11 Replies Latest reply on Oct 2, 2008 10:27 AM by pixlor

    Changing the colours in a logo

    johngordon12 Level 1
      A client of mine has supplied me with a logo, but asked if I can change its colours to fit in with a new website design.

      I've managed to change most of it OK where solid colour is used, but not sure how to easily change the colours on the edges to soften them.

      I've posted the logo here to show what I mean. The darker colour on the right is pretty much OK, but the orange edges are particularly bad.

      Any pointers or help with this would be much appreciated.

      link here
        • 1. Re: Changing a logo's colours
          Level 7
          Iain71 wrote:

          > I've managed to change most of it OK where solid colour is used, but not sure
          > how to easily change the colours on the edges to soften them.

          Have you tried the Color Replace tool?

          --
          Linda Rathgeber - Adobe Community Expert
          http://www.adobe.com/communities/experts/members/8.html
          --------------------------------------------------------------
          • 2. Re: Changing a logo's colours
            johngordon12 Level 1
            Its funny you should mention that. I did also try playing around with an actual photo of a flower using the colour replace tool, and found that it was smarter than I'd realised, in that it seemed to take gradients into account, and I got surprisingly good results making the flower less pink :

            link here

            But when I tried it with the logo, it only wanted to literally change the colours selected to the new colour.

            Should this be easier than literally zooming right in and doing it on an almost pixel by pixel basis?
            • 3. Re: Changing the colours in a logo
              JoeDaSilva Level 4
              You could learn how to use the pen tool and redraw the logo. That would give you the most control because you'd end up with a scalable vector version of the logo that would allow you to change the color at will with a single mouse click.

              You could also ask the client to provide you with an AI or EPS version of the logo (Adobe Illustrator) which is where it was probably originally designed. Given you have access to illustrator you'd then be able to bring the logo into Fireworks from there.

              • 4. Re: Changing the colours in a logo
                johngordon12 Level 1
                Joey - I would love to learn how to use the pen tool properly. Its not something I've never needed that often, but when I have tried, I've always got extremely frustrated by it. Can you recommend any good tutorials on it?

                (Although I'll be the first to concede my patience has usually gotten the better of me when I have tried in the past!)
                • 5. Changing the colours in a logo
                  pixlor Level 4
                  I tried the Fireworks pen tool and got frustrated almost immediately!

                  Um...if you like, you can go to http://drop.io/FWpixlor and grab the file lotus.ai. I traced your bitmap in Expression 3, which has a nice pen tool that I know how to use. You can import this into Fireworks, clear the stroke, and set the fill as you need. (Sorry that I don't have a direct link, I'm new to using drop.io and don't know if it's possible. The file will expire 1 month from last access.)

                  If your client has the original vector file (.eps or .ai,), that would be the best option, though.

                  cheers!
                  • 6. Re: Changing the colours in a logo
                    JoeDaSilva Level 4
                    Ahhh, you both need to learn the Bezier Pen! It's by far the most powerful computer-aided graphic design tool at your disposal.

                    Here's the hard-core, math oriented explanation via Wikipedia:

                    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B%C3%A9zier_curve#Computer_graphics

                    Here's an awesome tutorial that explains it in plain english via YouTube:

                    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umoK473vTAY

                    The more you practice the easier it gets. But the logo that Lain posted would be childs play for someone who has a solid Bezier pen technique.

                    (I'm not familiar with Expression 3 Pixlor, but I don't find the Fireworks pen tool much different from Illustrator or Flash. Forgive me if you're already familiar with the Bezier Pen).
                    • 7. Changing the colours in a logo
                      pixlor Level 4
                      Expression 3 evolved into Microsoft Expression Design 4 and it's a decent vector editing program. Not as powerful as Illustrator, but it had natural media strokes and transparency in the 90s when Expression 1 was released as the vector-based companion to Painter by Fractal Design.

                      Expression has two pens. I used the standard pen, because it's easier for tracing shapes. (I don't think the Fireworks pen is a Bezier pen, either, as the nodes are on the shape itself.) Each shape in the file I made is 21 points:seven node points and 14 handle points. The relationship of the handles can be set one of four ways. Individual nodes can be selected and modified or multiple nodes can be selected and modified. It's really quite straightforward to use.

                      I've played with Illustrator some, but I know Expression better. I've also played with Inkscape and Freehand a very tiny bit. When I tried the pen in Fireworks earlier today, it didn't act as I expected. I went to move a node slightly and suddenly I had extra points where I didn't want them and a big arc that messed up the line I'd started. No other program I've used has ever done that. So I gave up!

                      But, to be more fair, I gave it another try. I don't see a tool that allows me to change a corner node into a node with handles, so that I can create a curved line. Hmm...the Help files say to select the object, click on a corner point with the pen tool and drag out handles. That works, but then I get new points added to the shape starting from my last point. That's frustrating. Because the tool is overloaded with functions, the program doesn't have any way of knowing what it is I want it to do, I guess. And, I don't get the result I want, either. It's a shame that Fireworks does not have a specific tool for node conversion. Illustrator has one. I think Expression's drawing tools are closer to Illustrator's then Fireworks's are.


                      I think i'll stick with Expression and export .ai files!
                      • 8. Re: Changing the colours in a logo
                        JoeDaSilva Level 4
                        Yeah, admittedly I only use the Firework pen tool for quick and easy drawing work and masks. I save all of the heavy lifting for Illustrator.

                        I'm pretty sure though in fireworks that if you click and release a node it becomes a corner node, and if you click and drag it gives you handles. It's very odd though that you can't change the node type - quite a quandary!

                        I wonder if the Fireworks pen is closer to how Macromedia Freehand acted, or if it's a unique little snowflake...

                        Thanks for the insight Pixlor!
                        • 9. Re: Changing the colours in a logo
                          Level 7
                          pixlor wrote:
                          > Expression 3 evolved into Microsoft Expression Design 4 and it's a decent
                          > vector editing program. Not as powerful as Illustrator, but it had natural
                          > media strokes and transparency in the 90s when Expression 1 was released as the
                          > vector-based companion to Painter by Fractal Design.
                          >
                          > Expression has two pens. I used the standard pen, because it's easier for
                          > tracing shapes. (I don't think the Fireworks pen is a Bezier pen, eitehr, as
                          > the nodes are on the shape itself.) Each shape in the file I made is 21
                          > points:seven node points and 14 handle points. The relationship of the handles
                          > can be set one of four ways. Individual nodes can be selected and modified or
                          > multiple nodes can be selected and modified. It's really quite straightforward
                          > to use.
                          >
                          > I've played with Illustrator some, but I know Expression better. I've also
                          > played with Inkscape and Freehand a very tiny bit. When I tried the pen in
                          > Fireworks earlier today, it didn't act as I expected. I went to move a node
                          > slightly and suddenly I had extra points where I didn't want them and a big arc
                          > that messed up the line I'd started. No other program I've used has ever
                          > done that. So I gave up!
                          >
                          > But, to be more fair, I gave it another try. I don't see a tool that allows me
                          > to change a corner node into a node with handles, so that I can create a curved
                          > line. Hmm...the Help files say to select the object, click on a corner point
                          > with the pen tool and drag out handles. That works, but then I get new points
                          > added to the shape starting from my last point. That's frustrating. Because the
                          > tool is overloaded with functions, the program doesn't have any way of knowing
                          > what it is I want it to do, I guess. And, I don't get the result I want,
                          > either. It's a shame that Fireworks does not have a specific tool for node
                          > conversion. Illustrator has one. I think Expression's drawing tools are closer
                          > to Illustrator's then Fireworks's are.
                          >
                          >
                          > I think i'll stick with Expression and export .ai files!
                          >
                          Use the Subselection tool for altering control points in an FW vector.
                          To extend the control arms for a control point, click k the point with
                          the Pen tool and drag away from the point. You should not get additional
                          points on the path by doing this.

                          In FW CS4, the Path panel gives you a lot of control over vector points
                          and paths. It's worth checking out.

                          --
                          Jim Babbage - .:Community MX:. & .:Adobe Community Expert:.
                          http://www.communityMX.com/
                          CommunityMX - Free Resources:
                          http://www.communitymx.com/free.cfm
                          ---
                          .:Adobe Community Expert for Fireworks:.
                          Adobe Community Expert
                          http://tinyurl.com/2a7dyp
                          ---
                          See my work on Flickr
                          http://www.flickr.com/photos/jim_babbage/
                          • 10. Re: Changing the colours in a logo
                            johngordon12 Level 1
                            Many thanks for the replies - that video on YouTube was great. Its actually not as complicated looking as I remembered.

                            And especially to Lorraine for tracing it - very much appreciated!
                            • 11. Changing the colours in a logo
                              pixlor Level 4
                              quote:

                              Originally posted by: Newsgroup User
                              pixlor wrote:
                              >... When I tried the pen in
                              > Fireworks earlier today, it didn't act as I expected. I went to move a node
                              > slightly and suddenly I had extra points where I didn't want them and a big arc
                              > that messed up the line I'd started. No other program I've used has ever
                              > done that. So I gave up!
                              >
                              > But, to be more fair, I gave it another try. I don't see a tool that allows me
                              > to change a corner node into a node with handles, so that I can create a curved
                              > line. Hmm...the Help files say to select the object, click on a corner point
                              > with the pen tool and drag out handles. That works, but then I get new points
                              > added to the shape starting from my last point. That's frustrating. Because the
                              > tool is overloaded with functions, the program doesn't have any way of knowing
                              > what it is I want it to do, I guess. ...
                              >
                              Use the Subselection tool for altering control points in an FW vector.
                              To extend the control arms for a control point, click k the point with
                              the Pen tool and drag away from the point. You should not get additional
                              points on the path by doing this.

                              In FW CS4, the Path panel gives you a lot of control over vector points
                              and paths. It's worth checking out.

                              --
                              Jim Babbage - .:Community MX:. & .:Adobe Community Expert:.



                              On my first attempt with the Fireworks pen tool, I am not sure if I was using the sub-selection tool or not when that bizarre arc showed up. The second time, I was able to use that tool and move nodes around. No problem. However, I definitely did get additional points after I dragged out handles from the node I selected. The Fireworks pen tools are not very intuitive.

                              Yes, I'm planning to upgrade from my CS3 suite. But I expect I will stick with Expression for vector drawing. Here are some features I use that Fireworks doesn't have (Illustrator probably does, but I'm happy with Expression):
                              - On a curve point I can set the relationship between the handle positions to one of four ways:
                              - - Symmetrical - handles are on a line and their lengths match
                              - - Smooth - handles on on a line, although their lengths may be individually adjusted
                              - - Angle Locked - the angle between the handles remains fixed when one is moved, lengths may be individually adjusted
                              - - Unconstrained - handles may be individually adjusted
                              - I have a command to smooth a path and the amount of smoothing can be adjusted.
                              - I can change a natural media stroke into a shape.

                              I make use of these features. Fireworks' tool set is too basic for me, even if I knew how to make it work right. But I don't find the toolset to be intuitive.