7 Replies Latest reply on Feb 4, 2008 1:49 PM by EldorG

    Export Color Space, etc?

    EldorG
      I'm a couple of days into a trial of Fireworks and I got it only for two reasons: First to be able to create navigation bars with popup menus on some of the menu options and second, to more easily create photo galleries for my web site. (I'm quite comfortable with PhotoShop and creating web-optimized images.)

      Anyway, I've run into a couple of things that have got me stumped...

      If I use FW CS3 to optimize a JPG image for the web (either from directly within FW or via the Create Web Photo Album command from within Dreamweaver CS3) the resulting images no longer have a color space embedded. And I can't find out how to embed one. The original JPG images were created in PS CS3 and had the sRBG color space embedded and the colors displayed as expected in a web browser. The resulting "optimized" images no longer have a color space embedded and the colors appear quite off. This might be acceptable with some vector graphics or logos but it's not acceptable with photgraphs, especially for a photography web site.

      (It's quite well-known, at least in photography circles that for proper display of the colors, images designed for the web should be in sRGB with that space embedded, as that is what web browsers are optimized for. Anything else, including not embedding a color space results in colors that are "off".)

      A related issue is that when using the Create Web Photo Album from within DW CS3 the resulting files all have a new suffix of "_jpg" added to the name. Meaning that my original "name.jpg" gets named "name_jpg.jpg". I really don't like that, and can't find how to turn it off.

      (I went to a large bookstore to buy a FW book today but they didn't have any. And the only one they even listed on their computer is due to be published at the end of February!)

      Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

      Eldor - Montreal
        • 1. Re: Export Color Space, etc?
          Level 7
          EldorG wrote:

          > CS3) the resulting images no longer have a color space embedded. And I can't
          > find out how to embed one. The original JPG images were created in PS CS3 and
          > had the sRBG color space embedded and the colors displayed as expected in a web
          > browser.

          Fireworks automatically exports them in sRGB format. Browsers do not
          read embedded color profiles, by the way.

          --
          Linda Rathgeber [PVII] *Adobe Community Expert-Fireworks*
          --------------------------------------------------------------
          http://www.projectseven.com
          Fireworks Newsgroup: news://forums.projectseven.com/fireworks/
          CSS Newsgroup: news://forums.projectseven.com/css/
          http://www.adobe.com/communities/experts/
          --------------------------------------------------------------
          • 2. Re: Export Color Space, etc?
            EldorG Level 1
            Thank you Linda. But something's not right...

            Using PS CS3 I can create an image for the web (using Save for Web) that is in the sRGB color space and has the space embedded in it. I can do that at several different compression levels (and just did that to confirm what I'm about to say)...

            Different compression levels result in different qualities, but the colors remain just about identical. Using FW CS3, even though you say FW automatically exports the images in sRGB mode, the colors are VERY different from those sRGB images created through PS CS3.

            Why is this, and what can be done about it?

            The resulting colors of images produced with FW, when viewed in a browser have very different colors and they're just not acceptable. Surely I must be missing something here, as FW is supposed to be able to create great images for the web.

            Thanks!
            • 3. Re: Export Color Space, etc?
              EldorG Level 1
              Linda.... Problem solved! It was a "PEBCAK" error.

              (Problem Exists Between Chair And Keyboard) SIGH

              I was viewing the resulting images in a color-space-aware program and NOT in a web browser! And because the resulting images didn't have any space embedded, the program I was using didn't know how to handle the colors and it resulted in colors that were way off.

              When I actually opened the images in a web browser, the colors DID display correctly.

              As I said, PEBCAK error.

              But that still leaves me with the file name "problem" I mentioned... that my images get named from "name.jpg" to "name_jpg.jpg". This happens when I use the "Create Web Photo Album" from Dreamweaver CS3 (which in turn calls FW to do the work).

              Should I post that in the DW forum, or is it a FW thing?

              Thanks very much!

              Eldor
              • 4. Re: Export Color Space, etc?
                Level 7
                EldorG wrote:
                Using FW CS3, even though you say FW automatically exports
                > the images in sRGB mode, the colors are VERY different from those sRGB images
                > created through PS CS3. Why is this, and what can be done about it?

                Don't embed the color profiles in Photoshop. Neither Fireworks nor Web
                browsers read them.

                --
                Linda Rathgeber [PVII] *Adobe Community Expert-Fireworks*
                --------------------------------------------------------------
                http://www.projectseven.com
                Fireworks Newsgroup: news://forums.projectseven.com/fireworks/
                CSS Newsgroup: news://forums.projectseven.com/css/
                http://www.adobe.com/communities/experts/
                --------------------------------------------------------------
                • 5. Re: Export Color Space, etc?
                  Level 7
                  EldorG wrote:

                  > As I said, PEBCAK error. But that still leaves me with the file name 'problem'
                  > I mentioned... that my images get named from 'name.jpg' to 'name_jpg.jpg'.
                  > This happens when I use the 'Create Web Photo Album' from Dreamweaver CS3
                  > (which in turn calls FW to do the work). Should I post that in the DW forum,
                  > or is it a FW thing? Thanks very much! Eldor

                  Don't name them in FW. Allow them to be exported with the names they
                  already have.


                  Linda Rathgeber [PVII] *Adobe Community Expert-Fireworks*
                  --------------------------------------------------------------
                  http://www.projectseven.com
                  Fireworks Newsgroup: news://forums.projectseven.com/fireworks/
                  CSS Newsgroup: news://forums.projectseven.com/css/
                  http://www.adobe.com/communities/experts/
                  --------------------------------------------------------------
                  • 6. Re: Export Color Space, etc?
                    EldorG Level 1
                    quote:

                    Originally posted by: Newsgroup User

                    Don't embed the color profiles in Photoshop. Neither Fireworks nor Web
                    browsers read them.



                    Linda, your suggestion is good if you ONLY intend those images to be used for display on the web. If they are to be use for many purposes, it's far better to embed the sRGB profile into them. Doing so doesn't bother any web browsers (as you said they don't read that info) but if the image is downloaded and then viewed through a color space-aware program then the colors will be as the author/artist intended.

                    My strong preference is to embed the sRGB profile into those images. Fine for the web, and fine also for other viewers off the web.

                    Cheers!

                    Eldor
                    • 7. Re: Export Color Space, etc?
                      EldorG Level 1
                      quote:

                      Originally posted by: Newsgroup User
                      EldorG wrote:

                      > As I said, PEBCAK error. But that still leaves me with the file name 'problem'
                      > I mentioned... that my images get named from 'name.jpg' to 'name_jpg.jpg'.
                      > This happens when I use the 'Create Web Photo Album' from Dreamweaver CS3
                      > (which in turn calls FW to do the work). Should I post that in the DW forum,
                      > or is it a FW thing? Thanks very much! Eldor

                      Don't name them in FW. Allow them to be exported with the names they
                      already have.


                      Linda Rathgeber [PVII] *Adobe Community Expert-Fireworks*
                      --------------------------------------------------------------
                      http://www.projectseven.com
                      Fireworks Newsgroup: news://forums.projectseven.com/fireworks/
                      CSS Newsgroup: news://forums.projectseven.com/css/
                      http://www.adobe.com/communities/experts/
                      --------------------------------------------------------------



                      Linda, I'm not naming the images in FW. As a matter of fact, I never even see a FW dialog. If I optimize an image directly from within FW, there is no problem. But doing so from Dreamweaver (through the Create Web Photo Album command which seems to call FW to automate the work) causes the images to be reduntantly renamed. And I don't see an option anywhere to change this.

                      As I said, I'm not sure if this is something I should be asking in the FW forum or the DW forum. But since this option doesn't even exist in DW until FW is installed and FW is called from DW to do this, I really don't know where to ask.

                      How does that FW automation work? Is there a script file or something somewhere that I might find and modify?

                      That option in DW not only optimizes a bunch of images, it creates thumbnails as well, and writes all the stuff into HTML code to produce a table of the images. So I can't just go to FW and manually optimize an image.

                      Regards...

                      Eldor