15 Replies Latest reply on Mar 10, 2017 10:09 AM by NB, colourmanagement

    Wrong monitor profile used while editing

    Noguestpost Level 1

      Hi!

       

      I just spent quite a few hours to perfect the color of my image, only to find out that my Color Settings on my Mac had reverted to default! In other words, to an uncalibrated color profile (Color LCD it is called).

       

      At first I hoped this would be an easy fix. It turned out it was not, at least not for me. What I tried to do is:

      1.  Set monitor profile settings on my Mac to the calibrated color profile

      2.  In photoshop assign the uncalibrated color profile to the sRGB photo

      (3.  In photoshop convert to sRGB color profile)

       

      This would revert the damage done, right? The problem is I can't assign the Color LCD in Photoshop. I tried to put it in different locations, but to no avail. It's greyed out. Is there any difference between these two .icc profiles, explaining this? Please help!

       

      Noguestpost

        • 1. Re: Wrong monitor profile used while editing
          thedigitaldog MVP & Adobe Community Professional

          Why are you assigning the display profile to an existing RGB document? Is it a screen capture and untagged? If so, that is the right thing to do. Otherwise, probably not.  Click on the profile for the display you calibrated in System Preferences and you should be set.

          • 2. Re: Wrong monitor profile used while editing
            Noguestpost Level 1

            Maybe I had to clarify my question more thoroughly. I edited the file in Photoshop (sRGB assigned). My settings in photoshop were as they had to be. The problem is not in Photoshop, but in iMac --> System Preferences > Display -> Color profile. Accidentally, the default 'Color LCD.icc' profile was selected instead of my calibrated profile for the last two days.

             

            Because of this the colors were off, on this particular picture, when I set my color profile display settings correctly again. I want to convert my Photoshop progress of the last two days to the correct colors!

            • 3. Re: Wrong monitor profile used while editing
              gator soup Level 4

              i would advise you to Assign the sRGB profile to your document in Photoshop and go back to work on your color using the correct 'calibrated' monitor profile loaded in the OS

               

              probably get better (less thrashed) color going back to the original and starting over (lesson learned)...

               

              PS

               

              u were never viewing the "correct colors" in Photoshop because your monitor profile was wrong (according to your notes)

              • 4. Re: Wrong monitor profile used while editing
                gator soup Level 4

                how are you editing (and archiving) your Photoshop working documents -- using Photoshop ADJUSTMENT LAYERS for Levels, Curves, Selective Color adjustments and archiving/saving them in .psd format is recommended so you can go back and re-edit each Adjustment Layer if needed without more rounds of destructive moves...

                 

                if you are not working (and saving .psd) in Adjustment Layers it may be worth your time to read up on them especially for professional color work...

                • 5. Re: Wrong monitor profile used while editing
                  D Fosse Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                  You don't seem to realize that document profile and monitor profile are two different things, serving completely different purposes. Don't mix them up!

                   

                  Photoshop color settings only deal with document profiles, not monitor profiles.

                   

                  The monitor profile is set on system level, and Photoshop gets the profile from the OS. It is used by Photoshop to display the image, without any user intervention whatsoever (except making sure it's the right one).

                   

                  Document profile is converted into the monitor profile, on the fly as you work, and these corrected values are sent to the display. This is a color managed display path. For this to work, both profiles need to be present and correct.

                  • 6. Re: Wrong monitor profile used while editing
                    Noguestpost Level 1

                    Yes I do realize! I thought this was clear by what I wrote. If I open the document in Photoshop, and set system preferences to uncalibrated Color LCD.icc, the colors are showing as I want. Or are you saying that these two .icc profiles are not interchangeably because of a different structure?

                     

                    Anyway, since I have this uncalibrated .icc profile, and I do have the calibrated .icc profile, it should be possible to 'add' this color difference to the file itself right? So when viewing with the calibrated .icc the colors will be correct!

                    • 7. Re: Wrong monitor profile used while editing
                      D Fosse Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                      These two monitor profiles are only used to display the file. The file itself is not affected by that.

                       

                      So if you have the wrong monitor profile, you don't need to do anything to the file. You just need to set the correct monitor profile, and then it will display correctly. Then you will see the file truthfully represented on screen, as it is.

                       

                      There is just one basic requirement for a monitor profile: It must be an accurate description of the display's actual behavior in its current state. If it isn't, Photoshop will display incorrectly.

                      • 8. Re: Wrong monitor profile used while editing
                        Noguestpost Level 1

                        Yes ofcourse, but I DO want the file to be affected! As I explained! Because otherwise I would have to redo my color editing all over again on this picture.

                        • 9. Re: Wrong monitor profile used while editing
                          D Fosse Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                          OK, got it. Yes, you can assign the monitor profile in question and then convert to sRGB, as you said. If it looks right, go ahead.

                           

                          I tend to reply on reflex in these matters, which I did here. Sorry about that. So many people insist on using their monitor profiles in the document - simply because they don't understand the difference between them.

                          • 10. Re: Wrong monitor profile used while editing
                            thedigitaldog MVP & Adobe Community Professional

                            IF this is a screen capture and assigning the display profile produces the correct color appearance from that untagged document, that IS the right thing to do. IF the data is tagged and you're trying to match something not color managed, this isn't the right thing to do.

                            • 11. Re: Wrong monitor profile used while editing
                              Noguestpost Level 1

                              Haha thanks, I understand. Probably this would work, right? But I can't find out! Because for some reason I can't assign monitor profiles to documents in Photoshop (maybe they want to prevent confusion by this design).

                               

                              I tried duplicating the profile into different locations, restarting Photoshop, but still the profile does not show up. Any ideas?

                              • 12. Re: Wrong monitor profile used while editing
                                gator soup Level 4

                                default...uncalibrated color profile (Color LCD

                                 

                                i may suspect the the custom monitor profile is a problem because iMacs usually look fairly okay on their OSX default monitor space in Photoshop -- isn't there and iMac display Apple profile for your hardware

                                 

                                but you don't offer even the slightest clue as to the difference you are seeing between the good and bad...or your version of hardware/OSX or viewing environment

                                 

                                FYI: i don't see the Apple monitor profile choices in Edit> Assign Profile in CS6 either BUT u should be able to pick them up in View> Proof Set Up (with a little work) to compare the difference between Custom monitor, Apple Default monitors, AdobeRGB and sRGB for a big clue...

                                 

                                lastly: with the custom profile loaded, have you tried Assigning various profiles, including sRGB, legacy AppleRGB, AdobeRGB, ProPhotoRGB to see if one of them will snap your bad file closer to good (then Convert to back to sRGB)

                                 

                                again -- if you saved numerous color edits over hours editing in 8-bit -- your color is likely pretty beat up anyway

                                • 13. Re: Wrong monitor profile used while editing
                                  NB, colourmanagement Adobe Community Professional

                                  Hi,

                                   

                                  I hope i can help with that . Sorry this is late, I had attempted to post it a few minutes after your original but for some reason it had not appeared! Anyhow, I hope iot MIGHT contain some useful help?

                                   

                                  The method you're suggesting in your original post shows you've given it some thought but really I don't feel it's going to help you.

                                   

                                  By the way the "default" display profile which is produced by OSX [e.g. "ColorLCD"] can't be assigned to your files. It's NOT a normal ICC profile. And, anyway, I feel pretty strongly that would not fix your issue. You CAN assign "custom" display profiles, ones you made  [I can do that here], but NOT the default which is made by OSX first time it encounters a connected display.

                                   

                                  SO - I can see your thinking - BUT -

                                  Where you are now = when you set the "wrong" display profile in System preferences your images look right -

                                  OK,

                                  so that's an sRGB tagged image being converted to the display colourspace by photoshop on the fly (just for display). 

                                  Now it MIGHT work IF you could CONVERT from sRGB TO the "uncalibrated display" profile, but as that is not a "real profile you'll see it's not in any of your profile folders.

                                  So you have some manual work to do I am afraid.

                                   

                                  The display profile basically does one thing, it tells applications like Adobe Photoshop (and OSX) how to adjust image data on its way to the screen to give correct appearance. That’s IT.

                                   

                                  Here's an extreme example - imagine your screen was ageing and somehow had a green caste - Photoshop would (just for the preview) add magenta to image data en route to the screen to make them look right on the screen.

                                  If Photoshop did not do that you'd be tempted by the onscreen appearance to think your image had a green caste and to edit the file to get rid of the caste - but the image does not have a caste, so - that's not good.

                                   

                                  Screens are not usually that bad, though - but, still, it's always worth using the right profile. [ideally one you made for that screen using a colorimeter and a decent calibration & profiling utility].

                                  You can see from the above example that what's happened in your case is that the "false" display profile will (perhaps) have misled you as to image appearance. So you may have made some ill advised edits.

                                   

                                  It's probably not much of an issue, but here's how to assess and fix it.

                                   

                                  Do not alter the colourspace of your edited image, leave it as it was. It was sRGB I think, leave it light that.

                                  If you've made colourspace changes like that and you can't remember them to revert to sRGB, then just carry on from here.

                                   

                                  Open your Apple system preferences / displays and set the colour tab to the right icc profile for your screen. Like you mentioned in step "1" above.

                                   

                                  Now open the image in Photoshop.

                                  How does it look to your eyes? is it significantly different from the way it looked whilst being edited under the "false" screen profile?

                                  If it looks OK just leave it be.

                                  If there is a difference and you don't like the image so much now, you can simply use Photoshop's tools to edit it to fix the appearance.

                                   

                                  IMO no amount of assigning profiles or converting to another profile is going to fix what you did. So don't waste time trying to work out how to assign the mac's default LCD profile. It's not going to help even if you could.

                                   

                                   

                                  I hope this helps

                                  if so, please do mark my reply as "helpful" and if you're OK now, please mark it as "correct answer" so others who have similar issues can see the solution

                                  thanks

                                  neil barstow, colourmanagement

                                  • 14. Re: Wrong monitor profile used while editing
                                    NB, colourmanagement Adobe Community Professional

                                    Hi,

                                     

                                    I wanted to edit the post above but for some reason I am not allowed - so please read this instead!

                                    Having thought about it a bit more I realise that converting from sRGB to your "uncalibrated" display colourspace isn't going to work! pressed send too soon!!!

                                    read on though, there's help below


                                    I hope i can help with that . Sorry this is late, I had attempted to post it a few minutes after your original but for some reason it had not appeared! Anyhow, I hope it MIGHT contain some useful help?


                                    The method you're suggesting in your original post shows you've given it some thought but really I don't feel it's going to help you.


                                    By the way the "default" display profile which is produced by OSX [e.g. "ColorLCD"] can't easily be assigned to your files. It's NOT a normal ICC profile in that it has a weird naming strategy [displayed name in Photoshop is not what you'd expect].

                                    And, anyway, I feel pretty strongly that would not fix your issue. You CAN assign "custom" display profiles, ones you made  [I can do that here], but NOT the default which is made by OSX first time it encounters a connected display.

                                    SEE below for a way to fix that.


                                    SO - I can see your thinking - BUT -

                                    Where you are now = when you set the "wrong" display profile in System preferences your images look right -

                                    OK,

                                    so that's an sRGB tagged image being converted to the display colourspace by photoshop on the fly (just for display).

                                    BUT the display colorspace you used is wrong so your files have been edited whilst you were being misled.



                                    The display profile basically does one thing, it tells applications like Adobe Photoshop (and OSX) how to adjust image data on its way to the screen to give correct appearance. That’s IT.


                                    Here's an extreme example - imagine your screen was ageing and somehow had a green caste - Photoshop would (just for the preview) add magenta to image data en route to the screen to make them look right on the screen.

                                    If Photoshop did not do that you'd be tempted by the onscreen appearance to think your image had a green caste and to edit the file to get rid of the caste - but the image does not have a caste, so - that's not good.


                                    Screens are not usually that bad, though - but, still, it's always worth using the right profile. [ideally one you made for that screen using a colorimeter and a decent calibration & profiling utility].

                                    You can see from the above example that what's happened in your case is that the "false" display profile will (perhaps) have misled you as to image appearance. So you may have made some ill advised edits.


                                    It's probably not much of an issue, but here's how to assess and fix it.


                                    Do not alter the colourspace of your edited image, leave it as it was. It was sRGB I think, leave it light that.

                                    If you've made colourspace changes like that and you can't remember them to revert to sRGB, then just carry on from here.


                                    Open your Apple system preferences / displays and set the colour tab to the right icc profile for your screen. Like you mentioned in step "1" above.


                                    Now open the image in Photoshop.

                                    How does it look to your eyes? is it significantly different from the way it looked whilst being edited under the "false" screen profile?

                                    If it looks OK just leave it be.

                                    If there is a difference and you don't like the image so much now, you can simply use Photoshop's tools to edit it to fix the appearance.


                                    IMO no amount of assigning profiles or converting to another profile is going to fix what you did. So don't waste time trying to work out how to assign the mac's default LCD profile. It's not going to help even if you could.

                                     

                                     

                                    How to fix the profile visibility issue:

                                     

                                    I worked it out it's to do with the profile name tags

                                    go to system preferences / displays / color

                                    select the offending "uncalibrated" profile

                                    now click on "open profile"

                                    you'll see it has a weird name

                                    you can save it from here - "save as" to your profiles folder [give it a memorable name] - but it still does not show up in Photoshop for assigning or converting because the "internal = visible name" is different in the filesystem and in Photoshop [Photoshop shows the internal name]

                                     

                                    So the profile you have now needs to be opened in an application like Colorthink and set so that both internal and external name are the same.

                                    If you save it and send it to me I'll fix it for you and send it back. See my web address in my profile and contact me through the contact page. I'm not supposed to post an email address here.

                                     

                                    [ or try this: http://www.designtalkboard.com/tips/dtp/rename-icc-profile.php ]

                                    then you can try to assign as you wanted [EDIT: yep, that script works for me]

                                     

                                     

                                    I hope this helps

                                    if so, please do mark my reply as "helpful" and if you're OK now, please mark it as "correct answer" so others who have similar issues can see the solution

                                    thanks

                                    neil barstow, colourmanagement.net

                                    • 15. Re: Wrong monitor profile used while editing
                                      NB, colourmanagement Adobe Community Professional

                                      Hi Noguestpost

                                       

                                      thanks for the status

                                       

                                      now you have the profile working and visible in photoshop (I renamed the internal tag)

                                      perhaps report on whether it helps, sadly I don't expect it to

                                       

                                      thanks

                                      neil barstow, colourmanagement.net