21 Replies Latest reply on Dec 8, 2018 6:23 AM by Todd Shaner

    Performance Feedback Needed: i7-7700 and i7-8700 Systems

    Todd Shaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

      I'm getting ready to bite-the-bullet and purchase a new system. Currently using a Windows 7 system with i7-860 quad-core processor, 12 GB memory, 256GB SSD, 2TB HDD, and Nvidia Quadro 600 graphics card. With Canon 5D MKII 21 mp raw files performance is quite good in both the Develop and Library modules using a single 2560x1440 monitor. Import, Preview Building, and Export times aren't bad either. But my drives are filling up and I often run out of memory when working in both LR and PS. In addition I need to update to Windows 10, but one of the devices I use on this system doesn't have Windows 10 drivers. So a new Windows 10 system is needed as Adobe phases out support for Windows 7.

       

      The Intel i7-8700K six-core processor looks like the best value, but there have been numerous reports of poor performance with six or more core based systems.

       

      Lightroom: Slow performance on Xeon CPUs | Photoshop Family Customer Community

       

      Photoshop Lightroom (standalone) is very slow

       

      Lightroom CC disgustingly slow - old issue, NEED ANSWERS

       

      My 2nd choice is the i7-7700K quad-core processor, but there have been reports of slow performance with this processor.

       

      New PC built for editing but Lightroom is slow. Need troubleshooting help please

       

      Poor LR-performance

       

      What I'm looking for is feedback from LR users with systems using either of these processors with LR 7.5 or 8.0. In particular what you are seeing when scrolling through the Library module reviewing images and when making adjustment to images in the Develop module. Also would be interested in performance when importing and exporting mage files. This information is useful to both users looking to upgrade their systems and Adobe Engineering looking to fix current performance issues.

       

      Thank you for your timely feedback!

        • 1. Re: Performance Feedback Needed: i7-7700 and i7-8700 Systems
          dj_paige Level 10

          I am going to be buying a new computer as well ... and I am strongly considering the i7-8700k processor.

           

          Two of the links you gave refere to Xeon processors and as far as I know, that was an issue specific to Xeon and not related to the broader base of Intel processors. The other does talk about a 6-core processor, but again it is my understanding (I can't seem to find the exact link) that whatever problem LR used to have with 6 processors or more is now gone, that 6 core processors are definitely working well now, that Adobe has fixed this.

           

          What I'm looking for is feedback from LR users with systems using either of these processors with LR 7.5 or 8.0. In particular what you are seeing when scrolling through the Library module reviewing images and when making adjustment to images in the Develop module

           

          Scrolling in the develop module does not really depend much on the CPU, it depends on the speed of the disk (and whatever is going on in the background may affect this; and certainly improperly configuring anti-virus to scan photos will also affect this). My feeling regarding the library module is that if you avoid the major known cause of slowness (4K or larger monitors), that you ought to be fine. Unfortunately, a lot of problem reports in this forum do not mention monitor size, and so can't be evaluated. I plan on sticking with my 1920x1080 monitor, and don't expect problems in the Develop Module.

          • 2. Re: Performance Feedback Needed: i7-7700 and i7-8700 Systems
            Todd Shaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

            dj_paige  wrote

             

            I am going to be buying a new computer as well ... and I am strongly considering the i7-8700k processor.

             

            Two of the links you gave refere to Xeon processors and as far as I know, that was an issue specific to Xeon and not related to the broader base of Intel processors. The other does talk about a 6-core processor, but again it is my understanding (I can't seem to find the exact link) that whatever problem LR used to have with 6 processors or more is now gone, that 6 core processors are definitely working well now, that Adobe has fixed this.

            That's the issue. I can't find anything in the Adobe forums or blogs that clearly states specific performance updates have been applied that now allow six-core processors to exhibit good performance. The consensus in the past (pre LR Classic 7.0) was to use the fastest quad-core processor you could afford. This was due to the large number of users reporting poor LR performance with high-end systems using 6, 8, 10, and 12 core processors.

             

            dj_paige  wrote

             

            Scrolling in the develop module does not really depend much on the CPU, it depends on the speed of the disk (and whatever is going on in the background may affect this; and certainly improperly configuring anti-virus to scan photos will also affect this)

            Agreed, but again there are a large number of users with high-end systems reporting slow scrolling and screen updates when making adjustments in the Develop module. Most of these systems use multiple SSDs, which should eliminate disk transfer-speed from the equation.

             

            I'm looking for input from users who currently run LR on these two "best value" processors with LR 7.5 and the most recent 8.0 versions. It's a shame Adobe doesn't provide input on processor requirements similar to what they provide for GPU. Understandably it would be very bad press from a marketing perspective for Adobe to "officially" recommend using only lower performance processors with LR. So we users can only establish this information based on input from other users reporting here and in other forums.

            • 3. Re: Performance Feedback Needed: i7-7700 and i7-8700 Systems
              dj_paige Level 10

              https://forums.adobe.com/people/Todd+Shaner  wrote

               

              dj_paige   wrote

               

              I am going to be buying a new computer as well ... and I am strongly considering the i7-8700k processor.

               

              Two of the links you gave refere to Xeon processors and as far as I know, that was an issue specific to Xeon and not related to the broader base of Intel processors. The other does talk about a 6-core processor, but again it is my understanding (I can't seem to find the exact link) that whatever problem LR used to have with 6 processors or more is now gone, that 6 core processors are definitely working well now, that Adobe has fixed this.

              That's the issue. I can't find anything in the Adobe forums or blogs that clearly states specific performance updates have been applied that now allow six-core processors to exhibit good performance. The consensus in the past (pre LR Classic 7.0) was to use the fastest quad-core processor you could afford. This was due to the large number of users reporting poor LR performance with high-end systems using 6, 8, 10, and 12 core processors.

              I thought I had read this somewhere, but could not find the link. So, yes, I am in the "same boat" as you. There is this from about 1 year ago, but I don't really know what it means: Lightroom with i9 or Ryzen CPU? as Adobe likes to be vague on these matters.

               

              In fact, we really have had very little guidance from Adobe with regards to hardware since Eric Chan told us about how the new LR 6 would make use of GPUs, and that's a long time ago in software years.

               

              So I like your new thread to hear from people who have bought computers recently (say in the last year) where they describe their hardware, and their workflow, and if Lightroom runs well or not. The problem with this forum (and most other forums) is that we only hear from users when things are not working. Such a thread (a database, if you will) could be invaluable to others. Most existing threads don't provide enough information on the hardware, and often don't include the workflow, which can also result in very poor performance if lots of brushing and/or lots of spot healing is done. It is my opinion that Lightroom doesn't perform well on 4K or larger monitors if there is a lot of spot healing and/or a lot of brushing, and this is the cause of a lot, but not all, of the performance problems reported; but if anyone has other experiences, please speak up, especially positive experiences.

               

              Agreed, but again there are a large number of users with high-end systems reporting slow scrolling and screen updates when making adjustments in the Develop module. Most of these systems use multiple SSDs, which should eliminate disk transfer-speed from the equation.

              I simply am not concerned with disk speed or disk transfer speed causing slowness in the Develop module. I believe that Ian Lyons has put that to rest.

              Will an SSD Improve Adobe Lightroom Performance? | Computer Darkroom

               

              I'm looking for input from users who currently run LR on these two "best value" processors with LR 7.5 and the most recent 8.0 versions. It's a shame Adobe doesn't provide input on processor requirements similar to what they provide for GPU. Understandably it would be very bad press from a marketing perspective for Adobe to "officially" recommend using only lower performance processors with LR. So we users can only establish this information based on input from other users reporting here and in other forums.

              I agree. Let's hear from users with new computers.

              • 4. Re: Performance Feedback Needed: i7-7700 and i7-8700 Systems
                KR Seals Level 3

                A couple of months ago I built this Win 10 PC system:

                I7 8700K

                Asus Z390 MB with 64GB ram

                Samsung 512 GB Nvme SSD for system and programs

                Samsung 512 GB 860 SATA for LR catalog and previews

                Multiple 8 and 4 TB hard drives for the photos and video files.

                Reused 5 year old GTX 970 gpu.

                Clean Win 10 install.

                The system checks very good on bench marks. LR CC CL V 7 and 8 have worked very quickly and smoothly on the 45 MP files from my Nikon D850 including up to 11 image panoramas. The only continuing issue is LR CL bogs down with local adjustments like a lot of spot healing. When I need that, I go to Photoshop.

                I am very happy with this system. It replaces my old I7 3930 that is 5 years old and now my standby machine.

                2 people found this helpful
                • 5. Re: Performance Feedback Needed: i7-7700 and i7-8700 Systems
                  dj_paige Level 10

                  KR Seals

                  Please tell us the size of your monitor in pixels (not inches).

                  • 6. Re: Performance Feedback Needed: i7-7700 and i7-8700 Systems
                    Todd Shaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                    https://forums.adobe.com/people/KR+Seals  wrote

                    I am very happy with this system. It replaces my old I7 3930 that is 5 years old and now my standby machine.

                    The i7-3930 is also a six-core processor. Did you experience any performance issues using this system with the six-core i7-3930 processor over the past 5 years (LR 5, 6, 7)? In particular did you see any lag when adjusting the Basic panel Tone controls or delays when trying to scroll through images? For example with my lower performance i7-860 quad-core system there is absolutely no delay in the onscreen rendering when making Tone adjustments. Did you notice any LR performance improvement after upgrading to the i7-8700K processor? If so what specifically? Thank you for your feedback!

                    • 7. Re: Performance Feedback Needed: i7-7700 and i7-8700 Systems
                      Ian Lyons MVP & Adobe Community Professional

                      I use a late 2013 Mac Pro with a 3.5GHz 6-core Xeon processor. If there was / is an issue with these processors then I must have a special version because I've not experienced any performance issues.

                       

                      Also worth noting that Lr7 on higher makes much greater use of cpu cores than previous versions. On Mac platform the current sweet-spot for the iMac Pro is the 10 core processor.

                      • 8. Re: Performance Feedback Needed: i7-7700 and i7-8700 Systems
                        Todd Shaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                        https://forums.adobe.com/people/Ian+Lyons  wrote

                         

                        I use a late 2013 Mac Pro with a 3.5GHz 6-core Xeon processor. If there was / is an issue with these processors then I must have a special version because I've not experienced any performance issues.

                        Ian, that's strange since there's a lengthy discussion in the Photoshop Family Community specifically concerning six-core and greater Xeon processors. Users were experiencing poor LR performance and Adobe Engineer Simon Chen offered a solution that basically limited the core usage to "fix" the issue. It was also noted that this performance issue (6 or greater cores) was observed with Intel i7 and AMD processors as well and not just Xeon processors. It's good to hear you haven't experienced performance issue, but understandably myself and others are confused where the issue lies!

                         

                        Lightroom: Slow performance on Xeon CPUs | Photoshop Family Customer Community

                         

                        Thanks for your assistance!

                        • 9. Re: Performance Feedback Needed: i7-7700 and i7-8700 Systems
                          johnrellis Most Valuable Participant

                          Users were experiencing poor LR performance and Adobe Engineer Simon Chen offered a solution that basically limited the core usage to "fix" the issue.

                          To build on this, many Windows users with 6 or more cores worked around their severe performance problems using "start /affinity" to limit LR to using just 4 logical processors (what Intel calls threads).   Mac OS doesn't provide a convenient equivalent to "start /affinity", and you can only limit the entire machine to a subset of the cores; I'm not aware of anyone who tried this with LR.

                           

                          I'm awaiting more reports of people's experience with LR 8 on 6 or more cores before I update my Macbook Pro.,

                          • 10. Re: Performance Feedback Needed: i7-7700 and i7-8700 Systems
                            Jao vdL Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                            I am pretty sure the 6 core issue was fixed quite a while ago. Don't know which version and they did indeed not make a big deal about it.

                            • 11. Re: Performance Feedback Needed: i7-7700 and i7-8700 Systems
                              KR Seals Level 3

                              running two NEC PA-272-Ws, About 266-x1440 PIXELS I only use them both in LR occasionally, but doing that causes no issues.

                              • 12. Re: Performance Feedback Needed: i7-7700 and i7-8700 Systems
                                KR Seals Level 3

                                No, I was always pleased with the performance of the I7 3930. I had a couple of extra bucks from the sale of our house and figured it was time to upgrade with a totally new system, except for the gpu.

                                 

                                Everything is just a little snappier with the 8700K.

                                 

                                Todd, I have enjoyed your comments through the years and remember the 4 core vs 6 core threads. I have been using LR back to V2 on a variety of home brew Pentium up through the 8700K. The with the i7 920 and 3930 I had a little slowness moving through the photos in Library and Develop but I think the last few version of LR have improved that along with the higher horsepower. No complaints now, except for the laggy response of the spot healing when a lot of strokes have been made.

                                • 13. Re: Performance Feedback Needed: i7-7700 and i7-8700 Systems
                                  KR Seals Level 3

                                  Typo, that's 2650c1440 :-)

                                  • 14. Re: Performance Feedback Needed: i7-7700 and i7-8700 Systems
                                    Todd Shaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                    https://forums.adobe.com/people/Ian+Lyons  wrote

                                     

                                    I use a late 2013 Mac Pro with a 3.5GHz 6-core Xeon processor. If there was / is an issue with these processors then I must have a special version because I've not experienced any performance issues.

                                    It looks like we have one six-core system user on Mac and one on Windows reporting no performance issues with LR 7 and higher.

                                    • 15. Re: Performance Feedback Needed: i7-7700 and i7-8700 Systems
                                      Todd Shaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                      https://forums.adobe.com/people/Jao+vdL  wrote

                                       

                                      I am pretty sure the 6 core issue was fixed quite a while ago. Don't know which version and they did indeed not make a big deal about it.

                                      Adobe Engineer Simon Chen's last reply at Photoshop Family report was 11 months ago concerning opt-ins for the developer preview that supposedly fixes the issue. It makes no sense that Adobe hasn't been more open about correcting this issue. I mean if the performance issues were actually fixed for the majority of users with six or more core systems why wouldn't they have announced it?

                                       

                                      Lightroom: Slow performance on Xeon CPUs | Photoshop Family Customer Community

                                       

                                      I'll contact Adobe Engineering directly and see if if I can get a definitive answer.

                                      • 16. Re: Performance Feedback Needed: i7-7700 and i7-8700 Systems
                                        Todd Shaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                        I had a discussion today with Adobe Engineer Simon Chen, Principal Computer Scientist. He confirmed LR 7.2 and higher has been updated to better utilize six or more core processors. This includes Import, Preview Building, Export, and Develop module operations. However, extensive Adjustment Brush and Spot Removal applications may still slow down LR system performance. This is due to the overhead required for nondestructive editing and not something Adobe is able to address satisfactorily at this time. When extensive local editing is required the best option is to use ‘Edit in Photoshop.’ You can also use the Range Mask controls with the Adjustment Brush, Radial Filter, and Graduated Filter to better “localize” the edits using fewer brush spots. Simon mentioned he personally uses both eight-core and 16-core (physical cores) Windows systems and LR's performance scales up well on both.

                                         

                                        I'll be researching available i7-8700K Windows 10 systems. If anyone's interested I'll post some of the units I find that have good base specs for LR usage. I'll be looking for i7-8700K systems with at least a 1TB SSD, 3TB HDD, 32 GB Memory, and an Nvidia P2000 Quadro graphics card.

                                        2 people found this helpful
                                        • 17. Re: Performance Feedback Needed: i7-7700 and i7-8700 Systems
                                          Todd Shaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                          Update on system research. Using the Dell and HP websites with "custom-build" options I was unable to configure a system with the proper components. Also very little information is provided concerning the specific components they use other than the CPU and graphics card. After some research I found a custom system builder in Wisconsin named 'CPU Solutions' that appears to be very reputable. They offer full customization options on select systems and provide actual manufacturer information for the components used. I ordered their CPU Solutions CEV-5859-A Video Editing PC  system with the following components:

                                           

                                          i7 8700K 3.7 to 4.7Ghz 6 Core Processor

                                          Intel Cooling Fan/Heatsink BXTS15A Air Cooler ($15 Upgrade)

                                          Gigabyte Z370M DS3H Desktop Motherboard

                                          NVIDA Quadro P2000 w/5GB

                                          32 GB DDR4 RAM 2666Mhz

                                          Samsung 970 EVO MZ-V7E1T0E 1 TB SSD - PCIe - M.2 2280 ($130 Upgrade)

                                          WD Black 4TB 7200RPM HDD ($155 Upgrade)

                                          24X DVD-RW Optical Drive

                                          Windows 10 Pro

                                          Fractal Design Focus G Mini Micro ATX Case

                                          750w Gold Certified 90% Efficiency Power Supply ($30 Upgrade)

                                          48 Hour Testing & Burn-in

                                          12 Month Parts & Labor Depot Limited Warranty

                                          $2313 Total Price including upgrades and shipping

                                           

                                          I'll post results with the new system compared to my current  i7-860 quad-core system. Expected delivery is 7-9 days.

                                          • 18. Re: Performance Feedback Needed: i7-7700 and i7-8700 Systems
                                            dj_paige Level 10

                                            I have bought a number of computers from CyberpowerPC.com, you can custom configure it to your heart's content, and usually they are cheaper than Dell or HP (you are paying $$$ for the brand name there)

                                            • 19. Re: Performance Feedback Needed: i7-7700 and i7-8700 Systems
                                              Lex van Oorspronk Level 1

                                              If there is anyone with an iMac Pro running LR I'd like to hear their experience.

                                               

                                              The reason is I was considering an iMac Pro for LR, but most opinions were that a smaller number (4) of faster cores would be better and LR would still be lagging when skipping through photos in Develop. My feeling is that the newer LR versions are using more cores so maybe an iMac Pro is a good choice. By the way, I know an iMac Pro might be some overkill but I'm planning to buy the cheapest configuration (8 cores and 32GB RAM) and I'd like my desktop computer to be future proof (I always keep it for 6-7 years).

                                              • 20. Re: Performance Feedback Needed: i7-7700 and i7-8700 Systems
                                                Todd Shaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                I received my new six-core (12 virtual cores) i7-8700K Windows 10 Pro system from CPU Solutions. The system was well packaged and the overall build looks good with no issues so far. See my reply #17 here for system specs. I'm still in the process of moving everything over from my old i7-860 system, but have run some tests with LR Classic 8.0. The Import, Export, Preview Building, Library and Develop module operations are all noticeably faster and more "fluid" including local Adjustment Brush and Spot Healing. Keep in mind I didn't have any real LR issues with my older i7-860, but good to know the i7-8700K six-core processor is an improvement. I'll report back with any issues discovered after the old system's programs and files are fully migrated to the new system. Right now I'm a happy six-core user!

                                                2 people found this helpful
                                                • 21. Re: Performance Feedback Needed: i7-7700 and i7-8700 Systems
                                                  Todd Shaner Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                  I've been using the new i7-8700K six core system extensively with LR and PS over the past two weeks.I have yet to see slowdown of ANY operation including applying a large number of Spot Removal Clone and Heal spots. Absolutely a joy!

                                                  2 people found this helpful