32 Replies Latest reply on Jul 28, 2018 3:40 AM by dj_paige

    Physical copy to another folder

    orfeas76

      Can't believe that still "Copy" instead of "move" files doesn't exist.

      No, Virtual Copies are not the answer, the are glued to each other and I can't separate them.

      I open the File Explorer, Copy the files, and then Sync settings One by One just to give my client a folder with selections.

       

      Please make our life easier

        • 1. Re: Physical copy to another folder
          dj_paige Level 10

          You could export the photos to another location.

           

          I think you misunderstand the value of virtual copies. They are the exact answer to your problems, you can put them in a separate collection (not folder) and then you have separated a copy for your clients.

           

          There are many many ways in Lightroom to indicate that a group of photos is designated for a specific client.

          • 2. Re: Physical copy to another folder
            JohanEl54 Adobe Community Professional

            orfeas76  wrote

             

            Can't believe that still "Copy" instead of "move" files doesn't exist.

            No, Virtual Copies are not the answer, the are glued to each other and I can't separate them.

            I open the File Explorer, Copy the files, and then Sync settings One by One just to give my client a folder with selections.

             

            Please make our life easier

            If you want to give your client a selection of images, then I assume you want him to have edited images, not unedited raw files. That means that making a physical copy is not the way to do this. You have to export the images you want to give to your client. And if you want to make this folder with copies for yourself, then you can use virtual copies. The only thing you need to do to 'separate' these virtual copies is to use 'virtual folders' aka collections rather than folders to organise this.

            • 3. Re: Physical copy to another folder
              orfeas76 Level 1

              Export as DNG opposes to the Non-Destructive editing of LR. The RAW is there, it doesn't need to be recreated as another format.

              Also Collections are a lot confusing. Outside LR they don't exist.

              Here is my problem:

              I have thousands of folders (each one with a separate LRCatalog in it). That's my Archive.

              I also have the Master Catalog where I work, I import and export images.

              Well, I'd like to import and hold my favorite images from Archive Folders into Master Catalog and play with them

              without having to touch the original folder. I consider it dangerous.

              • 4. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                orfeas76 Level 1

                and please stop saying Why would you need this....

                File Explorer could live with Copy and then delete Source, but it features Move,

                Yeah....

                • 5. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                  JohanEl54 Adobe Community Professional

                  I believe the problem is that you use Lightroom in a way it was not designed for. The idea behind Lightroom is that you use a single catalog (or perhaps a few), but certainly not thousands of folders with a catalog in each of them. Lightroom does not touch the original images, so there is no danger in using a single catalog with a single image archive, but obviously you need to make backups of both the catalog (can be done by Lightroom on quit) and your images (that you need to do yourself).

                   

                  Of course you are free to use Lightroom any way you want to and in ways it was not designed for, but it does mean you will sometimes find that you would like to have an option that is not available. Making physical copies is an example. The whole idea of Lightroom is that you don't make physical copies, but use things like virtual copies, collections and smart collections to manage your images. Again: you don't have to do this if you don't want to, but that explains why creating physical copies is not a feature in Lightroom and probably never will be.

                  • 6. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                    dj_paige Level 10

                    I think the chances that Adobe implements a Copy command inside the Lightroom Library Module are nil. It is up to you to come up with a workaround (or not), there are many ways to accomplish what you want, given the tools in Lightroom, as we (myself and Johan) have explained.

                    • 7. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                      orfeas76 Level 1

                      I found a workaround,

                      Move favorite files to a subfolder, Export this folder as a Catalog, contain Original Negatives

                      I bet they were thinking "Copy Originals with their Settings"

                      • 8. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                        elie_di Level 4

                        orfeas76  wrote

                        .... to give my client a folder with selections....

                         

                        I found a workaround,

                        Move favorite files to a subfolder, Export this folder as a Catalog, contain Original Negatives

                        I bet they were thinking "Copy Originals with their Settings"

                        So all your clients use Lightroom in an edition concurrent to, or later than, yours? And you want to empower them to edit your edits?

                        Not many people in your shoes.

                        • 9. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                          orfeas76 Level 1

                          Client is singular.

                          • 10. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                            elie_di Level 4

                            Export as DNG opposes to the Non-Destructive editing of LR. The RAW is there, it doesn't need to be recreated as another format.

                            The advantage of DNG is that it can have an internal XMP, thus avoiding the chance of the original Raw being separated from a sidecar XMP and it can be opened in either LR or PS/ACR without the catalog but with all the edits. Much  better for sending Raw + image editing to a second editor.

                            • 11. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                              richardplondon Level 4

                              The advantage of DNG is that it can have an internal XMP, thus avoiding the chance of the original Raw being separated from a sidecar XMP and it can be opened in either LR or PS/ACR without the catalog but with all the edits.

                              Those observations expose the disadvantage of DNG, too (smile).

                               

                              To the OP: Adobe offers two separate solutions for managing a library of photos, addressing two distinct philosophies.

                               

                              Bridge + PS is the "file-centric" method (assisted by ACR). By "file-centric" I mean, whereby it might make intuitive sense to you to group some images for a given purpose, by making physical duplicates of the files into a special physical folder. That is a very common way of thinking, but not the sole possible way of thinking.

                               

                              Lightroom (+ PS optionally) is the non-file-centric alternative. It is explicitly designed to satisfy those of the other persuasion, who (perhaps) see only unnecessary downsides in such duplication.

                               

                              To require LR to include the complete gamut of file-centric methods, would be IMO as unrealistic as expecting a vegetarian restaurant to include a full meat and fish menu.

                               

                              A vegetarian restaurant's clientele self-selects: these people are never disappointed that they cannot order a steak, and don't think it would be a better vegetarian restaurant if they could. Rather, they go there because the non-meat dishes will be far more expert and various - less of an afterthought - than they ever would be in (say) a steak restaurant.

                               

                              And many of Lightroom's best synergies and efficiencies arise precisely from its usage of a non-file-centric, virtual library.

                              • 12. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                                Just Shoot Me Adobe Community Professional

                                The reason for no copy command is simple. That would create duplicate files of the same image which is one thing you really don't want to do and something LR doesn't want you to do.

                                 

                                No image files are IN LR. LR is a Database program that only references your images into the LR catalog file, a Database file.

                                 

                                Also the edits you do in LR are stored in the LR Catalog file and are only Laid Over the image for Display. The actual image file is never changed. To Burn, Apply, the changes, edits, you do in LR to a files so you can send that image file to someone, or post it on the web, social media, whatever, you have to Export the image using some other file format than RAW/DNG.

                                 

                                You say you want to send your client the files. Is this client then going to do edits on them? If not then the RAW files, or DNG files, are useless to them.

                                 

                                Whenever you Export using the As Original option you are making copies of the original files that will not include the LR edits you have made to them

                                 

                                Exporting as DNG will included the edits but the only programs that can read those files and display the edits are ones that work with RAW and DNG files. So you can't just open them in some type of Photo Viewer program unless your client has a DNG codex installed.

                                 

                                Just figured I point some of this out. If you are like me you won't listen and go on with whatever you think is the right thing.

                                • 13. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                                  JimHess Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                  This user apparently has a workflow that works for them. Lightroom isn't going to change to provide an 'improved' workflow that fits this user. So this user will have to live with their wish list because he and his client don't really understand the benefits of using Lightroom. Unfortunate, but true.

                                  • 14. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                                    orfeas76 Level 1

                                    richardplondon the way I see this is:

                                    Adobe wants us to abandon Bridge and use LR instead as the core of our Photography Library.

                                    I think Bridge is phasing out.

                                    Also many things inside LR remind a Filesystem: Move files, Make Subfolders, Rename files etc.

                                    If it was other way around Renaming Files is also bit of old-fashioned. It should make Virtual Names with links to Originals, right?

                                    From day1 everybody was astounded by the innovation of this software, leaving raws intact and writing all settings in text.

                                    But nowadays, the catalogs are huge, millions of photos, ofcourse we have to use dividing and archiving.

                                    A simple "Ctrl+move file=Copy" would be enough.

                                    I assume they want to welcome more people into the magic of Virtual files, collections and tags.

                                     

                                    But mistakes are easier when working with links to files and not files.

                                    My (digital) life is very complicated. I want to make it straight-forward

                                    • 15. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                                      orfeas76 Level 1

                                      Do you guys use collections instead of folders?

                                      Do you have a huge Catalog for all your files?

                                      How do you differentiate your best images of every shoot? Where do you keep them and where the rest? Do you cut them?

                                      • 16. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                                        JimHess Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                        Others will have better answers because I'm not a prolific photographer. I have three catalogs. I have my main catalog which has photos from the last decade or so. I have chosen to have another catalog that I use just for experimenting. And I have yet a third catalog where I do all of my scanning.

                                         

                                        I'm trying to scan a lifetime of family photos and organize them into some useful scheme. I'm using collections to separate them by the family member's name. It has been a slow process because scanning is a very slow process. But it seems to be working well.

                                         

                                        My main catalog has a record of much of our family activities over the last decade. I have been somewhat diligent in adding keywords to some of the places we have visited so that I can quickly locate destinations when I need a photo. Keywords work very nicely. Remember, the catalog IS a database. Use it for its strengths.

                                         

                                        As far as differentiating my best images, I like to use star ratings. I leave all the images right in the same folder. I only "cut" images that are total rejects, and they are deleted from the catalog and from the computer. Then I can use the filter system in Lightroom to filter on any rating level that I need to.

                                         

                                        Having everything in one catalog really simplifies your work. Yes, I have three catalogs. But the work is different for each one, and I know what I'm looking for in each catalog. Most of the time I'm in my main catalog.

                                         

                                        I only keep my master images. I don't make copies and store them in the catalog. I don't think there's any need for that. If I'm maintaining copies and I later decide that I need to make a change to the master image, then I have to make another copy as well. By only maintaining the master images, I can export copies when they are needed at any time and use them for their purpose. When that purpose has been completed those copies are deleted because they aren't needed anymore.

                                        • 17. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                                          Just Shoot Me Adobe Community Professional

                                          orfeas76  wrote

                                           

                                          Do you guys use collections instead of folders?

                                          Do you have a huge Catalog for all your files?

                                          How do you differentiate your best images of every shoot? Where do you keep them and where the rest? Do you cut them?

                                          I use both folders and Collection and Keywords.

                                           

                                          Yes I have only one catalog. And that is the same catalog I have used since I started using LR back in 2007, although it has been upgraded many times and has been on several different computers.

                                          My catalog is only 20,000+ images but I have taken well over that many images over the years. I throw out the junk when first culling. Then go back at the end of the year and throw out more or find a Gem that I overlooks originally. So I would say I have imported well over 40-50 thousand images into the LR catalog over the last 11 years.

                                           

                                          To differentiate your best shots in many different ways.

                                          You can assign Star ratings, Use color labels, Place them into a collection called My Best Images or for a particular shot/event use the name of that shoot or event and then Best Images. Put a Keyword on them called Best Images and as stated before.

                                           

                                          Any image in the LR catalog can be in a folder on your drive, in multiple collections, have multiple keywords assigned to it or just one, have a star rating and color label all at the same time.

                                           

                                          When I import images they get placed in a folder by the year they were shot, Present year, and into subfolders by the day, in Date Format MMDD, they were shot, \2018\MMDD.

                                           

                                          Then In LR if I want to Group some of those images, from any year and any month and day, I use a collection. Say like Portraits, Landscapes or whatever. Even using a client name and or event, location name. I also assign Keywords to them If I want (Some times I do and some times I don't).

                                          With Collections the same image can be in many different collections. Collections are just Lists of images like you would write on a piece of paper.

                                          So If I shot at location X and some of those images were of the landscape of location X I could place those in my Landscape collection and in a collection called Event/Location X.

                                          If some were of people they could go into the People collection and into the X collection and into any other collection that I might want to have a reference of them in.

                                           

                                          If I'm going to send any images to someone in an email I export a JPG file and place it in a subfolder named JPG under the year\month\day folder.

                                          If I was going to deliver edited files to a client I would export the edited images as TIF files and send them to that client.

                                          If the client wanted images of the whole shoot so they could pick and choose which images they wanted I would export as small JPGs and send them to the client for review and for him to make a list of the File names for me to do more work on.

                                           

                                          I recently took a vacation to Key West. I placed all the images from that trip in a subfolder under the year folder Called Florida Trip (I drove). Then all the images were placed in other subfolders under the Florida Trip folder in the Date format MMDD for the days they were taken.

                                          I then assigned keywords to them for where they were shot. Some were in shot Georgia and other places around Florida other than Key West. So under mu Places top level keyword I created a keyword called Georgia and one called Florida. Under the Georgia keyword I created another keyword called Little White House. Under the Florida keyword I create 4 different keywords for the places I had taken pictures at. Then I went through my mages and assign all those keyword to the images they applied to.

                                           

                                          For images I uploaded through the LR Web and mobile system I exported JPGs and placed those in subfolders under the days date folder they were shot.

                                          Then made a collection that I then Synced with the LR Web/Mobile system and called it Florida Trip. Also I have a top Level collection called LRM Sync Set which is where I create other Sub Collections that are going to be synced to the LR Web/Mobile system and that is where I made the collection called Florida Trip. I then placed all the exported JPG images from each day that I want to upload and share with friends and family in that Florida Trip collection.

                                           

                                          There are many ways to organize your images without having to copy the same image from one folder to another.

                                          In fact I only have one copy of every image file format on my computer (other than backups of all of them on external drives).

                                          • 18. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                                            richardplondon Level 4

                                            I have no information about Adobe abandoning Bridge, but it is clear that the photo management industry as a whole is moving into a range of models and approaches, some of which depart from the familiar files-and-folders method.

                                             

                                            And which therefore are not constrained by the many inherent (if ignored through famiarity) limitations of that.

                                             

                                            It is true that LR allows you to move and rename files and folders, but this is a secondary matter organisationally. It makes no basic difference to the virtual management of these images WHAT folder they happen to be in, nor WHAT they happen to be called. Just so long as LR's location records correspond to the external reality, the virtual management persists regardless.

                                             

                                            Something like: the government has the means of updating its own records, once duly informed, if you change address or name. Governments have even in some circumstances made people physically move to a different address or have dictated what names they could or could not have. But no government has the capacity to dictate that there should be created a brand new, different and separate copy of YOU. That option does not logically feature in the relationship between citizen and government.

                                             

                                            And if a government did clone people as a tactic for classifying them, or even if it just assigned people a fresh citizenship number for the purposes of each fresh exercise, then this would have merely magnified its own organisational problem.

                                            1 person found this helpful
                                            • 19. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                                              Just Shoot Me Adobe Community Professional

                                              Hey Jim have you ever tried taking pictures of your old family photo?

                                              I scan negatives but for actual printed photos I just take a shot of it with my main camera. Then I crop and straighten, if needed.

                                               

                                              Much faster than scanning and IMHO I get a better image and it is in RAW format.

                                               

                                              Also to the OP.

                                              I do have more than one catalog. But that is just for testing and loading images into for people I'm trying to help on these forums or for friends and family.

                                              Right now there are about 10 photos in that Test Catalog.

                                              • 20. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                                                Just Shoot Me Adobe Community Professional

                                                Adobe isn't abandoning Bridge. It is still used by many for both Photoshop and other Adobe software programs.

                                                 

                                                Bridge is a FILE MANAGER that does show you every folder and file on your hard drives.

                                                LR is a Cataloging program, a Database program, that only shows you folders and images that you have imported into the LR Database file, the Catalog file.

                                                • 21. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                                                  JohanEl54 Adobe Community Professional

                                                  orfeas76  wrote

                                                   

                                                  Do you guys use collections instead of folders?

                                                  Do you have a huge Catalog for all your files?

                                                  How do you differentiate your best images of every shoot? Where do you keep them and where the rest? Do you cut them?

                                                  Technically, you can't use collections instead of folders. You always have to store the images in real folders. But yes, I keep my folder panel closed 99% of the time, because I do all my organising with collections and smart collections.

                                                   

                                                  Yes, I have a single catalog with about 160,000 images.

                                                   

                                                  I differentiate my best images by using Lightroom's rating options: five stars for the best images, four stars for good but not the very best, etc. By using smart collections or filters I can quickly get a selection of only my best images, or only my four star images, etc. That means I don't have to 'store' my best images in another place. All my images can remain where they are.

                                                  • 22. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                                                    orfeas76 Level 1

                                                    LR gives you 2 licences for 2 different computers.

                                                    How do you continue your work from one PC to another? Don't you make copies?

                                                    • 23. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                                                      Just Shoot Me Adobe Community Professional

                                                      orfeas76  wrote

                                                       

                                                      LR gives you 2 licences for 2 different computers.

                                                      How do you continue your work from one PC to another? Don't you make copies?

                                                      To do that you would need to place both the catalog file and all the image files on an external drive and move that external from computer to computer.

                                                       

                                                      There are other that have used DropBox or other cloud system.

                                                       

                                                      I personally only do real editing on my desktop system that has a large monitor. My notebook is used for storing images, viewing and some minor editing when I'm on the road.

                                                      • 24. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                                                        JimHess Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                        https://forums.adobe.com/people/Just+Shoot+Me  wrote

                                                         

                                                        Hey Jim have you ever tried taking pictures of your old family photo?

                                                        I scan negatives but for actual printed photos I just take a shot of it with my main camera. Then I crop and straighten, if needed.

                                                         

                                                        Much faster than scanning and IMHO I get a better image and it is in RAW format.

                                                         

                                                         

                                                        No, never done that. A lot of my family photos are 35mm slides. I have read about techniques for setting up ways to do it, but just never wanted to bother with it. I'm reasonably happy with my scanner. I create a 16-bit TIF images, and they work quite well for me.

                                                        • 25. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                                                          JohanEl54 Adobe Community Professional

                                                          orfeas76  wrote

                                                           

                                                          LR gives you 2 licences for 2 different computers.

                                                          How do you continue your work from one PC to another? Don't you make copies?

                                                          I use a laptop while I'm on the road, and my way of working is to use a temporary 'travel catalog' on that laptop. When I return home, I use 'Import from Another Catalog' to merge the travel catalog with my main catalog. After I've done that, I can delete the travel catalog and use a new one on my next trip.

                                                          • 26. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                                                            Just Shoot Me Adobe Community Professional

                                                            JimHess  wrote

                                                             

                                                            https://forums.adobe.com/people/Just+Shoot+Me   wrote

                                                             

                                                            Hey Jim have you ever tried taking pictures of your old family photo?

                                                            I scan negatives but for actual printed photos I just take a shot of it with my main camera. Then I crop and straighten, if needed.

                                                             

                                                            Much faster than scanning and IMHO I get a better image and it is in RAW format.

                                                             

                                                             

                                                            No, never done that. A lot of my family photos are 35mm slides. I have read about techniques for setting up ways to do it, but just never wanted to bother with it. I'm reasonably happy with my scanner. I create a 16-bit TIF images, and they work quite well for me.

                                                            Yeah I use a scanner for slides and negatives. But for actual printed photos I find the camera does the best job. And I have a good scanner. Epson 700 something.

                                                            • 27. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                                                              JimHess Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                              What lens do you use for your copying? Also, what do you use for lighting? I used an Epson 700 at the University. I have a Canon Canoscan 9000 at home. I think the quality is about as good. It's just not as high capacity as the Epson. But it's a lot cheaper. And I've always been on a budget.

                                                              • 28. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                                                                Just Shoot Me Adobe Community Professional

                                                                I use the 50mm f/2 fuji lens on my X-T2. Before I had the T2 I used my E2 and the 35mm f/1.4 or the 18-55 zoom Fuji lens. When I had the Leica M8 I used the 50mm Summilux ASPH.

                                                                 

                                                                Lighting was supply by clip on work lights.

                                                                Then the RAW files PP in LR.

                                                                • 29. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                                                                  JimHess Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                                  Something to think about, I guess. I have a couple of work lights. Have a pretty good 18-55 mm, no 50 mm.

                                                                  • 30. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                                                                    Tartarowitch Level 1

                                                                    I have the same problem and can not believe that LR does not have such a simple function as copying.

                                                                    I have PS files on different hard drives. In LR, I can summarize this wonderful and show. I want to merge a selection and compilation in LR from different hard drives to a USB stick. The export function is eliminated because it reduces the PSD files when exporting to the background level. But I do not want to move the files, but leave them where they are. Is there actually such a simple function as copying not in LR?

                                                                    • 31. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                                                                      Just Shoot Me Adobe Community Professional

                                                                      Tartarowitch  wrote

                                                                       

                                                                      I have the same problem and can not believe that LR does not have such a simple function as copying.

                                                                      I have PS files on different hard drives. In LR, I can summarize this wonderful and show. I want to merge a selection and compilation in LR from different hard drives to a USB stick. The export function is eliminated because it reduces the PSD files when exporting to the background level. But I do not want to move the files, but leave them where they are. Is there actually such a simple function as copying not in LR?

                                                                      As stated many times in this thread, and other threads, LR is NOT a File Manager. LR is a Database program. If you had a Database for the work you do with client names, addresses, phone numbers and whatever would you want that Database program you use for viewing, editing and adding entries into the database to be able to COPY a complete record so you end up with 2 copies of the exact same data? I don't think so.

                                                                      • 32. Re: Physical copy to another folder
                                                                        dj_paige Level 10

                                                                        Tartarowitch  wrote

                                                                         

                                                                        I have the same problem and can not believe that LR does not have such a simple function as copying.

                                                                        I have PS files on different hard drives. In LR, I can summarize this wonderful and show. I want to merge a selection and compilation in LR from different hard drives to a USB stick. The export function is eliminated because it reduces the PSD files when exporting to the background level. But I do not want to move the files, but leave them where they are. Is there actually such a simple function as copying not in LR?

                                                                        You could Export and set the Image Format to original, which doesn't change the file at all.