Date Photo taken vs Scaned

[jonh78144183]

I received a bunch of photos, we; over 10K.   I want to sort them by date.  Some of the jpeg files are actual photos and some are scanned photos, i.e. a B/W from 1922.  The Metadata contains a Folder Date as well as Date time Original.  Is it better to use the folder date to organize by date all jpeg files or........

Thanks Jon

[TheDigitalDog]

You want to use date created I suspect.

[johnrellis]

There's no ready answer to your question -- it depends on what dates are stored in the photos' metadata. Beware that LR doesn't handle scans missing capture dates very well, with long-standing bugs.

There are three dates shown in the Metadata > EXIF panel. They are defined by the industry standards:

Date Time Original: The date when the camera's shutter was pressed. All digital cameras now set this, but the earliest ones didn't. LR uses this as its "capture date" if it's present.  If it's not present (e.g. a scan), then LR may use for its capture date Date Time Digitized or the file's last-modified date as set by the operating system or camera firmware (the date that any application or camera modified the file, for any reason).  You can change this in LR using the Metadata > Edit Capture Time command.

Date Time Digitized: This is the date when the photo was converted into digital format, e.g. by a scanner. Some scanner programs set this field, but not all.

Date Time: Beware! This is the date when the last photo application modified the photo or its metadata for any reason. It is not the capture or digitized dates.  LR displays this field but doesn't update it (though the standards say it should).

In general, if you want to organize a large archive of photos, it's best to set Date Time Original (e.g. using LR's Edit Capture Time command) to the capture dates of the photos. This will store the capture date in the photos' metadata, making it accessible to other programs. 

The Metadata contains a Folder Date as well as Date time Original.  Is it better to use the folder date to organize by date all jpeg files or........

What do you mean by "Folder Date"?  There is no field in LR's Metadata panel by that name (in the English version of LR).  A screenshot of the entire Metadata panel or whatever you are looking at would help.

[jonh78144183]

Attached are two screen shots of EXIF data, one is JPEG file from a from a digital camera and a the other is a JPEG file from a scanned photo.  For the digital camera EXIF LR shows date time original.  For the scanned photo EXIF LR shows date time.   You have to use date time original for the digital photo as the date time is different, to the extent of a different year.   

In LR if you create a Smart collection you can search on capture date.  Is that date time original or date time or....  I suspect on the scanned photos I need to enter a date time original.  That way all photos have a date time original and when your search on capture date I will get the right photos.  The Folder Date is in IPTC.

[johnrellis]

The Folder Date is in IPTC.

Can you post a screenshot of what you are seeing?

[johnrellis]

For the digital camera EXIF LR shows date time original.  For the scanned photo EXIF LR shows date time.   You have to use date time original for the digital photo as the date time is different, to the extent of a different year.   

In LR if you create a Smart collection you can search on capture date.  Is that date time original or date time or....  I suspect on the scanned photos I need to enter a date time original.  That way all photos have a date time original and when your search on capture date I will get the right photos. 

So the digital-camera photos have EXIF:DateTimeOriginal and EXIF:DateTime and the scans have EXIF:DateTime recorded in their metadata.  As described above, EXIF:DateTimeOriginal is the industry-standard place to record when a photo was taken ("capture date"), and EXIF:DateTime is when an application last modified a photo for whatever reason. 

LR has its internal notion of Capture Date/Time, which it sets to EXIF:DateTimeOriginal if it exists, otherwise EXIF:DateTime if it exists. This internal Capture Date/Time is what is displayed in the Metadata > Default panel and under thumbnails in grid view, and it is what is searched by Capture Date in smart collections and the Library Filter bar.

So you could leave the photos as is, if you're satisfied with what is being shown for Capture Date/Time in the Metadata > Default panel and under thumbnails.  

But for those scans missing EXIF:DateTimeOriginal, I recommend explicitly setting EXIF:DateTimeOriginal to EXIF:DateTime, for two reasons:

- If you modify the photos with some other app that more closely follows the industry standards, the app could overwrite EXIF:DateTime with the current time.

- There remain bugs in LR in how it handles photos missing EXIF:DateTimeOriginal. Though Adobe has fixed most of those bugs recently, some remain.

It's easy to set EXIF:DateTimeOriginal to EXIF:DateTime for those photos missing EXIF:DateTimeOriginal:

- Back up your photos and catalog (and make sure the backups worked!)

- Select all the photos, do Metadata > Edit Capture Time, and do Change All. This won't change the photos that have both EXIF:DateTimeOriginal and EXIF:DateTime, and for those that don't, it will set EXIF:DateTimeOriginal to EXIF:DateTime.