of setup with a quadro and gtx. i don't see many configs like that, they usually have a display i/o card/device to drive a dedicated full-screen playback 10bit monitor.

                   

                  the quadro m4000 is an underclocked gtx 970, that performs closer to the gtx 960. so if you were to use both quadro and gtx together for compute, the quadro m4000 may heavily cripple the gtx 1080.

                  • 6. Re: Seeking Workstation Advice (6950x or 6900K)
                    rlr29711 Level 1

                    Wow. I see. I wonder if I've been crippling my performance with my current setup.

                     

                    It seems I will be better off purchasing a third monitor and intensity pro for 10-bit monitoring.

                     

                    If I use a blackmagic  card for external monitoring, would I be able to use a GTX 680 for GUI and GTX 1080 or will the 680 cripple the 1080 the same way a quadro might?

                    • 7. Re: Seeking Workstation Advice (6950x or 6900K)
                      Bill Gehrke Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                      I doubt using your GTX 680 with a GTX1080 would add much of any performance increase if that is what you are using it for.

                      • 8. Re: Seeking Workstation Advice (6950x or 6900K)
                        rlr29711 Level 1

                        What do you recommend as a GPU setup? My conundrum is that I have the following requirements:

                        • GTX 1070 or 1080 performance for 4K+ footage
                        • 10-bit monitoring
                        • 2 cards for Resolve: GUI and Compute

                        From what I understand, if I don't use two of the same cards, the less powerful card (680 or Quadro) will cripple the performance of the compute card. Is that correct?

                         

                        Thanks!

                        • 9. Re: Seeking Workstation Advice (6950x or 6900K)
                          Bill Gehrke Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                          rlr29711 wrote:

                           

                          It seems I will be better off purchasing a third monitor and intensity pro for 10-bit monitoring.

                           

                          If I use a blackmagic card for external monitoring, would I be able to use a GTX 680 for GUI and GTX 1080 or will the 680 cripple the 1080 the same way a quadro might?

                          I just assumed from you comment that the 10-bit problem was solved with the Intensity Pro and you were getting a GTX 1080.  Apparently the GTX 680 was added for Resolve.  I am not qualified to comment on Resolve usage but the GTX 1080 is so much more powerful than a GTX 680 that it would not help for Premiere.

                          • 10. Re: Seeking Workstation Advice (6950x or 6900K)
                            rlr29711 Level 1

                            Hi Bill,

                             

                            Am I understanding that if I have a GTX 680 setup for GUI via Nvidia control panel and the GTX 1080 for compute/cuda via the control panel, will the GTX 680 still cripple the 1080? This is using application specific settings for Premiere in the control panel.

                             

                            Thanks!

                            • 11. Re: Seeking Workstation Advice (6950x or 6900K)
                              RoninEdits Most Valuable Participant

                              if you use the gtx 680 with the gtx 1080, both for cuda compute, the same thing will happen as with the quadro and gtx. the slower card (gtx 680) will cripple the faster card (gtx 1080). so if you had those two card in the system for some reason, you would want to set the nvidia control panel for premiere to only use the gtx 1080 for cuda.

                               

                              davinci resolve shouldn't need a dedicated gui card, it should be fine with a single gtx 1080 to handle gui + compute. i believe that is a setting left over from long ago, when video cards weren't as powerful. the performance impact of having a modern gpu handle gui + compute in davinci resolve should be negligible. if you get a blackmagic 10bit display i/o device it should also be compatible with adobe software, so there shouldn't be any need for the gtx 680 or any quadro. 

                              • 12. Re: Seeking Workstation Advice (6950x or 6900K)
                                rlr29711 Level 1

                                I see. I would not use both for cuda. The setup I intended was to have the nvidia control panel specify 1080 for cuda and use the 680 for gui. But if I understand you correctly, I can forgo the 680 entirely.

                                 

                                I was under the impression that Resolve still required a dedicated gui to use noise reduction. I'll look into it. I'm going to do some research on a solution that enables me to use an intensity for 10-bit and a single 1080.

                                • 13. Re: Seeking Workstation Advice (6950x or 6900K)
                                  RoninEdits Most Valuable Participant

                                  right, the gtx 680 and quadro cards shouldn't be needed, just the gtx 1080 (or whichever gtx you pick) and blackmagic i/o device.

                                   

                                  i'm not aware of davinci resolve requiring a dedicated gui for noise reduction, i though it only required the paid version. if you don't find a clear answer in your research, you could ask in the blackmagic forums.