32 Replies Latest reply on Apr 17, 2018 5:06 AM by mickspawn

    Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors

    mickspawn Level 1

      Hi guys,

       

      As you know the MORONS at Adobe screwed up 7.3 and i can't upgrade yet as i have a lot of presets that will get messed up.

       

      I accidentally upgraded photoshop to 19.1.3

       

      Now photoshop looks different to the color im seeing in Lightroom 7.2

       

      Is this normal behaviour because i upgraded camera raw and photoshop but not lightroom?

       

      Cheers.

        • 1. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
          Per Berntsen Adobe Community Professional

          When Lightroom and Photoshop don't display identically, it's usually cased by a defective monitor profile.

          Try setting the monitor profile to sRGB (Adobe RGB if you have a wide gamut monitor).

          See http://www.lightroomqueen.com/articles-page/how-do-i-change-my-monitor-profile-to-check-wh ether-its-corrupted/

          If this fixes the problem, you should ideally calibrate your monitor with a hardware calibrator, which will also create a new monitor profile that accurately describes your monitor.

           

          There could also be a color mismatch if you have changed the color settings in Photoshop. (like setting the RGB working space to Monitor RGB, which disables color management) Unless you know what you're doing, leave these settings alone.

          Also make sure that Proof colors is unchecked in the View menu in Photoshop.

          • 2. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
            mickspawn Level 1

            Hello Per and thank you for trying to help me

             

            No settings have changed apart from upgrading Photoshop to 19.1.3

             

            I recalibrated with the i1 display pro and no change to the color mismatch.

            I am using an Imac 5k late 2017.

             

            I have Lightroom and Photoshop set to use ProPhoto RGB colorspace

             

            not using proof colors.

             

            its almost like the picture is more contrasty and more saturated than lightroom when editing in photoshop

            • 3. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
              mickspawn Level 1

              you can see the colour difference here, different shade of red.  leaves on the right above the guy are more green saturated.  skin tone is different.

              on the left lightroom on the right photoshop

              adobe.jpg

              • 4. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                Simon G E Garrett Level 3

                I agree with the others that it's most probably a profile problem.  Other things I'd check:

                 

                1. Upgrade to LR 7.3 (you say you're using 7.2, which has a different in-built ACR version).

                 

                2. Check LR Preferences -> Edit settings are set to:

                CaptureLR.JPG

                You can't alter LR's internal working space (it's always ProPhoto RGB with linear gamma) but you can alter the colour space and bit-depth passed to PS - best is ProPhoto 16-bit.

                 

                3. Check PS Edit -> Color settings are set to:

                CapturePS.JPG

                Not only make sure Working Space is ProPhoto RGB but make sure policies are "Preserve..." and (I suggest) check all the "Ask When..." boxes, so you get warned of problems.

                 

                PS - I don't know if the developers at Adobe are morons, but I've had no problem with presets.

                • 5. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                  Per Berntsen Adobe Community Professional

                  Yes, I see the difference, there is a slight yellow cast in Photoshop.

                  I don't use a Mac, but I believe that the new iMacs are wide gamut. Unlike other wide gamut displays, their color gamut does not correspond to Adobe RGB, but to a color space called image-P3. So try setting the monitor profile to image-P3, and if that fixes the issue, there is something wrong with your current monitor profile.

                   

                  https://forums.adobe.com/people/Simon%20G%20E%20Garrett wrote

                   

                  Upgrade to LR 7.3 (you say you're using 7.2, which has a different in-built ACR version).

                  That shouldn't make any difference - the image should display identically regardless of the ACR version.

                   

                  PS - I don't know if the developers at Adobe are morons, but I've had no problem with presets.

                  I had no problems with presets either, but had to roll back to 7.2 because 7.3 was so slow that it was unusable.

                  • 6. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                    mickspawn Level 1

                    Hey guys, i based my "morons" assumption off of the fact over the past 3 years they have cost me COUNTLESS hours after pathetic updates that are bugged and/or worse than the predecessor.

                     

                    Ok all my settings are set exactly like yours Simon.

                     

                    Second, i tried many other profiles even sRGB, Apple RGB you name it. All profiles differ in PS.  I reinstalled PS no change.

                     

                    Only thing left is lightroom perhaps? ugh.

                     

                    You guys didnt have preset problems because you probably dont own a vast amount and without special characters.  There is actually a large issue with presets.  And of course the DOG SLOWNESS that i've complained about for years that they can never fix.

                    • 7. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                      Per Berntsen Adobe Community Professional

                      Second, i tried many other profiles even sRGB, Apple RGB you name it. All profiles differ in PS.

                      Just to make sure there is no misunderstanding - you did try changing the monitor profile and not the document profile?

                      Also, Photoshop (and Lightroom) will need to be re-launched after changing the monitor profile.

                      • 8. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                        mickspawn Level 1

                        yes sir the monitor icc profile.

                        i also relaunched them each time.  still the yellow hue in photoshop.

                        ill try contact adobe via chat tomorrow.

                        • 9. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                          Per Berntsen Adobe Community Professional

                          I'll try to get someone else to look at this. Hang on.

                          • 10. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                            D Fosse Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                            I agree that this has all the signs of a problem in the conversion to monitor profile. Either a defective profile, or possibly a buggy GPU driver. At default Photoshop settings, the actual conversion is performed by OpenGL code in the GPU. One way to test is to set the GPU to "Basic" mode - this shifts display color management back to the CPU, which is more robust and reliable.

                             

                            There is a known problem with ProPhoto files in Photoshop, with standard GPU color management. It can show up in various ways depending on the type of monitor profile, but shadow clipping and/or banding, in individual channels, is common. The problem here appears to be shadow channel clipping in Photoshop - although it's hard to say because this file is hard clipped in the shadows either way.

                             

                            Try an Adobe RGB or sRGB file, and also set GPU to "Basic". That should eliminate this particular problem (which is apparently caused by inaccuracies in OpenGL code, exaggerated by the compressed shadows in ProPhoto. It's outside Adobe's control).

                             

                            Just to be clear - color settings in Lr and Photoshop don't need to match. That's not a requirement. And it certainly doesn't have to be ProPhoto just because Lr's internal color space uses ProPhoto primaries. Any color managed application is supposed to display the file correctly whatever the profile is - that's the whole point.

                             

                            Finally, as Per suggests, the way to test the monitor profile is to replace it with a known good one. The stock system profile should be good enough. But the profile embedded in the original screenshot is just "Display", not "Display P3". So either this isn't a wide gamut iMac model, or it's the wrong profile.

                            • 11. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                              D Fosse Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                              On re-reading the thread, I see "late 2017 5K iMac". That's certainly a wide gamut model with a DCI-P3 panel.

                               

                              So if you're using the system default display profile, it should be called "Display P3". But the one in the screenshot is just "Display" (Mac OS embeds the display profile in screenshots).

                               

                              Anyway - one more thing I forgot to mention: if using the i1 Display Pro, make sure it's set to produce version 2, matrix-based profiles. Not version 4 and/or table-based (LUT). The latter policies are also known to be problematic in some situations (or so I'm told - never seen any problems myself).

                               

                              If the display profile is an accurate description of the display's actual, current response, and the application converts correctly from the document profile - then the file has to display correctly. Yes, I know that sounds very generic and general, but it can help to focus on each of the three individual links in the color management chain: document profile > conversion > display profile. But usually it's the last one.

                              • 12. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                                mickspawn Level 1

                                when setting photoshop GPU to basic the exact same color difference happens.

                                 

                                one thing i noticed in my color settings in Display there are actually 2 iMac profiles for some reason but both are identical..

                                 

                                with i1 i always use version 2

                                 

                                I notice if i use the i1 display the screen runs way too warm so i always just stick with the standard apple profile and only adjust my screen brightness.

                                • 13. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                                  mickspawn Level 1

                                  i just created a new standard one and ill try it..

                                   

                                  Screen Shot 2018-04-16 at 1.01.36 pm.png

                                  • 14. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                                    mickspawn Level 1

                                    ok so im using Lightroom 7.2

                                    I upgraded camera raw from 9.12.1 to 10.3

                                    I upgraded Photoshop from 19.1.2 to 19.1.3

                                     

                                    I downgraded Photoshop from 19.1.3 back to 19.1.2 no change.

                                     

                                    I downgraded camera raw from 10.3 back to 9.12.1

                                     

                                    Guess what.  Problem solved.  Camera RAW 10.3 has problems with Lightroom 7.2.


                                    Moral of the story.  If you aren't upgrading Lightroom to 7.3 don't upgrade Camera RAW.

                                     

                                     

                                    Thanks.

                                    • 15. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                                      D Fosse Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                      OK, so the only possible explanation is presets/camera profiles. It wasn't the monitor profile after all.

                                       

                                      With the Lightroom 7.3 update, corresponding to ACR 10.3, I got a notification that presets had been "successfully converted to xmp". I confess I don't know what that means exactly, but I certainly didn't have any problems after the update. We also got an entirely new Camera Profiles interface, with some new profiles. But still nothing that would cause any issues.

                                       

                                      So this is where I'm a bit lost in your problems. Why would it "mess up" your presets? In fact it seems to me that they were messed up by not updating Lightroom!

                                       

                                      We all know how important it is to keep Lightroom and ACR in sync. I never update one without the other.

                                      • 16. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                                        mickspawn Level 1

                                        Presets a total mess in Lightroom 7.3

                                         

                                        check out this thread to understand it only affects people with a large preset collection with symbols.

                                         

                                        If i updated camera raw, lightroom and ps together i would never have had the problem but i would get a problem with presets going in the wrong order / messing up

                                         

                                        and yes after spending the best part of 6 hours messing around, i learned my lesson to never update camera raw without updating PS and LR lol

                                        • 17. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                                          Per Berntsen Adobe Community Professional

                                          I am also running LR 7.2 and PS 19.1.3, and it turns out that I am seeing the same thing - a slight yellow cast in Photoshop.

                                          This is on Windows 7, with an Eizo CX 240.

                                          The image has not been edited in Lightroom, and the only develop preset that has been used is a sharpening preset on import, and the camera profile is Adobe Standard.

                                          If you fixed the problem by downgrading ACR, there must be a bug in ACR 10.3.0.933.

                                           

                                          LR-PS-difference.png

                                          • 18. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                                            mickspawn Level 1

                                            yep and how do we notify the team about this bug?

                                             

                                            yes i fixed the problem by downgrading ACR to 9.12.1

                                            • 19. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                                              D Fosse Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                              In any case, it must be this specific combination. I can't see anything similar here, with all updated to current and synchronized versions  (Lr 7.3 / ACR 10.3 / PS 19.1.3). Win 7 and Eizo CG246.

                                               

                                              I'll look closer when I have time (but I'm not downgrading just to test)..

                                              • 20. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                                                Per Berntsen Adobe Community Professional

                                                This is getting stranger ...

                                                It turns out that when I open a raw file directly in Photoshop, it displays the same as in Lightroom, but not when using Edit in from Lightroom.

                                                I'm going to post a bug report over at Camera Raw and DNG | Photoshop Family Customer Community

                                                 

                                                PS-direct-edit-in.png

                                                • 21. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                                                  mickspawn Level 1

                                                  @d fosse It is only the specific combination i have listed.

                                                   

                                                  @Per Berntsen yes same here, its only when editing a photo with lightroom adjustments.

                                                   

                                                  I reported it to Adobe via the chat and they have had a few reports similar to mine

                                                  • 22. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                                                    Per Berntsen Adobe Community Professional

                                                    I reinstalled LR 7.3, and Edit in Photoshop works perfectly.

                                                    So I think we can safely assume that this was caused by a bug in 7.2, and/or that the combination of LR 7.2 and ACR 10.3 triggered the bug. So I'm not going to file a bug report on this, bugs in 7.2 will obviously not be fixed.

                                                    • 23. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                                                      D Fosse Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                      Yes, that was the point I was trying to make a few posts up: stay synchronized, and you won't see this.

                                                       

                                                      I'm not even sure it qualifies as a bug - obviously Lightroom 7.2 wasn't made with an upcoming ACR 10.3 in mind.

                                                      • 24. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                                                        mickspawn Level 1

                                                        In a perfect world staying synchronised would be wonderful!

                                                         

                                                        Unfortunately due to bugs in 7.3 and terrible performance (which Adobe knew about in the beta testing), i can't upgrade.  No idea why the devs even released this apart from pressure to have it ready before a certain date, so they knowingly released it with bugs.

                                                        • 25. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                                                          Per Berntsen Adobe Community Professional

                                                          https://forums.adobe.com/people/D%20Fosse  wrote

                                                           

                                                          Yes, that was the point I was trying to make a few posts up: stay synchronized, and you won't see this.

                                                          I'm not even sure it qualifies as a bug - obviously Lightroom 7.2 wasn't made with an upcoming ACR 10.3 in mind.

                                                          I have to admit that it never occurred to me that having non-matching ACR versions could cause this kind of problem.

                                                          And what makes this even more confusing is the fact that ist's only Edit in Photoshop that produces wrong colors (see screenshot in post 20). In both cases the image is opened with Lightroom adjustments - when using Edit in Photoshop, the image opens silently in ACR before it appears in Photoshop, and when opening directly in Photoshop, you get the ACR interface.

                                                           

                                                          mickspawn wrote

                                                           

                                                          Unfortunately due to bugs in 7.3 and terrible performance (which Adobe knew about in the beta testing), i can't upgrade.

                                                          FWIW, version 7.3 is now running fine on my system - no idea why - the first time I installed it, it was useless.

                                                           

                                                          You guys didnt have preset problems because you probably dont own a vast amount and without special characters. 

                                                          Have you considered using a file renaming utility to remove the special characters, or replace them with regular characters?

                                                          • 26. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                                                            D Fosse Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                            mickspawn  wrote

                                                             

                                                            Unfortunately due to bugs in 7.3 and terrible performance (which Adobe knew about in the beta testing), i can't upgrade.

                                                             

                                                            I did say synchronised, but not necessarily to the latest version. With Lightroom 7.2 you should be using ACR 10.2 - not go all the way back to 9.12.

                                                             

                                                            Agreed, switching between ACR dot releases isn't as easy as it used to be (when you could just replace the plugin directly in its folder). The CC app doesn't offer a version choice for ACR, which I think it should.

                                                             

                                                            In any case - performance problems with Lightroom is an eternal and ongoing saga. It's still totally unpredictable. Any given version is perfectly fine for some, and a total disaster for others. The next release may be the other way round. Personally I haven't noticed any differences between 7.2 and 7.3. Lightroom is never instant, as in "blink-and-you-missed-it", hasn't ever been, but usually it works fine without major problems.

                                                            • 27. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                                                              D Fosse Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                              https://forums.adobe.com/people/Per+Berntsen  wrote

                                                               

                                                              In both cases the image is opened with Lightroom adjustments - when using Edit in Photoshop, the image opens silently in ACR before it appears in Photoshop, and when opening directly in Photoshop, you get the ACR interface.

                                                               

                                                              Yes, that sounds funny, but the explanation is probably that in one case a script delivers "off-version" settings to ACR, but in the other the file opens with what are by definition native ACR settings. The mismatch must happen in the translation of the version-specific settings.

                                                              • 28. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                                                                mickspawn Level 1

                                                                Thanks guys for the replies.  I didnt see ACR 10.2 when i googled so thats why i chose 9.12 lol im gonna take a look now at getting 10.2

                                                                 

                                                                I also wish i could find a decent thread about best way to rename all my presets so i can just go ahead and upgrade!

                                                                • 29. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                                                                  Per Berntsen Adobe Community Professional

                                                                  I tried to find 10.2 myself yesterday, but as far as I can tell, Adobe only has the latest version of ACR 10 available for download.

                                                                  As for renaming, do a Google search for "renaming utility mac". The presets are regular files that can be renamed just like any other files.

                                                                  • 30. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                                                                    mickspawn Level 1

                                                                    Hey Per,

                                                                     

                                                                    I have confirmed with support that they dont have ACR 10 available for download.  But they did inform me 7.3.1 is coming soon.  Possibly within days not weeks.

                                                                    • 31. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                                                                      D Fosse Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                                      mickspawn  wrote

                                                                       

                                                                      I have confirmed with support that they dont have ACR 10 available for download.

                                                                      Ah, well, that certainly changes the whole picture. This must be a new policy.

                                                                       

                                                                      For Lightroom you can still get all the previous dot releases through the CC app - 7.0, 7.0.1, 7.1, 7.2.

                                                                       

                                                                      In that case the only thing you can do is to update Lightroom first, before anything else, and run it a few rounds to make sure it works properly. Then update the rest.

                                                                      • 32. Re: Lightroom 7.2 to Photoshop 19.1.3 inconsistent colors
                                                                        mickspawn Level 1

                                                                        indeed.  You guys are both very knowledgable.  It has been a pleasure