9 Replies Latest reply on Mar 8, 2009 1:45 PM by MacWright

    Sharpen in "workflow options" and "Detail" tab

    MacWright Level 1
      how does the sharpen within workflow options relate to the sharpening applied within the detail pane?

      Does one override the other or would the sharpening be additive?

      thanks.
        • 1. Re: Sharpen in "workflow options" and "Detail" tab
          Greg Barnett Level 2
          The workflow settings are for output sharpening based on the final destination of your rendered file. In the detail pane youre applying capture sharpening to compensate for the initial loss of sharpness inherent to the capture process. If you use the both, the effect will be cumulative. But as far as I know (Eric or Jeff please correct me if Im wrong), the output sharpening will not be visible in CR unless you reopen the file that was created via the output settings.

          Greg
          • 2. Re: Sharpen in "workflow options" and "Detail" tab
            MacWright Level 1
            thanks greg,

            I was just being curious ( and lazy not to test it : )

            I probably would never use the workflow settings, especially since they are not well defined settings, and I assume for "general" office work...

            eventually I though the curiosity did get to me and as you mentioned the sharpened is cumulative

            >the output sharpening will not be visible in CR unless you reopen the file that was created via the output settings.

            this is also true.

            regards

            j
            • 3. Re: Sharpen in "workflow options" and "Detail" tab
              Level 1
              >I probably would never use the workflow settings, especially since they are not well defined settings, and I assume for "general" office work...

              Then you would be wrong...the output sharpening in the workflow settings are based on PixelGenius' PhotoKit Sharpener and are designed to be optimal for fine are ink jet printing...this is the same functionality found in Lightroom 2.2 and above.
              • 4. Re: Sharpen in "workflow options" and "Detail" tab
                MacWright Level 1
                Hi Jeff

                Instead of "well defined" I should have said well documented. The only info that I could find in the PS docs were:

                "Sharpen For Allows you to apply output sharpening for Screen, Matte Paper, or Glossy Paper. If you apply output sharpening, you can change the Amount pop-up menu to Low or High to decrease or increase the amount of sharpening applied. In most cases, you can leave the Amount set to the default option, Standard."

                no mention of inkjet, photokit sharpener etc, is this documented somewhere else?

                thanks

                j
                • 5. Re: Sharpen in "workflow options" and "Detail" tab
                  Level 1
                  >is this documented somewhere else?

                  Nope...not yet.
                  (other than in Real World Camera Raw for CS4)

                  :~)
                  • 6. Re: Sharpen in "workflow options" and "Detail" tab
                    MacWright Level 1
                    since we have evolved into paperless documentation with the exception of great books such as:

                    http://www.amazon.com/Real-World-Camera-Adobe-Photoshop/dp/0321580133

                    : )

                    >..not yet.

                    Is the documentation for the Adobe products ever updated mid release or is it usually fixed in virtual stone until the next version.

                    thanks

                    j
                    • 7. Re: Sharpen in "workflow options" and "Detail" tab
                      Ramón G Castañeda Level 4
                      The documentation for CS4 is online and updated continuously sporadically ;):

                      CLICK HERE
                      • 8. Re: Sharpen in "workflow options" and "Detail" tab
                        Bill_Janes Level 2
                        >I probably would never use the workflow settings, especially since they are not well defined settings, and I assume for "general" office work...

                        In my opinion, the workflow options for output sharpening in ACR are rather awkward to use. One advantage of parametric editing is that the edits are stored in the ACR database or in the XMP file in a compact form without the necessity of large and possibly multilayered TIFF files. After making the required edits, one has repurposable masterfile that can be used for derivative images.

                        However, when one uses the ACR output sharpening, the dimensions of the image and the resolution must be determined in advance. One then has an output file that is suitable only for printing that specific image, and repurposibility is lost.

                        Furthermore, the output sharpening in ACR requires the setting of the resolution in pixels per inch. When printing to a relatively large output size, one usually renders the image at the native resolution of the camera and then sets the image dimensions of the picture without resampling. In the ACR workflow one must manually calculate the needed output resolution from the intended output size in inches and the native resolution of the camera in pixels.

                        For example, if one is using a Nikon D3 camera with a resolution of 2832 x 4256 pixels and wants to print on super B paper with a short axis dimension 12.5 inches, it is necessary to predetermine the required resolution in pixels per inch by dividing 2832 by 12.5 to obtain the needed resolution of 227 pixels per inch. One enters this value in the ACR dialog box.The result is an image that is suitable only for printing at that size.

                        Personally, I would prefer to use ACR to make a repurposable masterfile which can later be resized and output sharpened as necessary. Currently, I use PKSharpener for this purpose.

                        It would be nice to be able to store several possible output options in the XMP file or database, and this is currently not possible. For example, one might want to store settings for 8 by 10 or 11 x 14 inch prints.
                        • 9. Re: Sharpen in "workflow options" and "Detail" tab
                          MacWright Level 1
                          >In my opinion, the workflow options for output sharpening in ACR are rather awkward to use

                          I agree, I'm sure that the PK method that is used in the ACR workflow is OK, but I'm never ready to output directly from ACR and without testing as to what the limited settings actually do, there just isn't enough info or visual feedback to know what's happening, or as you indicate is it appropriate for the destination printer, rez, output size etc. I took a look at the PK documentation as a standalone looks very good, I can see why you've incorporated it on the backend of the process.

                          regards

                          j