16 Replies Latest reply on Jul 27, 2017 5:30 AM by trshaner

    Canon 1dx II Color Issues with LR 6.7  HELP

    toann41772076 Level 1

      I recently purchased a Canon 1dx II and noticed that the raw files when import to LR, the colors are flat and not as vibrant as colors as Canon 1DX or Canon 5d Mark III all under the same setting.  Anyone having this same issues or know a way to fix this? I have never had this issues and all setting are the same for all camera bodies. Just 1dx II raw files are flat and not colorful.

       

      Here are the pics from Canon 1dx II

      14797381_10154057661528511_1336883372_n.png.jpg

       

      here are the pics from 5d Mark III. Noticed how the red are more vibrant.

      14483638_10154057821653511_626259483_n.png.jpg

        • 1. Re: Canon 1dx II Color Issues with LR 6.7  HELP
          Just Shoot Me Adobe Community Professional

          Set up a test subject and take images with both cameras and look at them. What you are showing in your post is 2 completely different subjects more than likely different lighting and could be different Default settings in LR.

          Each camera can have different default settings being applied.

          1 person found this helpful
          • 2. Re: Canon 1dx II Color Issues with LR 6.7  HELP
            Jao vdL Adobe Community Professional & MVP

            First make sure no default settings or auto tone is applied to your images. Then make sure you have the "camera default" profile selected in the calibration setting. This generally brings the color rendering for different cameras from the same manufacturer closer together than when you use the Adobe Standard profile there.

            1 person found this helpful
            • 3. Re: Canon 1dx II Color Issues with LR 6.7  HELP
              toann41772076 Level 1

              Here you go:

              The more vibrant one is Canon 1dx and the less vibrant/flat one is the 1dx II. I just checked and all camera and lens setting are all the same. Yet when develope in LR, colors are night and day

              Screen Shot 2016-10-25 at 9.33.50 PM.png

              1 person found this helpful
              • 4. Re: Canon 1dx II Color Issues with LR 6.7  HELP
                toann41772076 Level 1

                More test shots:

                 

                 

                The more vibrant one is Canon 1dx and the less vibrant/flat one is the Canon 1dx II. I just checked and all camera and lens setting are all the same. Yet when developed in LR, colors are night and day. Both of these are Raw and are untouched.Screen Shot 2016-10-25 at 9.33.50 PM.png

                • 5. Re: Canon 1dx II Color Issues with LR 6.7  HELP
                  Jao vdL Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                  Did you change the camera profile? That is the first thing you should check. It should be camera default and NOT Adobe standard or something like that for both files. You should also check whether there are any default settings or other settings applied in Lightroom. This is not at all unlikely. However, even if everything is really the same, there will always be differences between cameras because they have different sensors.

                  1 person found this helpful
                  • 6. Re: Canon 1dx II Color Issues with LR 6.7  HELP
                    toann41772076 Level 1

                    Jao, I dont use the camera standard color because to me it is not correct. I like adobe profile better therefore I really want adobe to fix this.

                     

                    Canon 1DX Adobe Color

                    Screen Shot 2016-10-25 at 11.11.19 PM.png

                     

                    Canon 1DX Camera Color (Notice how it is more brown)

                    Screen Shot 2016-10-25 at 11.11.35 PM.png

                    • 7. Re: Canon 1dx II Color Issues with LR 6.7  HELP
                      Just Shoot Me Adobe Community Professional

                      It is a different cameras and a different sensors.

                      I personally don't think Adobe has to fix anything. It is up to you to adjust the images you take with any camera.

                      Not sure what you mean by more and less vibrant. Those 2 images look like different exposures. the one on the right looks slightly over exposed and the one on the left a little under exposed.

                       

                      Now if you were dealing with the same camera model that supposedly had the same exact sensor then I'd contact Canon not Adobe.

                      • 8. Re: Canon 1dx II Color Issues with LR 6.7  HELP
                        Jao vdL Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                        Adobe's standard profiles are not very consistent across camera types unfortunately and it is highly unlikely that that will get fixed for older cameras. They are getting better for newer cameras but changing the profile for older cameras is unlikely to happen as it will change images on people. For my cameras (I shoot Nikon), the Adobe standard profiles are pretty terrible. Yellows often turn orange. Reds are not vibrant, etc. This used to be really bad with older cameras that were released around Lightroom 1 times. The ACR profiles at that time turned people green. This finally got fixed in 2008 when Adobe released LR 2 and introduced the camera matching profiles. I typically use camera standard or some custom profiles I generated using a colorchecker chart. Between my different cameras I get pretty consistent rendering. If I use Adobe Standard, the matching is not as good mostly because the tone curves in the Adobe Standard profiles appear to not be consistent. The reason that this works is that the camera standard profile mimics the jpeg out of camera. The camera makers are quite invested in their color 'style'. They keep that quite similar across camera models. Since Adobe mimics these, using camera standard tends to get you more consistent color. The better solution though is to generate your own profiles from a colorchecker chart. Here is an old review of what that can do: Jao's photo blog: Colorchecker passport minireview.

                         

                        You should compare two images from your two cameras with all sliders set to zero using the camera standard profile. Then do the same comparison using the Adobe Standard profiles. This should show that using camera standard your rendering will be closer between cameras.

                        2 people found this helpful
                        • 9. Re: Canon 1dx II Color Issues with LR 6.7  HELP
                          toann41772076 Level 1

                          Jao,

                           

                          Thank you for all your help. I understand for older cameras it will not be fixed, but this is the new Canon 1dx II that just came out. You would think Adobe's color should be better if not close to color to camera. For some people, they like to use the camera color profile, yet for me and my workflow, I like to use Adobe Color Profile and this is the first time I see this drastic difference.

                           

                          Anyways, I contacted Adobe, and apparently, I am not the only one experiencing this issue, but they said a lot of people are. I also sent Adobe all the files taken with 5d3, 1dx, and 1dx II and they see what I see as well. They are currently looking to fix this at the moment and said if they can, a patch will be in the next update.

                          • 10. Re: Canon 1dx II Color Issues with LR 6.7  HELP
                            Jao vdL Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                            Ahh. I thought you were talking about the older 1DX! I absolutely agree that more recent cameras should end up rendering pretty closely in the standard profile as they are calibrated now to the same conditions using the same charts. Glad that Adobe (Eric probably?) will fix.

                            1 person found this helpful
                            • 11. Re: Canon 1dx II Color Issues with LR 6.7  HELP
                              toann41772076 Level 1

                              I dont know who is fixing it, but they said this is a priority for them. Yea my issue is with the canon 1dx II. the colors for my past canon cameras, from 5d II, 6d, 5d3 and 1dx are fine, just 1dx ii are out of place, but glad that Adobe is looking into it.

                              • 12. Re: Canon 1dx II Color Issues with LR 6.7  HELP
                                trshaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                There are numerous reports of camera profile issues with the newer Canon DSLRs (1DX II, 5D IV, 5DS, 5DS R). Do a search in the forum. I'm not sure why this is happening since Adobe Standard is supposed produce the same rendering across all camera makes & models (i.e. "Standard"). Here's one concerning the Camera Standard profile for the 1DX II:

                                 

                                Problems with colors in LR 2015.6

                                 

                                This one was fixed in LR 6.6.

                                 

                                The sensor technology has certainly changed, but it still should be possible to produce a very similar looking Adobe Standard profile.......or maybe not?

                                2 people found this helpful
                                • 13. Re: Canon 1dx II Color Issues with LR 6.7  HELP
                                  trshaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                  I finally had a chance to look at this and it appears Adobe is having issues creating camera profiles for the new Canon DSLRs. The 5D MKIV Adobe Standard profile looks similar to the 1DX MKII (lower color saturation). Ironically the 1DX MKII Camera Standard profile has higher saturation previous profiles. When viewed in Canon's Digital Photo Professional 4 (DPP4) with Standard default settings ALL of these CR2 image files look virtually identical. In LR I had to readjust WB and Exposure, but they still looked different than DPP4's Camera Standard rendering.

                                  These image files are Adobe RGB profile so you may need to save them and view in LR or PS. Click on the image to launch it, right-click, and Save to a drive location.

                                   

                                  Adobe Standard

                                  Canon 5D MKIII_5D MKIV_1DX_!DX MKII_Adobe Standard.jpg

                                   

                                  Camera Standard

                                  Canon 5D MKIII_5D MKIV_1DX_!DX MKII_Camera Standard.jpg

                                   

                                  Canon DPP4 (Standard Default Settings)

                                  Canon 5D MKIII_1Ds MKIII_1DX_!DX MKII_Canon DPP Standard.jpg

                                  2 people found this helpful
                                  • 14. Re: Canon 1dx II Color Issues with LR 6.7  HELP
                                    toann41772076 Level 1

                                    You nailed it on the spot. This is the exact problem I see as well and I hope Adobe can fix it.

                                    • 15. Re: Canon 1dx II Color Issues with LR 6.7  HELP
                                      trshaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                      toann41772076 wrote:

                                       

                                      You nailed it on the spot. This is the exact problem I see as well and I hope Adobe can fix it.

                                      I did further investigation and it appears the Adobe Standard profile metrics have been "silently" changed by Adobe sometime in Q3 2014. All Canon and perhaps all other make camera models introduced since Q3 2014 have Adobe Standard profiles with lower color saturation. In short it looks like Adobe has changed the "standard." It's unlikely they will "fix" these profiles since it appears to have been done on purpose. This means it will be necessary to "adjust" image files shot with new camera models to maintain the same appearance as older models. I couldn't achieve satisfactory results simply cranking up the LR Saturation control or using DPE to modify the profile settings. The best solution is to use a ColorChecker Passport and create new profiles for ALL of your camera models both old and new to match them. There's no guarantee that will be perfect either since the current Adobe profile is used as the "Base Profile" when using the X-Rite plugin or DPE.

                                       

                                      I also checked the Nikon D5 and D750 models and they have the same lower color saturation Adobe Standard camera profiles. It appears new Nikon cameras and perhaps ALL manufacturers cameras released since Q3 2014 are affected. Standardized test Raw image files were downloaded from http://www.imaging-resource.com/ under Samples> Thumbnails in each camera review. I appreciate any feedback and your thoughts.

                                       

                                      All Canon EOS models released since Q3 2014 have lower color saturation Adobe Standard camera profiles with exception of the M3 mirrorless camera. I couldn't find any test image files for the new M5 mirrorless camera, but it is likely affected as well. Here's a summary of the affected Canon EOS models.

                                       

                                      Affected Canon EOS ModelsRelease dateImage processorSensor formatMegapixels
                                      7D Mk II2014Q3Dual DIGIC 6APS-C CMOS20.2
                                      M3 (not affected)2015Q1DIGIC 6APS-C CMOS24.2
                                      5Ds (v2 Profile affected)2015Q2Dual DIGIC 6Full-frame CMOS50.6
                                      5Ds R (v2 Profile affected)2015Q2Dual DIGIC 6Full-frame CMOS50.6
                                      T6i (750D)2015Q2DIGIC 6APS-C CMOS24.2
                                      T6s (760D)2015Q2DIGIC 6APS-C CMOS24.2
                                      M102015Q4DIGIC 6APS-C CMOS18
                                      1D X Mk II2016Q1Dual DIGIC 6+Full-frame CMOS20.2
                                      80D2016Q2DIGIC 6APS-C CMOS24.2
                                      T6 (1300D)2016Q2DIGIC 4+APS-C CMOS18
                                      5D Mk IV2016Q3DIGIC 6+Full-frame CMOS30.1
                                      M5 (test file unavailable)2016Q4DIGIC 7APS-C CMOS24.2
                                      4 people found this helpful
                                      • 16. Re: Canon 1dx II Color Issues with LR 6.7  HELP
                                        trshaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                        I recently purchased a new Canon G9 X Mark II camera that also has the same change to the Adobe Standard camera profile. I attempted to change the Tone Curve and Saturation settings using Adobe DNG Profile Editor (DPE). The tone curve change worked fine, but changing any setting (Hue, Saturation) in the DPE Color Matrices panel causes the image to become excessively saturated. It appears this "incompatibility" is caused by changes Adobe made to the camera profiles starting sometime in Q3 2014. Both Adobe Standard and Camera named profiles exhibit this issue, making it impossible to correct the color matrices for these profiles. The same color matrices controls available inside LR and ACR Camera Calibration panel work fine so it's just an issue with DPE.

                                         

                                        I've posted a Problem Report with more details here:

                                         

                                        Adobe DNG Profile Editor Issue - Incompatible With All Profiles Created After Q3 2014 | Photoshop Family Customer Commun…

                                        1 person found this helpful