13 Replies Latest reply on May 26, 2008 12:55 PM by (kokii)

    profill from camera or ps?

      Hi,

      if I photograph from my camera with raw file and profille sRGB
      and then assign in PS to profilee aRGB -
      it's be difrent if i photograph from my camera with raw file and profille aRGB and open in PS?

      thank
        • 1. Re: profill from camera or ps?
          (Marco_Ugolini) Level 1
          If you shoot Raw, process the image in Camera Raw using the sRGB profile, then open in Photoshop and *assign* the AdobeRGB profile, you are changing the meaning of the color numbers in the file. Numbers that produced a certain color in sRGB will now produce a *different* color in AdobeRGB (usually, a noticeably more saturated one).
          • 2. Re: profill from camera or ps?
            Lou Dina Level 3
            To add to what Marco said, if you want your file to be Adobe RGB and need the extra color gamut Adobe RGB provides, then convert your RAW file directly to Adobe RGB from your Raw converter. This way, it will arrive in Photoshop already as an Adobe RGB file.

            Lou
            • 3. Re: profill from camera or ps?
              (Marco_Ugolini) Level 1
              Exactly. Lou is right about that.

              Some inkjet printers these days may even surpass the AdobeRGB gamut. If you have one of those, you may consider processing your Raw file in ProPhoto RGB, for maximum saturation and color brilliance.
              • 4. Re: profill from camera or ps?
                Ramón G Castañeda Level 4
                Kokii,

                When you shoot RAW, the color space you choose in the camera is absolutely irrelevant. It's only a tag to inform the camera manufacturer's software at the time of demosaicing (raw conversion). The pixels are not affected at all in the RAW image by that in-camera setting, and Adobe Camera Raw ignores that tag alltogether.

                Marco and Lou have given you good advice.
                • 5. Re: profill from camera or ps?
                  thank!

                  but you see the difference assign from PS to profille aRGB
                  between shot from camera with profille aRGB?

                  what the difference?
                  • 6. Re: profill from camera or ps?
                    Ramón G Castañeda Level 4
                    Koki,

                    Try reading my post #4 again.

                    You write:
                    >but you see the difference assign from PS to profille aRGB
                    between shot from camera with profille aRGB?

                    That makes no sense. Again, when you shoot RAW, it does NOT matter what color space you set in the camera. A raw image shot with the camera to sRGB will be IDENTICAL to a raw image shot under the same condition. There will be no difference in that case.

                    Now --a different scenario-- if you use Adobe Camera Raw to convert the RAW file to the sRGB space and then use Photoshop to "assign" the aRGB profile to it, then you will be wrecking the hell out of your colors and your image will look extremely bad. It doesn't matter what profile you had set in your camera if you shoot raw.

                    Always use "CONVERT to Profile" in Photoshop, NOT "assign".

                    Of course, the sRGB color space is smaller than Adobe RGB, so if you use ACR (Adobe Camera Raw) to convert your linear RAW file to the sRGB space, you will have a more limited color gamut with which to work.

                    The internal color space used by ACR (Adobe Camera Raw) is essentially the same as ProPhoto RGB, which is a very, very wide color space.

                    Therefore, if you follow Marco Ugolini's advice in post #3, you will retain the full gamut by using ACR to convert your linear RAW file to ProPhoto RGB. Afterwards, you can use Photoshop to CONVERT to either to AdobeRGB or sRGB. But NEVER, ever use "assign" a profile in Photoshop.
                    • 7. Re: profill from camera or ps?
                      Ramón G Castañeda Level 4
                      Now, the ONLY time you would ever use assign a profile is when some idiot gives you an untagged image file, that is an image file that does NOT have a color profile embedded and you have no idea how it was created. In that case, you are forced to make an educated guess as to what color profile was used to create this untagged file. The way to make that educated guess is by "assigning" one color profile after another to decide which one makes the image look right as best you can tell.

                      Afterwards you can look for the idiot that gave you an image file without an embedded color profile and slap him silly or beat him up with a big stick so he doesn't do that again to you. :D

                      I know this sounds graphic and violent, but I hope it will give you the idea of what I'm trying to convey here.
                      • 8. Re: profill from camera or ps?
                        Level 1
                        ok

                        here the my store.

                        i shot raw with profille sRGB. but may printer tell the best
                        from here injekt it's aRGB.

                        so, i make convert to aRGB - but the color it's still aseme (were minimal diffrent) between sRGB to aRGB. but when i make assign
                        the image more live and color. the red and green more live and high.

                        thank
                        • 9. Re: profill from camera or ps?
                          Ramón G Castañeda Level 4
                          >here the my store.
                          >
                          >shot raw with profille sRGB.

                          No, Koki, you don't. You shoot RAW, period. The color space you set in camera is ignored, it does NOT matter.

                          Raw files do not have a color profile.

                          Please read all posts again carefully.

                          As you have been told in the other thread, you need to learn about color management. Read the book that was recommended to you.

                          Good luck.
                          • 10. Re: profill from camera or ps?
                            (Marco_Ugolini) Level 1
                            Listen to Ramón, Koki. Yours is an incorrect perception of how color management is done.

                            By assigning AdobeRGB to an sRGB file you are *artificially* and *arbitrarily* increasing saturation, at the expense of color accuracy. In other words, you are throwing color accuracy out the window.

                            Unless you intend this procedure as an artistic device (do you?), I would strongly advise you to study up on how ICC color profiles are properly used. ("Real World Color Management" by Fraser, Murphy and Bunting is the accepted reference for things having to do with color management.)

                            If you wish to obtain the brightest, most vivid colors that your Raw image is capable of expressing, process it in Camera Raw using ProPhoto RGB. That way the colors will be the brightest they can be *while still remaining accurate* -- not cartoonish like they are by assigning the incorrect profile.
                            • 11. Re: profill from camera or ps?
                              Ramón G Castañeda Level 4
                              Koki,

                              This excerpt copied and pasted from an old post of mine may help you understand the difference between CONVERT and assign.

                              To understand profiles, think of your image as text, and of the profile as a tag that indicates in which language the text is written.

                              If you see text that says GIFT, you need to know whether it's in English or in German. If in German, the word means "poison", if in English, it means a present.

                              Other examples: ONCE means "eleven" in Spanish but "one time" in English.

                              MOST means "Bridge" in Russian but "greatest in amount, extent, or degree" in English and "fruit juice" in German.

                              If you change the language (profile) by ASSIGNING, you change the meaning of the text (appearance of the image). The numbers representing the colors in your image will remain the same, but the colors will change because the same numbers now mean something else (as the meaning of the text will change if you now read the same letters in a different language).

                              CONVERTING to a profile will preserve the colors while the numbers change, in the same manner as the text will retain its meaning if you TRANSLATE it into a different language, changing the letters but preserving the meaning.
                              • 12. Re: profill from camera or ps?
                                Ramón G Castañeda Level 4
                                And try this web site for a brief, layman-style explanation of Color Management:

                                http://www.gballard.net/psd/cmstheory.html

                                http://www.gballard.net/psd/assignconvert.html

                                Then get the book recommended to you earlier. :)
                                • 13. Re: profill from camera or ps?
                                  Level 1
                                  thank.

                                  it's were hard me to reat because I'm dyslexi.
                                  that way i like forums and listen from pepole.

                                  thank again for yoer patience