9 Replies Latest reply on Mar 18, 2017 7:02 AM by StricklySpeaking

    Using NAS drive for your images.

    StricklySpeaking Level 1

      As you work in the digital world you accumulate a growing number of images and therefore data to be stored and backed up. The ever increasing camera resolution and capability add to the exponential growth of your data. The result is you must move your files off your laptop or desktop computer. A desktop can be expanded for a while but you will eventually max this out too.

       

      While working with Lightroom 2015.9 I have recently experienced problems generating XMP metadata files for PSD files in my Lightroom library with originals stored on a NAS system. I made sure the PSD files were created with the  Maximize PSD and PSB File Compatibility set to ALWAYS.  I contacted Adobe on a chat session and I was told that Adobe recommends not using an NAS or external drive. They recommend keeping all your data on the local computer. I could not believe what I was hearing.

       

      I see references to people using NAS drives and External drives. I have well over a tera bite of data and it is growing at a fast rate. I have a 10 TB NAS drive system with a second one doing backup images using a robust network. It does slow me down a little but I can live with the speed to get the advantage of the storage and the automated backup.

       

      Lightroom is a database driven package that is typically working with smaller files. I keep the catalog on my local system.

       

      I am searching for a solution for this issue but the path is not clear to me.

       

       

       

       

        • 2. Re: Using NAS drive for your images.
          Michael J. Hoffman Adobe Community Professional

          StricklySpeaking  wrote

           

          While working with Lightroom 2015.9 I have recently experienced problems generating XMP metadata files for PSD files in my Lightroom library with originals stored on a NAS system.

           

           

          What kinds of problems, exactly? Can you provide specifics, error messages, etc that you are experiencing? Do you have LR set to automatically write XMP metadata to files, or are you manually writing? Note that the XMP metadata for a PSD (and TIF, JPG, DNG, etc) are stored in the actual file, so you won't expect to see a sidecar file. However, raw images, due to their read-only nature, require LT to generate the sidecar .xmp file when you write metadata.

           

          Yes, the "official" answer is not to use NAS at all (not supported), but many people use them very successfully. If you provide more information about the nature of the problems you are having, we might be able to help.

           

          Mike

          • 3. Re: Using NAS drive for your images.
            StricklySpeaking Level 1

            A few of the error messages are included below:

             

            Could not write metadata. Unknown file I/O error. (18)

                /Volumes/DroboFS/tdb1310c0286/1/Photography/H4D/110130/A0000029.3FR (These are Hasselblad raw files typically get an XMP sidecar file for each)

                /Volumes/DroboFS/tdb1310c0286/1/Photography/H4D/110220/A0000189.3FR

             

            Photos have read-only access. (66)

                /Volumes/DroboFS/tdb1310c0286/1/Photography/Inventory/Original Digital Scans/COAST.TIF (I do not see a write limitation. On a Mac so I will look at this with linux and use chmod if needed.)

                /Volumes/DroboFS/tdb1310c0286/1/Photography/Inventory/Original Digital Scans/COSTUME.TIF

                /Volumes/DroboFS/tdb1310c0286/1/Photography/H4D/110401/Phocus Exports/A_0057.psd

                /Volumes/DroboFS/tdb1310c0286/1/Photography/H4D/110401/Phocus Exports/A_0128.psd

             

            Could not write metadata. Unknown file formats. (395)

                /Volumes/DroboFS/tdb1310c0286/1/Photography/H4D/110325B/Phocus Exported/North Overlood of Canyonlands National Park_2279.tif  (No idea what is going on here. I plan to look at the files more)

                /Volumes/DroboFS/tdb1310c0286/1/Photography/H4D/110325B/Phocus Exported/North Overlood of Canyonlands National Park_2280.tif

               …..

                /Volumes/DroboFS/tdb1310c0286/1/Photography/H4D/110325B/Phocus Exported/So Utah Area_0882.psd      (These files are mostly exported by Hasselblad Phocus and this program may not be generating a PSD file that LR likes. They do work fine with PS however. )

                /Volumes/DroboFS/tdb1310c0286/1/Photography/H4D/110325B/Phocus Exported/So Utah Area_0885.psd

             

            Yes, LR is set to automatically write XMP metadata files.

             

            I have also tried to manually write the files one selected at a time and also as a group.

             

            I think your list of files that include sidecar files is not correct. I agree that some formats do not require a sidecar file. The main issue I had was with PDF files and I have about 800 that have the problem indicated. I have set LR to “Don’t show me this issue again” when I stop LR. I feel LR is probably constantly working in the background trying to write the XMP data or file.

             

            I am continuing to work using the NAS drive. I have been using a NAS drive for several years. I just did not like hearing that Adobe was not supporting NAS drives. Again this is not a practical situation considering storage needs of digital photography.

             

            I just returned from shooting today and I see I generated 40.8 GB of file data. I will boil this down a lot but I need to be able to use NAS or I will drown.

             

            Thanks for the reply and any suggestions or comments.

            • 4. Re: Using NAS drive for your images.
              johnrellis Most Valuable Participant

              I contacted Adobe on a chat session and I was told that Adobe recommends not using an NAS or external drive. They recommend keeping all your data on the local computer. I could not believe what I was hearing.

              I think that support person is mistaken (which happens too frequently, I'm afraid).  While LR requires that catalog folder to be on a direct-attached drive (either inside your computer or attached via USB or Thunderbolt), LR supports placing photos on external drives and NAS. I've never seen an official statement "recommending" against external drives and NAS, and Adobe would be laughed off the Internet if they ever published such a thing.   NAS and external drives are essential for anyone with a very large catalog.

              • 5. Re: Using NAS drive for your images.
                Conrad C Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                It probably depends on the application background of the Adobe support person they talk to. I'm not sure if the Lightroom team has made any statements about NAS storage other than saying you can't put the catalog database there, but other Adobe application teams have made more specific statements about network storage over the years, generally advising against it.

                 

                So whatever the truth is about Lightroom network storage storage, the consistent message across many other Adobe application support teams is that networks are difficult to troubleshoot due to complexity, OS bugs, etc:

                 

                Re: Photoshop CS6 not saving to server (Adobe forums)

                "Note: Photoshop does not officially support saving to servers, because there are many problems with servers and networks outside our control." - Photoshop engineer

                Illustrator support for networks and removable media (Adobe tech doc)

                While you can use Illustrator files from networks and removable media, you can compromise the performance and reliability of the application.

                Networks and removable media with Digital Video (Adobe tech doc)

                Adobe Technical Support only supports using Adobe Premiere Pro, Adobe Premiere Elements, After Effects, Encore, Media Encoder, Prelude, or SpeedGrade on a local hard disk. It's difficult to re-create or accurately identify network- and peripheral-configuration problems...While Adobe Premiere Pro works across networks and removable media, these configurations compromise the performance and reliability of the application.

                Saving Adobe files to a network volume/share is not supported

                • 6. Re: Using NAS drive for your images.
                  Jao vdL Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                  Generally storing originals on a NAS should work just fine but :

                   

                  >While working with Lightroom 2015.9 I have recently experienced problems generating XMP metadata files for PSD files in my Lightroom library with originals stored on a NAS system.

                   

                  is where the problem is. If you need to write xmp to a psd file on a network drive, it more or less rewrites the entire file which is a problem when you have to send it over the network as psd files get really large especially when you work with a few layers and use maximize compatibility as you should. When you write xmp to raw files, it just places a small xmp file right next to the raw file which is much easier to rewrite after every edit in Lightroom. So the solution is to not automatically write xmp files and only do it when you really need to.

                  • 7. Re: Using NAS drive for your images.
                    StricklySpeaking Level 1

                    Thanks to all for the postings and the ideas.

                     

                    I notice the links that Staff posted indicated the same issue I have and they were one year ago. One guy trying to use the cloud, ugggg.

                     

                    I will continue to use the NAS drives and keep my catalog on the local system as I have been doing. Don't like the idea of manually writing XMP files but I can see how it would work. I would be working for Light Room instead of having Light Room work for me.

                     

                    I may decide to split my work up into multiple catalogs and put the catalogs that LR has trouble with on a local machine. This will eventually grow into a problem though. I also was trying to go with a single catalog as suggested by some.

                     

                    Supporting network issues could be a problem I guess but supporting computers in general was in the beginning and NAS is getting down the road. LR developers will eventually come around. I hope!

                     

                    I could go buy a new Mac Tower and try to put 10 TB of RAID storage on that. Then backup to the NAS on the network in a different building. I would need to sell the idea to my finance minister though, you may not hear from me again.

                    • 8. Re: Using NAS drive for your images.
                      Jao vdL Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                      Do you have a good reason to be writing xmp metadata to your files? There really is no reason to do this if you're not accessing these images from another computer and want the Lightroom edits to be visible. It is a very duplicative thing to be doing otherwise that just increases network traffic and makes your files get overwritten all the time without any real benefit. Just make sure your catalog gets backed up once in a while which is where the edits are really stored.

                      • 9. Re: Using NAS drive for your images.
                        StricklySpeaking Level 1

                        Yes, I use a laptop for portable work and a faster Desktop computer for local working of images and Printing. I do work on both computers.

                         

                        I backup every time I exit Lightroom to the local laptop and I occasionally move a copy to the NAS by hand and time machine does a backup also. I have also used the backups when problems have come up.

                         

                        I have a top level folder on the NAS called Photography and then a folder for each camera type including iPhone. Then I have a folder for Lightroom which is the backups of catalog. All this at the top level on the NAS so it only takes a few keystrokes to drill down when I manually go there.

                         

                        Thanks again for your suggestions. They are all good.