13 Replies Latest reply on Mar 28, 2017 7:01 PM by RoninEdits

    Down to the Wire - Ryzen or Intel

    MyerPj Level 3

      So, I've been getting the parts together for my new rig. I was basically planning to get Asus x99 Deluxe II with an i7-6850K. But I have been waiting to see if the price drops due to Ryzen, or even if I should go that direction. I'm don't think I'm an AMD type, but then again, maybe I could... Here's the parts I've purchased so far, which I think will work for either. Though the memory is on the QVL for the ASUS motherboard and I have no idea which motherboard to get if I went Ryzen. Any thoughts on whether the 6850k will be cheaper soon ($569 currently at B/H) and/or the wisdom of going AMD. Cheers!    

       

      My Current Items:

      EVGA GeForce GTX 1070 FTW2 icx
      Noctua NH-D15S CPU Cooler
      G.Skill TridentZ Series 64GB (4x16) - F4-3200C16Q-64GTZKW
      Samsung 960 PRO 512Gb
      Samsung 960 EVO 500Gb
      Fractal Design R5 Case - Titanium
      Corsair HXi Series HX850i 850W Power Supply
      2 - Fractal Design FD-FAN-DYN-X2-GP14-WT 140mm Case Fans
        • 1. Re: Down to the Wire - Ryzen or Intel
          chrisw44157881 Level 4

          because the price of intel chips is dropping so fast, amd is basically in a losing battle, even puget doesn't recommend selling it in their systems. but what they didn't do is overclock the living heck out of the amd chips.

          https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Premiere-Pro-CC-2017-AMD-Ryzen-7-1700X-1800X-Pe rformance-909/

           

          Memory leak/out of memory - Ryzen 1700X system

          AMD wins with unknown overclock ppbm8 there's also rumours about memory leaks.

           

          The way I see it, if you overclock to at least 4ghz or higher 4.1, then maybe it's worth it except maybe it will burn out after a while. We  still don't know the longevity of the chip. increasing voltage is like running a sports car at high RPM. sure it's fast, until it blows a piston ring. Then again, if you like overclocking, a 6900x super overlocked would still be faster anyway. Its a fan boy decision until we find out more.

          • 2. Re: Down to the Wire - Ryzen or Intel
            RoninEdits Most Valuable Participant

            chrisw44157881  wrote

            because the price of intel chips is dropping so fast, amd is basically in a losing battle

            you make it sound like intel is going to have a massive price cut to their cpu's. where do you see this? do you really think intel is going to drop the price of its 8 core cpu to compete with the amd $330-500 cpu's?

             

            even puget doesn't recommend selling it in their systems

            puget is in the business of selling expensive computers. if you look thru several of their recommendations or articles, their recommendations are clearly there just for price markups. they also have their reputation to consider. so it makes sense for them to stick with the more known and expensive option. the only reason puget lists in that article for not choosing the amd is that its limited to 64gb. we already knew that limitation, but something we learned from the puget article is how well the amd cpu performs.

             

            Memory leak/out of memory - Ryzen 1700X system 

            AMD wins with unknown overclock ppbm8 there's also rumours about memory leaks.

            besides that one post, what other memory leak rumors?

             

            The way I see it, if you overclock to at least 4ghz or higher 4.1, then maybe it's worth it except maybe it will burn out after a while. We  still don't know the longevity of the chip. increasing voltage is like running a sports car at high RPM. sure it's fast, until it blows a piston ring. Then again, if you like overclocking, a 6900x super overlocked would still be faster anyway. Its a fan boy decision until we find out more.

            why do you only see value at 4-4.1ghz? wouldn't the 50-70% savings still be worth it at 3.8ghz or lower? why is it a fan boy decision when there is so much info about ryzen already out?

            • 3. Re: Down to the Wire - Ryzen or Intel
              Bill Gehrke Most Valuable Participant

              Well I have preliminary results which says that the using my Premiere Pro BenchMark (PPBM) that the AMD Ryzen $330 CPU (with a $200 motherboard) equals my $1000 Intel i7-5960X in running a CPU intensive Premiere Pro benchmark.  It is going to take more tests and other users results before we can be sure, but indications are that is truly the case.  I would love to test it myself but that takes money that I do not have.

               

              These two results (three test runs) that I have received are using the Gigabyte GA-AX370-Gaming 5.

               

              I have now published an update to my CPU ranking on PPBM8

              • 4. Re: Down to the Wire - Ryzen or Intel
                Bill Gehrke Most Valuable Participant

                chrisw44157881  wrote

                 

                The way I see it, if you overclock to at least 4ghz or higher 4.1, then maybe it's worth it except maybe it will burn out after a while. We  still don't know the longevity of the chip. increasing voltage is like running a sports car at high RPM. sure it's fast, until it blows a piston ring. Then again, if you like overclocking, a 6900x super overlocked would still be faster anyway. Its a fan boy decision until we find out more.

                chris

                I have been running my i7-5960X for better than two years at 4.5 GHz without any over-voltage at all.

                Bill

                • 5. Re: Down to the Wire - Ryzen or Intel
                  RoninEdits Most Valuable Participant

                  Bill Gehrke wrote

                  I have been running my i7-5960X for better than two years at 4.5 GHz without any over-voltage at all.

                   

                  that seems impossible to get that clock speed without using more volts than stock. are you using "auto" and letting the motherboard over-volt? doing that often increases voltage higher than necessary and can get into dangerous volts, which can reduce the lifespan as chris says.

                  • 6. Re: Down to the Wire - Ryzen or Intel
                    MyerPj Level 3

                    https://forums.adobe.com/people/Bill+Gehrke  wrote

                     

                    It is going to take more tests and other users results before we can be sure, but indications are that is truly the case.

                    I think that's the answer. The timing is off for me to 'experiment' with an AMD. I'll go with the Intel this go 'round. I'm not really into experimenting on the processor, I'll watch the market and see where it goes, I could always build an AMD box at some point, but not just now for me.

                    • 7. Re: Down to the Wire - Ryzen or Intel
                      RjL190365 Level 5

                      chrisw44157881  wrote

                       

                      because the price of intel chips is dropping so fast,

                       

                      You are completely wrong on that statement. Intel tends to keep all of its CPUs at or very close to their original as-released prices until their discontinuation. (And yes, this happens even if some of its CPUs are outperformed by some of AMD's less-expensive newcomers.)

                       

                      Good call for the OP on going Intel, as the AMD Ryzen platform is still not mature enough for me to recommend at this point.

                      • 8. Re: Down to the Wire - Ryzen or Intel
                        Bill Gehrke Most Valuable Participant

                        Well you forced me to double check and I found that it was overvoltaged to 1.3 volts.  I never paid attention to it and did not adjust it myself.  As you said somehow it automatically overvolted and I did not realize it.  But in any case it still is working every day.

                        • 9. Re: Down to the Wire - Ryzen or Intel
                          RoninEdits Most Valuable Participant

                          yikes, overclocking a $1k cpu to extremes without knowing how to overclock just sounds crazy to me.

                          • 10. Re: Down to the Wire - Ryzen or Intel
                            MyerPj Level 3

                            OK guys, thanks for the discussion. I dropped the hammer today, purchased the last two items for my new build:

                             

                            I7-6850k

                            Asus x99 Deluxe II

                             

                            ...plus the bits I already have per the OP.

                             

                            I'll post my PPBM times next week when I put it all together. I think I'll do a minor overclock, maybe 4.0 or 4.1? Does that sound like a reasonable target?

                            • 11. Re: Down to the Wire - Ryzen or Intel
                              RoninEdits Most Valuable Participant

                              overclock will depend on the silicon lottery, but in general 4.2ghz is near max on broadwell-e. so even 4.1ghz overclock might be considered a "high" overclock, vs "minor" or low overclock.

                               

                              you may also want to look at intel's extra protection plan, its suppose to cover a fried overclock cpu.

                              https://click.intel.com/tuningplan/

                              • 12. Re: Down to the Wire - Ryzen or Intel
                                MyerPj Level 3

                                Do you know of a recommended overclocking guide? Reading a bit lately on it, it seems just enabling XMP does increase the performance. Is that considered overclocking for warranty

                                • 13. Re: Down to the Wire - Ryzen or Intel
                                  RoninEdits Most Valuable Participant

                                  there are lots of broadwell-e overclock guides, even one from asus. i would recommend reading a few and comparing them before you decide how you want to overclock. you don't have to overclock right away, you can do it after you feel comfortable with the info in the guides. some xmp profiles will overclock the base clock, which can overclock the cpu. getting the memory running at its 3200mhz is considered overclocking for the memory controller inside the cpu, but i don't know how intel treats that for the warranty.