32 Replies Latest reply on Mar 30, 2017 6:16 AM by PSJ_83

    Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?

    dazzin

      My friend and i are beginners in video editing and are struggeling getting faster rendering/analyze times.

       

      He has upgraded from an old Mac Pro 2.1 with dual Xenons, the new PC Computer got almost identical times as the Mac Pro.

       

      My Computer with i7 4790 (Not K) is almost twice as fast, how does that come?

       

      My computer

      Intel i7 4790 (4 Cores)
      20GB Ram PC3 128000
      SSD 128GB

      Quadro K2200

       

      My friends computer.

      Intel Xeon E5 2690 (8 Cores)
      32GB Ram PC3 12800
      SSD 256GB

      Quadro 2000

       

      Track camera in a 30 seconds movie:

       

      ~2 min with my computer

      ~4 min with my friends computer

       

      How to improve our rendering times?

       

      Best Regards

      Daniel

        • 1. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
          Bill Gehrke Most Valuable Participant

          It is hard to tell with the information provided so far.  If you want to download my Premiere Pro BenchMark (PPBM) and run that on both machines if will let us know with this well establish benchmark where your strengths and weakness's may be.  It has four tests with ability to test the CPU, GPU, and disk system.  Just post the results of the Output.csv files here and I will comment on those results.

           

          The Xeon does seem like it should be more powerful because it has more cores and threads but it is two years older than the i7 PC so it may be lacking some newer instructions.  By the way does it have dual Xeons?

           

          The i7 PC has a more powerful GPU, but we do not know if your media even uses any of the GPU accelerated effects and features.

           

          We do not know where your project files are located and how many storage devices you have, surely you have more than just the one SSD listed for each system.

           

          I do have posted the CPU results from another i7-4790

          • 2. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
            dazzin Level 1

            Thanks for replying!

             

            I will do the test and post results, interesting!

             

            At the moment i only got 1 SSD in the machine, the OS-disk. I have read about setups with multiple disk för media, scratch disk etc. It havent been my nr1 priority, i got a couple of disks to be installed, just want to figure out how i want/need everything to work.

             

            The clip i was editing.

            1GB 1920*1080 .MOV 2:36

            I only edited the first 30 seconds as a test to compare our cumputers.

             

            The result was the same with Mercury GPU / Software setting.

             

            /Daniel

            • 3. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
              dazzin Level 1

              A Little bit uncertain about step 8.

               

              Select MPEG2-DVD? Then what, a second export?

               

              I havent done anything with MPEG2-DVD. I ran the export and then tried to open "Statistics PPBM11 CC.vbs" but i get an error (Row 72). Cant find the file?

               

              Perhaps the output of "Disk Test" is wrong, where should it be placed? Cant find any information of that.

              • 4. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                Bill Gehrke Most Valuable Participant

                All  exports should  be in the same place where the project is.  If you are exporting to another location CUT (do not copy) and paste to the project location so the Statistics XXX file is the correct one for your version of Premiere.  The current  version is Premiere 11

                • 5. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                  dazzin Level 1

                  I did it!

                   

                  I will reinstall my OS as the SSD only writes in 140MB, got a 256GB Toshiba i´ve been trying to use as clone, but my PC cant find the OS so i Think i need to reinstall everything.

                   

                  I´m going to upload these results to PPBM.

                  ppbm.jpg

                  • 6. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                    dazzin Level 1

                    With a fresh clone. 480MB Write speed...

                     

                    ppbm.png

                    • 7. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                      Bill Gehrke Most Valuable Participant

                      That was the worst SSD I have ever seen, congratulations on the successful clone job as you can see the Disk I/O the first number in the Output.csv file has improved from 674 seconds to 93 seconds.  This laptop which I upgraded to two SATA III SSD's gets that score down to 77 seconds.

                       

                      If you look at the CPU intensive 4th number you 591 seconds and if you look at the CPU intensive scores on PPBM8.com you will see your i7-4790 does better than the one I show which scored 661 second.

                       

                      Will we be seeing test data on the Xeon system?

                      • 8. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                        dazzin Level 1

                        Yes that was a terriblir SSD. Some kind of stock SSD in a desktop PC. Perhaps there is possible to get better times with a another SSD but this will be good enough atm. I will try to install som separate drives instead and see what kind of improvement i can get from that.

                         

                        How good is MPE 10,6? I was looking around at your site to compare it but couldnt find any usable charts?

                         

                        About the Xenon;

                        He had some kind of problem running the test yesterday and sent me this picture, perhaps you got a clue about the error message? The earlier tests went well.

                        IMG_2311.JPG

                         

                         

                        Regards

                        Daniel

                        Sweden

                        • 9. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                          jasonvp Level 3

                          dazzin  wrote

                           

                          He had some kind of problem running the test yesterday and sent me this picture, perhaps you got a clue about the error message? The earlier tests went well.

                          A lot of us have been seeing that error when doing exports with accelerated affects.  There's some unhappiness between Pr and NVidia that hasn't been figured out yet.  So, unfortunately, it means your friend won't be able to properly run the benchmarks. :-(

                          • 10. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                            RjL190365 Level 4

                            I believe that such an error might have been caused by an obsolete GPU:

                             

                            Since the advent of Premiere Pro CC 2015.3, Fermi GPUs such as that Quadro 2000 might not work properly with MPE GPU acceleration enabled. Your system's Quadro K2200, on the other hand, is of the first-generation Maxwell architecture (in fact, it is a slightly lower clocked GeForce GTX 750 Ti with Turbo disabled and slightly slower memory). You see, Adobe has been discontinuing GPU acceleration support for older-generation (more than three years old) GPUs of late.

                            2 people found this helpful
                            • 11. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                              Bill Gehrke Most Valuable Participant

                              Tell your friend to try running the H.264 export without GPU acceleration enabled.  It will be a very big number but should allow him to run all four tests so we can at least see and compare the other three test results.  Thank you RJL

                               

                              I have not concentrated on MPE gain like Harm did.  Your 614/57 = 10.6.  This is moderately good.  Your 614 seconds as I said is very good for that CPU.  But your 57 seconds in not very good but it all depends on if and now many GPU accelerated effect and features you use.  If you were to replace it with a recent  GTX card even like a GTX 1050 it probably reduce that number.  Quadro cards cost more and really are only justified if you have very expensive 10-bit monitors.

                              • 12. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                                dazzin Level 1

                                Thanks!

                                 

                                I will! I think he´s away this weekend, so perhaps we can have a result on Monday.

                                 

                                /Daniel

                                • 13. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                                  PSJ_83

                                  Hello.

                                  I'm the "Friend" haha.

                                   

                                  First of all, thank you so much for all the help!

                                   

                                  After a busy weekend, I have now completed the test but unfortunately the .vbs file does not work fore me. (Sorry fore swedish in the screencap).

                                  And yes, I have completed all the tests successfully

                                  Skärmklipp.PNG

                                   

                                  Right now I'm trying to buy a GTX 780 graphics card which should be very good in permier pro compared to my current Quadro 2000 card.

                                  • 14. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                                    Bill Gehrke Most Valuable Participant

                                    What that error message means is that you exported to another location than the project files and we have no way of knowing where they are.  Statistics???.vbs cannot find your files so either CUT and paste the exports to the project file location or move the Statisticsxxx.vbs file to the export location.

                                    • 15. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                                      PSJ_83 Level 1

                                      Oh, now i feel stupid
                                      Skärmklipp2.PNG

                                       

                                       

                                      Here is my results.

                                      • 16. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                                        PSJ_83 Level 1

                                        It's very strange results compared with Dazzin. The computers are still quite similar in performance but still it's very big difference in the results.

                                        • 17. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                                          PSJ_83 Level 1

                                          I made a new test.

                                          This time with a separate SSD (Samsung 840).

                                           

                                          PPBM11.PNG

                                          ssd_samsung_840.PNG

                                          speccy.PNG

                                           

                                          The strangest thing is the H.264 time!

                                          Last test is with no CUDA.

                                          • 18. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                                            Bill Gehrke Most Valuable Participant

                                            Notice your results on # 1 above where your Disk I/O export time of 250 MB/s matches the ~250 MB/sec sequential write rate of the CrystalDiskMark scores.  This is not as good as a good SATA III SSD Should do but much better than any hard disk drive.

                                             

                                            Your H.264 score is reasonable without CUDA assistance, this laptop with GPU acceleration turned off scores 1385 seconds and my 8-core i7-5960X at 4.5 GHz is 411 seconds

                                            • 19. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                                              PSJ_83 Level 1

                                              Thank you so mutch Bill

                                              So with a nice GPU the result will be better?

                                               

                                              On monday i will have a GTX 680, that wuld do it

                                               

                                              I have also replaced the 250gb samsung with a new 525 gb Crucial that reads and writes ~500MB/s.

                                               

                                              Hope the results will be better.

                                               

                                              I have even thought about closing of two or four cores to maximize the "turbo frequency". What do you think about that?

                                              • 20. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                                                Bill Gehrke Most Valuable Participant

                                                PSJ_83  wrote

                                                 

                                                Thank you so mutch Bill

                                                1.  So with a nice GPU the result will be better?

                                                 

                                                2.  On monday i will have a GTX 680, that wuld do it

                                                 

                                                3.  I have also replaced the 250gb samsung with a new 525 gb Crucial that reads and writes ~500MB/s.

                                                 

                                                4.  Hope the results will be better.

                                                 

                                                5.  I have even thought about closing of two or four cores to maximize the "turbo frequency". What do you think about that?

                                                1. Yes that should improve both GPU scores.
                                                2. You may have to do some experimenting with drivers to find one that works well
                                                3. I have not seen that bad write performance on any of my Samsung 840 Pro SSD's is that a 840 EVO?
                                                4. They will be better!
                                                5. I have never tried that but doubt that will help and actually think it will increase your CPU intensive score
                                                1 person found this helpful
                                                • 21. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                                                  PSJ_83 Level 1

                                                  It's not a pro just 840, but far from the samsung spec.

                                                  The GTX680 is one of the cards that is "certified" by Adobe acording to this:

                                                  Premiere Pro System Requirements for Mac OS and Windows

                                                   

                                                  I hope it will be a clean installation and work fine with the latest drivers.

                                                  • 22. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                                                    Bill Gehrke Most Valuable Participant

                                                    Forget about the GTX 680 it is now near antique status.  Go with a GTX 1060 6GB

                                                    • 23. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                                                      PSJ_83 Level 1

                                                      It's hard to fin a better card for the money. $50 is more or less a bargin if you look at the preformance vs money, I hope.

                                                      • 24. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                                                        RjL190365 Level 4

                                                        In spite of that GPU being listed in the Adobe-recommended list, it may not work properly or even at all in GPU-accelerated mode. In fact, if that GTX 680 requires CSM support enabled when used in an EFI system, you may be forced to permanently lock Premiere to the MPE software-only mode just to even get it to work at all.

                                                         

                                                        Why? Because Adobe has ceased (or more specifically, put a moratorium on) testing newer GPUs for MPE GPU acceleration compatibility, and Adobe has been dropping older GPUs from it's MPE GPU acceleration support. That GTX 680 is, indeed, on the verge of being dropped completely from Adobe's GPU support list.

                                                         

                                                        Addendum: Adobe has also put further development of MPE on hiatus. As such, older GPUs get dropped from Adobe's MPE GPU support while adding no new features or feature support to the MPE GPU acceleration.

                                                        1 person found this helpful
                                                        • 25. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                                                          PSJ_83 Level 1

                                                          Okay, now my GTX 680 is in my computer, bad or not it's there

                                                           

                                                          here is a pic of the size-diferense. i know size doesn't matter but its a impresive peas of card.

                                                          IMG_0394.jpg

                                                           

                                                          So i installd al the defalt driver and PP worked perfect.

                                                           

                                                          PPBM11.JPG

                                                          SPECCY.JPG

                                                           

                                                          as you can se is the SSD is not working fast. Dont know why. i made a test a few days aga and i got ~500/500mbs

                                                           

                                                          today i got this..

                                                          as ssd crucial.JPG

                                                          • 26. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                                                            RjL190365 Level 4

                                                            Unfortunately, this joy may be very short-lived. Who knows what the next major release of Premiere Pro CC may bring (in terms of MPE GPU acceleration support)? That is exactly why I did not, and still don't, recommend getting any older GPU that is on the brink of becoming EOSL'd.

                                                            • 27. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                                                              PSJ_83 Level 1

                                                              ok, time will tell then

                                                              • 28. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                                                                PSJ_83 Level 1

                                                                I want to thank you all for very good suport and super friendly reception!

                                                                • 29. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                                                                  RjL190365 Level 4

                                                                  I took a closer look at those results, and while they look much improved, that CPU-intensive MPEG2 DVD result with MPE off is only about equal to that of a typical later-generation 6-core Intel CPU (at its default turbo clocks) despite that E5-2690 (v1) having eight physical cores and 16 threads. It is also only slightly faster than even my overclocked i7-4790K Haswell Refresh quad-core, let alone an overclocked Skylake or Kaby Lake i7 quad-core.

                                                                  • 30. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                                                                    PSJ_83 Level 1

                                                                    true true.

                                                                    well it seams the MHz is king of premier pro not number of cores.

                                                                     

                                                                    CUDA cores seams to do quite big diferense in the daily work and is a inportant hardware in the system.

                                                                     

                                                                    It's a shame that NVIDIA clearing their lists with the old graphics card that is sent to Adobe, all for additional sales.

                                                                    • 31. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                                                                      RjL190365 Level 4

                                                                      Also, keep in mind that the E5-2690 in your system is now five years old. Thus, it will be quite a bit slower than newer-generation CPUs of the same MHz and with the same number of cores and threads.

                                                                      • 32. Re: Fast Xenon 2690 slower than i7 4790?
                                                                        PSJ_83 Level 1

                                                                        yes thats true. but its quite a lot of performance/dollar