1 2 Previous Next 47 Replies Latest reply on Oct 10, 2008 6:19 AM by MadManChan2000

    ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset

      I believe that requiring an upgrade to CS4 to get ACR 5 is another case of an inconsiderate move by Adobe.

      I hope that enough people will get on the bandwagon and solicit a change in that stance.
        • 1. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
          MadManChan2000 Adobe Employee
          How much would you be willing to pay to upgrade to ACR 5 alone?

          Or are you hoping to get the new features of ACR 5 for free?
          • 2. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
            Level 1
            Well, you may be upset...but this is no new policy...so maybe you are simply uninformed?

            Adobe has a long standing policy going back to mid-1990's that support for the previous version ends when a new version ships. So, there will be no updates for ANY of CS3 once CS4 ships. CS4 then becomes the "current version" and all support and any updates will only be done to support CS4.

            If you want to use new cameras not supported by Camera Raw 4.x in Photoshop CS3 then you will have to use the DNG Converter to convert from the proprietary raw to DNG raw. If you do that, you can use those DNGs all the way back to Camera Raw 2.4 in Photoshop CS. That's the method of providing backwards compatibility via DNG.

            On the other hand, if you want, as Eric asks, the features and functionality of Camera Raw 5 to be able to be used in Photoshop CS3, then you want something for nothing. That's not a long term viable business proposition for Adobe.
            • 3. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
              Dennis 1111 Level 2
              In addition to the DNG option that Jeff mentions, you might also want to consider switching to Lightroom if you rarely use the massive features of Photoshop. In the short-term it would be more expensive ($299 for a new copy of LR2 vs $199 for an upgrade to CS4) but the upgrades later to LR might be cheaper (the CS4 upgrade is $199 vs the LR2 upgrade at $99, for example).

              Also, if you spend most of your time doing raw conversion there ARE competitors out there to ACR. Since this is Adobe's forum I won't post all the names here but do a Google on "raw converters" and you will find them.

              Ultimately I think you will need to vote with your wallet if you feel strongly enough about it. I am sure Adobe has done enough market research that they have relative confidence that they will meet their targets with the prices they are charging. I doubt if posts in their forums will change their minds.

              Adobe, like Microsoft, Apple, and others obviously takes advantage of their position as "industry standard" to charge a premium. It is a little like winning the lottery at the corporate level and one of the aspects of the "global economy" that I find troublesome these days. Nevertheless, until some new economic model comes along I think our choices are to pay the premium for the "standard" or pay less for a "non-standard" product.
              • 4. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                Ramón G Castañeda Level 4
                What Jeff says:

                this is no new policy...so maybe you are simply uninformed?


                Where have you been since Camera Raw 2.x? ;)
                • 5. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                  Tim Lookingbill Level 1
                  Selling ACR as a separate upgrade would be like selling Smart Sharpening, Calculations, Gaussian Blur, Highlight and Shadow and other tools in Photoshop the same way. If you don't expect that to happen then you shouldn't expect that of ACR which is just another plugin tool within Photoshop.

                  I wished the same as you, but when I thought it through, I had to remind myself that just because this huge screen and complex dialog box full of wonderful tabbed tools comes up within Photoshop when I open a raw file, it doesn't mean it's some separate app. It's just another tool just like the others.
                  • 6. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                    Yammer Level 4
                    ACR is a plug-in, right? Couldn't Adobe sell it as a separate plug-in, just like other companies do? Of course, they can include it ('free') with Photoshop/Elements too. Presumably the only things stopping them are technical and cost/profit constraints.
                    • 7. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                      ArrrBee Level 1
                      Well Tim I disagree with that. ACR is not use for Photoshop it is used
                      inside of Bridge and bridge is a seperate program. Now I am not saying that
                      ACR should be sold seperately mind you. I am just saying your reasoning is
                      flawed.

                      I think Adobe has every right to tie ACR to Photoshop and Photoshop
                      versions. With the less than stellar updates that pass as for cost upgrades
                      these days Adobe rightfully needs every reason they can get to induce people
                      to upgrade. ACR is a legitamate reason. Now it just so happens that CS4 is
                      in my opinion a very worthwhile upgrade no matter if your comming from CS3.
                      If your running older than CS3 then it is an ever more major upgrade.

                      With the labs release of the configurator tool that will enable some very
                      cool add-ons that will only work with CS4 that is an even larger reason to
                      upgrade.

                      Robert
                      • 8. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                        Tim Lookingbill Level 1
                        Robert,

                        I'ld have to disagree with you on whether ACR is inside of Bridge as if it's an extension of Bridge. I may be misunderstanding your use of the terminology.

                        Bridge is a separate app having its own icon that can be placed on the desktop and opened from there or through Photoshop by clicking its icon in the top menu bar. When I open a raw file from Bridge without having Photoshop open, the Photoshop splash screen suddenly appears indicating Photoshop is being launched. You can't stop this from happening. Photoshop ALWAYS launches if you want to edit a raw file so ACR is embedded within Photoshop and there's no way around it.
                        • 9. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                          Ramón G Castañeda Level 4
                          &gt;so ACR is embedded within Photoshop and there's no way around it <br /> <br /> Not true at all. <br /> <br /> I can have Bridge host ACR without Photoshop launching at all. Without question. <br /> <br /> Now, <b>if the ACR plug-in is NOT in its correct location</b>, then Bridge may not be able to see it. <br /> <br />c <a href="http://www.pixentral.com/show.php?picture=117suCaHaouvfpdtra9Xzbq14i9P" /></a> <img alt="Picture hosted by Pixentral" src="http://www.pixentral.com/hosted/117suCaHaouvfpdtra9Xzbq14i9P_thumb.jpg" border="0" /> <br />c Correct ACR location on a Mac
                          • 10. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                            ArrrBee Level 1
                            Well then you have something strange set on your system, because I load
                            Bridge, select the images I want to edit, tell it to open then in ACR and
                            only ACR comes up. I can then make my adjustments, click on the done button
                            ACR closes, my images update in Bridge with the changes I made all without
                            Photoshop.

                            Robert
                            • 11. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                              Ramón G Castañeda Level 4
                              The user can choose whether to have Photoshop or Bridge host ACR.

                              ACR is not " inside" either application.
                              • 12. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                Level 1
                                Camera Raw is a dual/host plug-in. It can be launched from within Bridge, or from within Photoshop or from both. Yes, you can actually have Camera Raw open twice at the same timefirst open CR hosted in Photoshop, then go back to Bridge and open CR hosted in Bridge.

                                I often work in Bridge on the road on a laptop and never launch Photoshop, only Bridge. Actually, running only Bridge on a small laptop makes working in Bridge and camera Raw a lot more efficient because the ram will be used by Bridge.
                                • 13. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                  Tim Lookingbill Level 1
                                  Well color me stupid. I stand corrected.

                                  I have CS2 and the ACR plug-in is in the correct directory. Opened Bridge and found I need to Control click on a raw file and choose "Open In Camera Raw..." and ACR screen loads quite quickly over what I've been doing which is double clicking on the raw file which brings up Photoshop by default.

                                  Sorry about that.

                                  I haven't taken the time to get to know ALL the in's and out's of CS2, Bridge and ACR. I've been using PS 7 these past several years. There's so much stuff buried within the interface of these newer apps I haven't been able to keep up with it. I still haven't figured out all the keyboard shortcuts starting as far back as PS4. Too much stuff to remember.

                                  Now what were we arguing about? :)
                                  • 14. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                    Yammer Level 4
                                    On my PC, double-clicking a thumbnail in Bridge CS3 loads it into Camera Raw (without using Photoshop).

                                    On quick inspection of the Bridge Preferences (Ctrl-K), I can see a setting on the General tab: "Behaviour - Double-click edits Camera Raw settings in Bridge". My guess is that you have this unchecked. I'm not 100% sure, but I think the default is ticked.

                                    I find that hosting Camera Raw in Bridge is a much more efficient way of dealing with my photos before going into production. It's quicker, uses less resources, and is capable of working on many more images at the same time. I only proceed to Photoshop when I'm happy with the Raw conversion settings.
                                    • 15. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                      ArrrBee Level 1
                                      Tim, no problem we all learn something new everyday. One more nice tip is
                                      you can make your adjustments in ACR and then click the done button. This
                                      will update the DNG files with your changes. This is great if you just need
                                      to edit in ACR and don't need Photoshop. Just learned this one myself a week
                                      or so ago.

                                      Robert
                                      • 16. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                        Tim Lookingbill Level 1
                                        Keith,

                                        I found that preference check box but in the Advanced section of Bridge in OS X. What threw me about checking that box is the terminology used in particular..."Camera Raw Settings" which I got the impression it meant it would just apply some saved edit or default color setting to change the appearance of the thumbnail. It should say just plainly "Launch or Open Only Camera Raw When Double Clicking a RAW File".

                                        I still was and am under the impression since you can't open ACR as a standalone app it's meant to be exclusive to the total Photoshop package purchase with Bridge always being part of the package. It's like contending that a computer isn't a computer without the OS and the OS can't exist without the hardware. They both can't operate without the other so they are considered as one. Heh, try telling that to Bill Gates.

                                        Robert,

                                        The main reasons I shoot raw is to recover dynamic range and detail in the shadows and highlights that get thrown away shooting jpeg. In CS2 I have to use the Highlight/Shadow tool which doesn't exist in ACR 3.7.

                                        You're right about that learnin' thing. I just learned no ones an expert and everyone's an expert when giving advice on the internet which tends to create the potential of making everyone either look like a fool or a genius with every post.
                                        • 17. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                          Ramón G Castañeda Level 4
                                          >the Highlight/Shadow tool which doesn't exist in ACR 3.7.

                                          It doesn't exist in ACR, period. What you have in ACR 4.5 (and presumably ACR 5) is Fill Light and all kinds of adjustments you can apply with curves.
                                          • 18. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                            Level 1
                                            >The main reasons I shoot raw is to recover dynamic range and detail in the shadows and highlights that get thrown away shooting jpeg. In CS2 I have to use the Highlight/Shadow tool which doesn't exist in ACR 3.7.

                                            Uh huh...and that's just the tip of the iceberg you don't have with Camera Raw 3.x VS Camera Raw 4.x Your failure to upgrade to CS3 has left you pretty far behind in terms of image quality coming from raw files. In point of fact, Camera Raw 4's Recovery and Fill Light work on RAW files and do far more than Photoshop's Highlight/Shadow tool which can't work on raw fileshence you loose ALL of the high bit depth recovery you can get from a linear raw file trying to work in Photoshop.

                                            Course, you could upgrade to CS3 (for a very brief time) and get CS4 free (for shipping I believe) or just wait for Photoshop CS4 and get Camera Raw 5 which has everything CR 4 has plus local tone/color control.

                                            But seriously, if you care about image quality coming off of raw and you are still using Photoshop CS2 and Camera Raw 3.x, then you are shooting yourself in the foot. (and getting far less image quality in the bargan).
                                            • 19. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                              > Adobe has a long standing policy going back to mid-1990's that support for the previous version ends when a new version ships. So, there will be no updates for ANY of CS3 once CS4 ships. CS4 then becomes the "current version" and all support and any updates will only be done to support CS4.

                                              The real question then is should CS3 users be entitled to ACR5 in light of the fact that it has been effectively available since the release of LR2.0 (AKA ACR 5.0 Beta) ACR 5.0 is the develop module in LR2.0 and LR2.0 has been out for over 2 months, 2 months in which the current version of Photoshop was not CS4 but rather CS3. Also long enough for folks like me to pay for the Lightroom upgrade before being told that most of the new LR2 features would be included for free in CS4.

                                              What really chaps me is that Adobe is not offering a discount on CS4 upgrades to LR2 users especially after we paid for the privilege of being Beta testers while suffering through a bunch of workarounds and performance issues while waiting for LR2.1. Beta testers for what will be soon released as ACR5 in CS4.

                                              If this lack of a discount is not addressed by Adobe then users will wait before upgrading in the future until both programs upgrades are available just to make sure they aren't paying for the same code twice.
                                              • 20. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                                MadManChan2000 Adobe Employee
                                                > before being told that most of the new LR2 features
                                                > would be included for free in CS4.

                                                What makes you think that most of the new LR2 features are going to be included for free in CS4?
                                                • 21. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                                  ArrrBee Level 1
                                                  ACR 5 was not and is not available as a public beta. Only select people have
                                                  had access to the beta and that was with Photoshop CS4 beta. The fact that a
                                                  beta was available to select people doesn't mean Adobe should give it away
                                                  free. If you want ACR 5 then upgrade to CS4.

                                                  Robert
                                                  • 22. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                                    Level 1
                                                    >What makes you think that most of the new LR2 features are going to be included for free in CS4?

                                                    As a user of LR2.0 it is very apparent that the vast majority of the new features in LR2 over LR1.4 are found within the Develop Module (The Develop Module contains the same engine (software code) that is the working portion of ACR.) As it is a requirement that one upgrade to CS4 to get access to ACR5 then I'm correct in stating that the majority of the new features found in LR2 will be included for free with a purchase of CS4.

                                                    >ACR5 was not and is not available as a public beta. Only select people have
                                                    had access to the beta and that was with Photoshop CS4 beta. The fact that a
                                                    beta was available to select people doesn't mean Adobe should give it away
                                                    free. If you want ACR 5 then upgrade to CS4.

                                                    I must respectfully disagree. It is my contention that ACR5 has been effectively available in Beta form for the last 2 months, under the name of LR2.0! Although not free as LR2.0 users paid for the "privilege" of being ACR5 Beta testers. It is no secret that the develop module of LR is the very same code that is ACR. My contention that LR2.0 was Beta software is based on the fact that many users, myself included, experienced major problems with LR2.0 (some continue even with the release of LR2.1).

                                                    It is now my strong belief that Adobe rushed the release of LR2 for two main reasons:

                                                    First, so as to maximize profits on Lightroom before the release of CS4. I believe this because had Adobe come out with CS4 and ACR5 first then the "new" features in LR2 (not included within the Develop Module (a.k.a. ACR5) would have not been of enough value to justify a paid upgrade and would have instead been released as LR1.5.

                                                    A second benefit with the early release of LR2 for Adobe was the platform it provided to Beta test ACR5. Adobe will sell many times more copies of CS4 than LR2 and as such it is imperative for CS4 to be as bug free as possible upon release. What better way for Adobe to make sure that the ACR5 portion of CS4 is working well than to use the Lightroom users as guinea pigs who had pay for the privilege to be test subjects.

                                                    I read today on Matt Kloskowski's Photoshop Killer tips' site that Adobe is offering a 30% discount to folks who upgrade to LR2 at the same time as they upgrade to CS4. This amounts to a $30 discount.

                                                    b Hey Adobe how's about making a discount available to those of us who sent you our hard earned dollars months ago and have been forced to serve as your ACR5 beta testers. As I've already purchased the code that is within ACR5 once when I shelled out for LR2.0 it only seems right that you not charge me a second time should I elect to upgrade to CS4.
                                                    • 23. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                                      John Joslin Level 6
                                                      You don't buy code, you buy a product license.
                                                      • 24. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                                        Level 1
                                                        >You don't buy code, you buy a product license.

                                                        Well right now what I and many others bought was a "product license" to what should have been a pre-release candidate commonly known in the software industry as "Beta" software.

                                                        I'm looking for a more substantive discussion on this important issue rather than a few lines that sound like something direct from Adobe's legal department.
                                                        • 25. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                                          JimHess-8IPblY Level 3
                                                          Robbi,

                                                          Lightroom and Camera Raw are not the same thing. Lightroom does not use Camera Raw. Yes, they utilize the same technology, but the Camera Raw plug-in is not part of Lightroom. They are separate and distinct, and they work differently.

                                                          You can try pursuing your point from now until hell freezes over, but you won't change anything. Give it a rest.
                                                          • 26. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                                            Level 1
                                                            > It is my contention that ACR5 has been effectively available in Beta form for the last 2 months, under the name of LR2.0!

                                                            Wrong. Lightroom is a separate code base that happens to share the Camera Raw pipelinenothing more. Your license to use Lightroom has ZERO to do with Camera Raw...

                                                            Your point of view is self serving and unrealistic. Lightroom and Photoshop/Bridge/Camera Raw are completely separate products. Expecting something for nothingall of the features of Camera Raw 5 being "given to you" simply because you bought and used Lightroom is foolish.

                                                            Note however, Camera Raw 4.5 (& 4.6 when it is released for final) _WILL_ process out all of the settings that may be in a file output from Lightroom 2.x. But in order to access the same tools that Lightroom 2.x require and upgrade to Photoshop CS4 and Camera Raw 5.

                                                            In any event, this is the Camera Raw Forum...not the Lightroom Forum. If you wish to be posting about Lightroom, I suggest you move your discussion there...
                                                            • 27. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                                              Level 1
                                                              My argument is based on the fact that the technology (in this case software code) within the Lightroom Develop Module and Camera Raw are in fact one and the same.

                                                              Sure they are parts of different programs and they have different user interfaces. But just like General Motors sells the same truck calling one a Chevrolet and another a GMC does not mean that they are not principally the same product.

                                                              I've heard Adobe engineers state on numerous occasions that the software within the Develop Module in Lightroom is the very same code (they called it the engine) that is found within Camera Raw. Sure it looks different but the real working part of the code is the same. Just as a person can change the look and feel of the Firefox browser by changing its theme so too has Adobe changed the look and feel of ACR vs. LR to the end user while doing the exact same operations (with a few minor exceptions) beyond the view of the user interface.

                                                              I'll drop my argument as soon as Adobe comes out and states for the record that they have not made any changes to ACR5 as a result of debugging LR2. Fact is they will never do it because without ACR Lightroom is nothing more than a jazzed-up database with print and web modules attached.

                                                              Don't take me wrong, I like LR2.1 (with the hope that Adobe will continue to debug it) and I wouldn't mind upgrading my CS3 extended to CS4 but I don't think I should pay for the very same technology/software/ACR engine twice especially after working with what was tantamount to beta software for two months.
                                                              • 28. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                                                ArrrBee Level 1
                                                                No but Robbie is correct that ACR will support all of the LR 2 features in
                                                                version 5. It has too. I really don't think Adobe wants the backlash they
                                                                would get if when someone did something in LR 2 and then wanted to take that
                                                                over to Photoshop via ACR 5 and things didn't make it over. Historically, LR
                                                                develop and ACR have been completely feature compatible and as one of the
                                                                people that has, has used and still uses Photoshop CS4 Beta with ACR 5 I can
                                                                tell you that the features are there. Now, I will say right now that except
                                                                for a few instances LR 2's user interface for them seems cleaner and more
                                                                friendly. But, everything is there in ACR 5. I have had no problems editing
                                                                LR 2 edited images in ACR 5 with everything I adjusted in LR showing up. I
                                                                just happen to like the interface in LR 2 better than ACR, but that has been
                                                                the case always and is nothing new for ACR 5.

                                                                Robert
                                                                • 29. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                                                  ArrrBee Level 1
                                                                  Jeff Schewe brings up something that I didn't get from the OP. If you are
                                                                  expecting ACR 5 for free without upgrading to CS4 simply because you bought
                                                                  LR 2.x then you are wrong. You bought LR 2.x and not ACR nor the right to
                                                                  use or access ACR. ACR comes with Photoshop or one of the creative suites
                                                                  (because they include Photoshop). So if this is what you were after then you
                                                                  are dead wrong, Jeff is correct.

                                                                  ACR 5 was never in public beta. ACR 2 was in public beta but only one beta
                                                                  version was released to the public, later beta's were not.

                                                                  Robert
                                                                  • 30. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                                                    ArrrBee Level 1
                                                                    Robbie your way of thinking about LR and ACR if applied to your car thinking
                                                                    would mean that if you bought the GMC you would have a right to any other
                                                                    vehicle that was based on the same technology. That isn't the case. You
                                                                    can't do that. Just like your license for LR doesn't grant you a right to
                                                                    ACR 5 simply because they use the same underly technology. You got what you
                                                                    bought and nothing more and nothing less.

                                                                    If we take your way of thinking further then companies would have to
                                                                    completely rewite software each and everytime other wise you would have a
                                                                    right to use the new version without paying simply because the underlying
                                                                    technology is the same. This not a legitimate expection, it is not the fact
                                                                    of life and it isn't going to happen. Get used to it now otherwise your just
                                                                    in for a world of hurt.

                                                                    It should also be pointed out that should you get a beaver up your bum about
                                                                    this and decided to just get a copy of the ACR plug-in from someone with CS4
                                                                    it won't work with anything other than CS4. You pay for what you use, you
                                                                    use what you pay for. If you don't like that then I suggest you look in to
                                                                    something like Rawtherepee which is a free raw processing program.

                                                                    Robert
                                                                    • 31. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                                                      Level 1
                                                                      I've never said free (although that would be one way to solve the problem because if ACR5 was free then I could not make the claim of having bought the code already.) but rather I'm thinking more along the lines of a discount for those who purchased LR2.0. The very same discount that is currently available to to those who waited to purchase LR2 at the same time as CS4 as seen here:

                                                                      Get 30% off Lightroom 2 when purchased with Photoshop CS4 software
                                                                      Purchase a full or upgrade version of Adobe Photoshop Lightroom 2, along with a full or upgrade version of Photoshop CS4, Photoshop CS4 Extended, or Creative Suite® containing Photoshop CS4 or Photoshop CS4 Extended.

                                                                      https://store1.adobe.com/cfusion/store/index.cfm?store=OLS-US&view=ols_prod&category=/Appl ications/Photoshop&distributionMethod=FULL&nr=0&trackingid=DRIMA
                                                                      • 32. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                                                        Level 1
                                                                        > If we take your way of thinking further then companies would have to
                                                                        completely rewite software each and everytime other wise you would have a right to use the new version without paying simply because the underlying technology is the same. This not a legitimate expection, it is not the fact of life and it isn't going to happen. Get used to it now otherwise your just
                                                                        in for a world of hurt.

                                                                        This is the reason for upgrade pricing. Software companies can't and don't charge full price for upgrades because customers have already purchased much of the same code when they bought access to previous versions. Customers aren't stupid they know that every time an upgrade comes out they are essentially buying 80% of the code over and over.

                                                                        My car analogy was to illustrate how the same product can be called two different things while essentially doing the same thing. Another way to look at the car analogy would be for me to make the claim that Chevy if they acted like Adobe would require me to purchase a new truck every 18 months because they stop providing spare parts for their old models.

                                                                        Let's face it we all know we'll have to upgrade sooner or later whether it's CS4 or CS5; the real question is how fair is Adobe being to its paying Lightroom and Photoshop customers with regard to how much it charges for said updates.
                                                                        • 33. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                                                          Level 1
                                                                          >Let's face it we all know we'll have to upgrade sooner or later whether it's CS4 or CS5; the real question is how fair is Adobe being to its paying Lightroom and Photoshop customers with regard to how much it charges for said updates.

                                                                          Lightroom updates from 1.x to 2.0 were $99. Photoshop upgrades to CS4 are $199 (about the price of an original Lightroom license). Whether or not Adobe offers any "specials" is up to Adobe, but just because you bought the Lightroom 2 upgrade, I fail to see ANY valid logic behind your position of wanting Camera Raw 5 "because it's the same code". Sorry, you are way, way out in left field.
                                                                          • 34. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                                                            Level 1
                                                                            I suppose that if enough of us "Left Fielders" decide that we'll just skip CS4 because we feel that we were "used" with regard to being guinea pigs for the development of of a functional version of ACR5, then perhaps that will be a simple enough logic for everyone to follow.

                                                                            I love how people who don't have any valid response to my arguments try to respond by telling me to "drop it", tell me I'm "out in left field", State that I'm "self serving" (even though I paid for something that was not ready for prime time), that I'm not even in the correct forum (even though I carefully picked this thread based on the fact that the person starting it is also upset with a cost issue of ACR5), that I have not bought anything but a "license" (what that has to do with anything I'm not sure). And to top it off I've been warned to forget about piracy because a pirated version of ACR5 will not work by itself. I was told this even though I'm a PAYING CUSTOMER.

                                                                            After some of the crass remarks on this forum I can see why so many people ignore the legitimate marketplace and resort to the underground world of file sharing services. Bootlegged copies come with no support and licensed versions come with the privilege of paying to be a Beta tester.

                                                                            What really gets my goat is the fact that there are people who have been running pirated copies of LR2 who will now be able to go legit for less money than those of us who played by the rules from the start. Go figure.
                                                                            • 35. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                                                              Level 1
                                                                              >I suppose that if enough of us "Left Fielders" decide that we'll just skip CS4 because we feel that we were "used" with regard to being guinea pigs for the development of of a functional version of ACR5, then perhaps that will be a simple enough logic for everyone to follow.

                                                                              Hey, knock yourself out bud...upgrade, don't upgrade...no skin off my nose. But I kinda think if you get more than a party of one in your "Left Fielders" club, then about the only thing that will happen is you won't have Photoshop CS4...the threat to go out and use a bootleg is pretty empty to me.
                                                                              • 36. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                                                                ArrrBee Level 1
                                                                                You didn't buy the code. You bought a license to use Lightroom 2.0. Nothing
                                                                                more nothing else.

                                                                                robert
                                                                                • 37. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                                                                  ArrrBee Level 1
                                                                                  The problem is I don't think there are as many of you thinking like you do
                                                                                  as you think. In all my time in this and other forums I can't remember every
                                                                                  reading anyone that felt they should have a secondary program for cheap or
                                                                                  free simply because it uses the same code as a product they bought. ACR is
                                                                                  for Photoshop and Bridge, it does not and will not work with LR. What is in
                                                                                  Lightroom is the technology that makes up the non-user portion of ACR that
                                                                                  is it and it is built-in. You bought a license to use Lightroom. You own
                                                                                  nothing and you only bought a license. Read it if you think otherwise.

                                                                                  Given that ACR 5 will not work with CS3 or Bridge CS3 or any program older
                                                                                  than than it would do you know good even if Adobe e-mailed you the ACR 5
                                                                                  plug-in. In fact if you don't believe this just wait until the first update
                                                                                  to ACR 5 and download it and try to get it to work with CS3 or older. It
                                                                                  won't. Not just because Adobe fixed it so that it wouldn't but, because
                                                                                  changes have been made that require the code changes in Photoshop and Bridge
                                                                                  CS4.

                                                                                  As for discount pricing. If you have a version of Photoshop like CS, CS2 or
                                                                                  CS3 you can upgrade to CS4 for a very fair price. Expecting anything more is
                                                                                  just spit in the palm of your hand.

                                                                                  Robert
                                                                                  • 38. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                                                                    JimHess-8IPblY Level 3
                                                                                    I think what we have here is a troll. I just wish someone would shut him off, or at least close this thread.
                                                                                    • 39. Re: ACR 5 - Only with CS4 - Color Me Upset
                                                                                      Level 1
                                                                                      The problem with you folks is that you only know how to call people names.

                                                                                      If someone is not a member of the Adobe-can-do-no-wrong-club then you consider them to be far out and a troll.

                                                                                      I'll close by stating your beloved Adobe from their own web site:

                                                                                      Get 30% off Lightroom 2 when purchased with Photoshop CS4 software
                                                                                      Purchase a full or upgrade version of Adobe Photoshop Lightroom 2, along with a full or upgrade version of Photoshop CS4, Photoshop CS4 Extended, or Creative Suite® containing Photoshop CS4 or Photoshop CS4 Extended.

                                                                                      and my thoughts for the narrow minded:

                                                                                      What really gets my goat is the fact that there are people who have been running pirated copies of LR2 who will now be able to go legit for less money than those of us who played by the rules from the start. Truth hurts but I guess if you think Adobe can do no wrong then it's hard to see the truth.

                                                                                      If I end up on another thread or forum discussing this real issue please do me and the rest us paying ACR5 beta testers a favor and keep your small minded comments and petty name calling to yourself.

                                                                                      For those folks who are wanting to look at this issue in more depth might want to read all the posts here with special attention to #51 and #52:

                                                                                      http://www.scottkelby.com/blog/2008/archives/2033#comments
                                                                                      1 2 Previous Next