13 Replies Latest reply on Aug 17, 2007 12:53 PM by JimHess-8IPblY

    Poor Quality

      I took some photos with a Canon G3 4.0 mp camera. I used RAW for the first time because this was a once in a lifetime shoot.

      I opened them in Photoshop CS3 (windows) RAW and they were just horrible. They were very pixelated and fuzzy and the color was way off. I have taken a lot of photos with this camera and have never seen such awful pictures. I used RAW so that I would be able to fix them no matter what. BUT, they just don't improve.

      Is there anyway I can send the photo to someone and they can tell me what I did wrong in RAW or PSC3?
        • 1. Re: Poor Quality
          Dirk Williams Level 1
          I'd like to take a look:

          monsterpup at lycos dot com
          • 2. Re: Poor Quality
            Panoholic Level 2
            I analyzed a DNG image converted from a G3 and found, that the DNG converter has not found/identified the WB setting. If the DNG converter does not know the raw data of this camera enough, then ACR won't be different, I guess.

            If this is the case with your image, then the solution is simple: adjust the WB to your liking.
            • 3. Re: Poor Quality
              Dirk Williams Level 1
              I opened it up in ACR. The first thing is you need to adjust the white balance. The image it self is a little underexposed. You can fix that with the "Exposure" slider. It doesn't look like the flash was strong enough. Also go to the "Saturation" slider and take down the Reds a little bit.

              What ISO did you shoot this at? It looks like a little noise reduction could help. Don't over do it

              Otherwise the images looks about right under the conditions it was shot and the camera you used.
              • 4. Re: Poor Quality
                Level 1
                I shot at 100 ISO. Thought that I would have little noise at 100. How come when I try to crop it and enlarge it a bit, it's so fuzzy? I thought 4.0 megapixels was enough for 8x10s.
                • 5. Re: Poor Quality
                  ArrrBee Level 1
                  4MP is enough for an 8x10 but you are cropping the image which means you are
                  cropping away part of that 4MP. If you are doing an extreme crop then what
                  you have left is then not enough for an 8x10. This is the problem a lot of
                  people have when they buy a camera. They ask is this enough resolution for
                  such and such a size print, the sales person says yes which is 100% true,
                  but then you buy the camera and then crop away half the image and then
                  complain that you aren't getting good results. This is why even when an 8,
                  10 or 12MP camera might be over kill for someone wanting to do an 8x10 if
                  they never crop it is very useful when they do want to crop.

                  You don't say how much you are cropping, but at the full MP size from the
                  camera you have just enough for a good 8x10. If you crop off too much then
                  you will get the poor results you are experiencing. If you are trying to
                  crop the image to get rid of something you don't like then instead of
                  cropping I would suggest that you try a couple of things.

                  1. Try cloning it out with the clone tool.

                  2. If you can't or don't want to do that then try creating a mask over the
                  area and blurring it making it look like it was out of focus. This way it
                  isn't annoying but doesn't kill the printing ability.

                  3. If you still want to crop then print smaller.

                  Robert
                  • 6. Re: Poor Quality
                    Mathias Vejerslev Level 2
                    Also, you'll want to keep in mind that when dealing with RAW images, its up to you to deal with all parameters regarding image processing. You'll see more noise in a 'straight' RAW file than in an in-camera JPG because the camera will apply processing to the JPG file before saving it - including de-noising.
                    • 7. Re: Poor Quality
                      ArrrBee Level 1
                      Also keep in mind that with some cameras that in camera de-noise is not very
                      good. A good example is the Venus III engine in the Panasonic FZ50. It does
                      a horrible job. So while RAW maybe more work to get a good image the control
                      you have over getting the good image is invuluable.

                      Robert
                      • 8. Re: Poor Quality
                        01af Level 1
                        This will not really help the original poster---but just recently I shot a few frames with a Canon PowerShot G3 in raw mode, and the images came out just perfectly with ACR 3.7. By the way, the old G3 still is a great little camera; I wish I had one (the one I used was not my own).

                        -- Olaf
                        • 9. Re: Poor Quality
                          Level 1
                          What is ACR 3.7? In Camera Raw 4.1, my camera profile name says "ACR 2.4."

                          Can somebody tell me how to "de noise" in Camera Raw? Or is this something I do in Photoshop?

                          Please excuse my lack of knowledge, but I am new to Photoshop and even though I've had my G3 for a long time, I am ashamed to admit that most of the time I just point and shoot and download the photos and that's that. Now I'm trying to learn things, etc., so when I upgrade to a DSLR, it won't be a foolish waste of money.

                          Thanks, Jeannine
                          • 10. Re: Poor Quality
                            JimHess-8IPblY Level 3
                            Jeannine,

                            In the details section of ACR 4.1 (Adobe Camera Raw 4.1) there are a couple of adjustment sliders for luminance and color noise reduction. If they don't do a lot for you it might be necessary for you to noise reduction with Photoshop or with a third party software program like Neat Image or Noise Ninja. To use those sliders effectively you need to be looking at your images at 100% or higher.

                            ACR 3.7 is Adobe Camera Raw version 3.7, which is only compatible with Photoshop CS2. ACR 4.1 is the most recent version of Adobe Camera Raw, and it is only compatible Photoshop CS3 and the later versions of Photoshop Elements.

                            The one thing you have to remember about working with raw images is that none of the in camera noise reduction technology or sharpening or saturation settings affect the raw image. You are getting the "raw" image data, and it is your responsibility to do all of the image processing that is required. Because of this, sometimes the images do have more noise. And you have to be prepared to make all the necessary adjustments to make the image look the way you want it to.

                            The reason your camera profile says ACR 2.4 is because that is the version when your camera model was added, and there have not been any additional profiles added since. There are a few cameras that have more than one profile and users of those cameras have the option of selecting which profile to use.
                            • 11. Re: Poor Quality
                              Level 1
                              Thank you so much for your answers to my questions. Just one more (at least for now!): When I use the sliders in ACR (in sharpening and noise reduction), nothing adjusts until I stop the slider, unlike other sliders in PS. So I can't see an affect until after I've changed a setting. Then if I want to go back to my previous setting, I don't know where it was. Is there a trick to working with sliders in ACR that I should know about?
                              • 12. Re: Poor Quality
                                JimHess-8IPblY Level 3
                                The standard Photoshop undo command (Ctrl+Z) should work.
                                • 13. Re: Poor Quality
                                  ArrrBee Level 1
                                  Noise reduction in all of Adobe's products in my opinion suck. If you need
                                  good noise reduction and it is something you are going to need often then
                                  invest on one of the Adobe Photoshop noise reduction plug-ins. I like Noise
                                  Ninja or Neat Image both are very good and can remove nearly all of the
                                  noise with very little image quality issues.

                                  ACR 3.7 is version 3.7 of Adobe Camera Raw (ACR). The profile 2.4 I believe
                                  is the specific profile for your camera and the 2.4 indicates that the
                                  support for the camera was added in ACR 2.4. Since we are now at ACR 4.1 the
                                  support for that camera has been around for quite sometime.

                                  Robert