28 Replies Latest reply on May 13, 2008 1:24 AM by PECourtejoie

    Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge

    01af Level 1
      How stupid is THAT!? ACR 4.4, hosted in Bridge, gets me black images with a white pattern for raw files and solid-black images for DNG files. So are thumbnails displayed in Bridge. Switching back to ACR 4.3.1 resolves the issue. So does hosting ACR 4.4 in Photoshop. Strangely, a raw file opened with ACR 4.4 in Photoshop now offers three profiles (rather than one): "ACR 2.4," "ACR 4.4," and "Embedded." What is "Embedded" supposed to mean? And why does ACR 4.4 in Bridge, displaying a solid-black image, offer "Embedded" only but neither "ACR 2.4" nor "ACR 4.4"?

      Anyone experiencing the same problems? For now, I am back to ACR 4.3.1 :(

      Windows XP SP2, Minolta MRW files (and DNG files created from those via DNG Converter 4.3.1) from Konica-Minolta 7D.

      -- Olaf
        • 1. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
          Ramón G Castañeda Level 4
          Olaf,

          Did you remember to
          b PURGE the Bridge cache
          for each folder through the Tools menu after installing ACR 4.4.?
          • 2. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
            01af Level 1
            Sure I did.

            But first---it didn't help. And second---when switching back to ACR 4.3.1, no purging of the cache or resetting of the preferences is required. Neither was for any ACR update before.

            -- Olaf
            • 3. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
              Thomas Knoll Level 2
              Olaf:

              Can you post a screen shot of what you are seeing when Camera Raw is hosted by Bridge?
              • 4. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                01af Level 1
                Thomas Knoll wrote:
                > Can you post a screen shot of what you are seeing
                > when Camera Raw is hosted by Bridge?

                Yes, sure. Here we go:

                1st screenshot---A folder with MRW files. The files have been augmented with metadata a few weeks ago, using Bridge with ACR 4.3.1 installed. The XMP files are there along with the MRW files. Please note that with ACR 4.4 installed, Bridge now says, "Supports XMP: no". Also note that Bridge also grayes out the "Open in Camera Raw ..." instruction from the menu. The cache for the current folder has been purged and re-built; so has the entire cache (have tried both).
                See http://www.ulrix.de/res/pool/acr_4-4/Bridge_ACR_4-4_01.jpg

                .
                2nd screenshot---A folder with DNG files. The files have been created from the MRW files in the previous screenshot a few weeks ago, using Adobe DNG Converter 4.3.1. The small thumbnails are there, but the preview window shows nothing but a solid-black box. Note that Bridge recognizes the XMP support here. Also note that exposure data and focal length are displayed under each thumbnail (not so in the 1st screenshot, even though the preferences are the same). Bridge will allow to open these files in Camera Raw hosted by Bridge (not visible in this particular screenshot). By the way, DNG files are way too pink---they always were (i. e. it's not an ACR-4.4-specific problem).
                See http://www.ulrix.de/res/pool/acr_4-4/Bridge_ACR_4-4_02.jpg

                .
                3rd screenshot---The plot thickens! Another folder of MRW files. This is the folder I was playing with yesterday. For some reason, it does display the thumbnails properly now---it didn't yesterday (cache not yet re-built after switching from ACR 4.3.1 to ACR 4.4; I took this screenshot before the other two above) but the preview window already is defective. So is XMP support.
                See http://www.ulrix.de/res/pool/acr_4-4/Bridge_ACR_4-4_03.jpg

                .
                4th screenshot---This is the same folder as in screenshot #3 after re-building the local folder's cache. Unlike yesterday (and unlike screenshot #1 ... go figure!), the thumbnails are there but all of sudden, most of them show a red "MF" (which I HATE!), and the preview windows shows an image but in a distorted aspect ratio. The metadata as well as XMP support are still missing. The "MF" seems to indicate manual focus (and indeed I did focus most of these shots manually)---but I detest this obtrusive way of indication! I never saw this before in any of my shots. Please make it go away!
                See http://www.ulrix.de/res/pool/acr_4-4/Bridge_ACR_4-4_04.jpg

                .
                5th screenshot---This is the same folder as in screenshot #4 after purging the whole cache entirely. Now the preview window shows the proper aspect ratio. The metadata and the XMP support are still missing. And Bridge won't allow to open this file in Camera Raw (even though it does recognize the Document Type as Camera Raw Image).
                See http://www.ulrix.de/res/pool/acr_4-4/Bridge_ACR_4-4_05.jpg

                .
                6th screenshot---A folder with DNG files (too pink again). The files have been created from the MRW files in the previous screenshot a few weeks ago, using Adobe DNG Converter 4.3.1. Similar to screenshot #2 and unlike the respective folder containing the MRW files (see screenshots #3, #4, and #5), metadata and XMP support are there, the preview windows shows a solid-black box, and it's possible to open the file in Camera Raw hosted in Bridge.
                See http://www.ulrix.de/res/pool/acr_4-4/Bridge_ACR_4-4_06.jpg

                .
                7th screenshot---Now this is what happens when actually opening a DNG file with Camera Raw hosted in Bridge. You'll get a solid-black image. Note the histogram that is reflecting a solid-black image, too. Also note the contents of the profile selection combo-box which offers "Embedded" only but neither "ACR 2.4" nor "ACR 4.4" (the Konica-Minolta Dynax 7D is supported since ACR 2.4). In contrast to this, ACR 4.4 will open both MRW files and their DNG files just fine when hosted in Photoshop.
                See http://www.ulrix.de/res/pool/acr_4-4/Bridge_ACR_4-4_07.jpg

                -- Olaf
                • 5. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                  01af Level 1
                  And oh, by the way: Since ACR 2.4, I have installed all updates of Camera Raw on my machine, including two beta versions, and never had any issues so far.

                  Of course, I also have installed all the updates of Photoshop, Bridge, DNG Converter, Asset Services, Version Cue, Device Central, Help Viewer, ExtendScript Toolkit, and Stock Photos.

                  -- Olaf
                  • 6. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                    Thomas Knoll Level 2
                    Can you try purging the Camera Raw cache? (Pick Camera Raw Preferences.. from Bridge and purge the cache using the controls in the Camera Raw preferences dialog box).
                    • 7. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                      01af Level 1
                      You mean,
                      b again?
                      It was the first thing I tried after first noticing the issue ... or actually, the second (the first being re-building the local folder's cache only).

                      After purging and re-building the local folder's cache didn't help, I purged the cache entirely via the preferences dialog box. After that didn't help, I purged the cache entirely again, this time via Ctrl-Alt-Shift at start-up time, then ticking the "Purge Cache" option. After that didn't help, I pressed Ctrl-Alt-Shift at start-up time again and then ticked all options. All to no avail.

                      That's where I am now ...

                      -- Olaf
                      • 8. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                        Ramón G Castañeda Level 4
                        Try the Purge Cache command through the Tools menu in Bridge:

                        Tools > Cache > Purge cache for 'foldername',
                        b folder by folder.
                        At least on the Mac, the global Purge cache commands in Bridge are broken. Only the one in the Tools menu works.
                        • 9. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                          Ramón G Castañeda Level 4
                          Thomas,

                          As long as I have your ear on this subject:
                          >Pick Camera Raw Preferences.. from Bridge and purge the cache using the controls in the Camera Raw preferences dialog box

                          The global Purge Cache command in Bridge preferences is broken on the Macintosh version. It has been discussed publicly and privately with Bridge engineers.

                          After using that global command, the cache does NOT rebuild properly. For instance, if you have a Date Created info line under your thumbnails in the Contents pane, using the global purge cache command deletes the info, and it DOES NOT come back after the ccache rebuilds. You have to go through the Tools menu.
                          • 10. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                            Ramón G Castañeda Level 4
                            There are also reports on the Bridge Macintosh forum of users who have had to use that Tools > Cache > Purge command
                            b twice
                            and
                            b even three times,
                            before the cache corruption disappears entirely.

                            Cache management in Bridge is the Achilles heel of the program.
                            • 11. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                              Thomas Knoll Level 2
                              Ramon:

                              Please do not hijack threads just because you think it is a way to "get my attention". If a post is not relevant a current thread, it an abuse of the forum.

                              Olaf:

                              Just to be clear, there are two caches--The Bridge cache, and the Camera Raw cache. They are completely separate. I was making sure that you purged the Camera Raw cache as part of your testing. The Camera Raw cache can only be purged from inside the Camera Raw preferences dialog.
                              • 12. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                                Ramón G Castañeda Level 4
                                Thomas,

                                Sorry. From my point of view, it was directly relevant to this thread if not to the content of your last post. My bad.
                                • 13. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                                  01af Level 1
                                  Thomas Knoll wrote:
                                  > ... there are two caches--The Bridge cache, and the Camera Raw cache.

                                  Oops! You're right, I confused the two.

                                  In order to avoid any cache purging problems, I now simply navigated to the folders containing the caches and entirely deleted their contents manually---both the Bridge cache and the Camera Raw cache. Result: now *all* folders containing MRW files look like screenshot #1.

                                  Yesterday, after playing with ACR 4.4 I reverted back to ACR 4.3.1. Today, I switched to ACR 4.4 again in order to create the screenshots. Obviously, the thumbnails I was wondering about in screenshot #3 had been created, and cached, by ACR 4.3.1 yesterday evening.

                                  I guess DNG thumbnails keep being displayed because they are stored right inside the DNG files, right? By the way, when selecting a DNG file in Bridge then the preview windows will display a proper (albeit unsharp) preview briefly which then turns into the solid-black box after a second or so. The DNG files were created with "JPEG Preview: None".

                                  I asked if others are seeing the same issue in two other forums. It seems I am the only person experiencing this problem. But why? My Photoshop installation isn't unusual, it's located at the default location, and I never had this kind of problem before. I don't have any CS3 applications besides Photoshop. The last things I did to my installation was manually updating Flash Lite 3.0 for Device Central, ExtendScript Toolkit 2.0.2, Help Viewer 1.1.198, and Start Meeting 1.0.1 for Bridge (in this order). Bridge is set to generate Quick Thumbnails only. I don't use "Automatically Export Caches to Folders When Possible". However I have moved both the Bridge cache as well as the Camera Raw cache to a non-standard location long ago---which never was a problem so far. Could it be now? After purging the cache, both Bridge and Camera Raw re-fill the correct (i. e. shifted) cache folders, as they should.

                                  Hey wait---I just deleted the caches (both) *again*, manually. And now all the folders containing MRW files look like screenshot #5! How weird is that!? I changed nothing; only half an hour has passed. Obviously Bridge does not find the cached data (as I deleted it), so it re-builds the cache, as displaying the thumbnails is slow. At least it *does* find meaningful thumbnails now (adorned with "MF"). The shifted Bridge cache gets filled with new files; the Camera Raw cache remains empty.

                                  In any case, Bridge won't let me open MRW files in Camera Raw hosted in Bridge. I can open DNG files but they will show up as solid-black boxes only. Opening them through Photoshop (i. e. through Camera Raw 4.4 hosted in Photoshop) works just fine and does fill Camera Raw's shifted cache folder with new files.

                                  -- Olaf
                                  • 14. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                                    01af Level 1
                                    Update:

                                    Oh, great. Now I purged the caches again, but this time not by manually deleting the cache folders' contents directly. Instead, I used the "Purge Cache" pushbutton in Bridge's Camera Raw Preferences dialog, then the "Purge Cache" pushbutton in Bridge's own Preferences dialog. Result: now all folders containing MRW files look like screenshot #1 again.

                                    It looks like ACR 4.4, hosted in Bridge, does not support the Dynax 7D anymore. Hosted in Photoshop, it does.

                                    -- Olaf
                                    • 15. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                                      Thomas Knoll Level 2
                                      Have the tried re-downloading Camera Raw 4.4 and reinstalling. It sounds like the plug-in itself might have been corrupted somehow (which seem strange is is working inside Photoshop, but slightly different calling paths are used, so a corrupted plug-in is possible).
                                      • 16. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                                        01af Level 1
                                        Here in Germany, it was late in the evening when I posted my last article, so I logged out and went to bed. In the meantime, ACR 4.4 has been withdrawn due to some other bugs. So I cannot re-download right now.

                                        But thank you very much for listening anyway, Thomas! I shall re-download ACR 4.4 as soon as it becomes available again. Until then I'll use ACR 4.3.1. Fortunately I am not dependent on the new cameras' support (not yet).

                                        [EDIT: Just found out that ACR 4.4 actually isn't taken down as of now. So I just re-downloaded but it doesn't make a difference. Same issues as before. So the theory of a corrupted file seems unlikely.]

                                        -- Olaf
                                        • 17. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                                          Thomas Knoll Level 2
                                          Olaf - Send me an email. I would like to continue to try to get to bottom of this.
                                          • 18. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                                            dfranzen_adobe Level 3
                                            Olaf,

                                            Do not use the Purge Cache button in the Bridge Preferences; it is known to cause problems.

                                            It sounds like you already know how to do it, but the following TechNote has instructions for how to clear Bridge CS3's cache manually:

                                            http://kb.adobe.com/selfservice/viewContent.do?externalId=331083&sliceId=1

                                            Thank you,
                                            David Franzen
                                            • 19. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                                              01af Level 1
                                              Update:

                                              I just installed Camera Raw 4.4.0.79 on my other machine which is a three-year-old notebook with Windows XP Pro SP2, 1 GB RAM, and Photoshop CS3 with all the latest updates installed. Guess what---all the problems with MRW files I reported above are absent! ACR 4.4 is working just fine on the notebook, no matter whether it's hosted in Photoshop or Bridge.

                                              So obviously it's not the Dynax 7D files which are causing my problem. Instead, it's something about my machine. The only significant difference I can think of (besides one being a desktop PC, the other a notebook) is that on the notebook I already have deleted Stock Photos CS3. On the desktop machine (i. e. the one making troubles), Stock Photos CS3 still is present.

                                              -- Olaf
                                              • 20. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                                                Hi,
                                                I'm new to this forum and have a question I can't find the solution to (although I've read others have the same issue). I have CS3 Extended. In Adobe Camera Raw there is a menu under the camera calibration tab. Clicking that shows two versions of camera raw: 2.4 and 4.4. Why?
                                                I have only ONE camera raw plugin: 4.4 located in Program Files>Common Files>Adobe>Plugins>CS3>File Formats>Camera Raw >4.4.0.79.
                                                Thank you,

                                                Paul
                                                • 21. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                                                  Omke Oudeman Level 5
                                                  The 2.4 indicates the first version of ACR that was used for the default profile for your camera and the 4.4 is the second time that the default profile was set by Thomas Knoll, the creator of ACR. He upgraded every profile for all the cameras again when 4.4. was released. You should select this one since it it is the improved version for your digital camera.

                                                  BTW, there was a new release for ACR 4.4, it is now 4.4.1. You could also update to this one.
                                                  • 22. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                                                    Level 1
                                                    Hi,
                                                    Wow! that was a quick reply...thank you so much. Yes, I have updated to the latest version. I do note, however, that 2.4 is shown by default and I have to manually select 4.4..not a real problem I guess.

                                                    Cheers,

                                                    Paul
                                                    • 23. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                                                      Omke Oudeman Level 5
                                                      >not a real problem I guess.

                                                      No :-)
                                                      • 24. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                                                        JimHess-8IPblY Level 3
                                                        If you want the 4.4 version to be the default, just open one of your raw images in ACR. Go to the Camera Tab and choose the new profile. If you like the rest of the camera defaults, don't change anything else. Then, just save new Camera Raw defaults. At least that is all I had to do.
                                                        • 25. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                                                          01af Level 1
                                                          Jim Hess wrote:
                                                          > If you want the 4.4 version to be the default ...

                                                          Actually, the ACR 4.4 profiles will be the default, umm, by default. You need nothing to do to make them the default; they already are. If you encounter raw files which don't seem to use the ACR 4.4 profile then those files have been tweaked under another profile (e. g. with an older version of Camera Raw). With those files, Camera Raw will, by default, always re-use the profile that was used before. To change it, you'll have to switch profiles explicitly.

                                                          For new raw files, the ACR 4.4 profiles will always be the default.

                                                          And oh, just for the records: Camera Raw 4.4.1 now is working flawlessly, no matter whether it's hosted in Bridge or Photoshop, on all my machines.

                                                          -- Olaf
                                                          • 26. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                                                            JimHess-8IPblY Level 3
                                                            Yes, it was my understanding that new files would automatically use the new profile. But when I took a few raw images and converted them to DNG during transfer from the camera, they still came up with the old profile. Just for your information, DNG converter version 4.4.1. For some reason I couldn't get them to default to the new profile until I saved new camera raw defaults. Might be a problem with my computer, I don't know.
                                                            • 27. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                                                              Tesselatir Level 1
                                                              I have the Konica Minolta A2 and my MRW files don't show up at all! Nothing! Just the application data icon. I use GraphicConverter for quick viewing MRW files so that's the icon I get in Bridge CS3. Clicking on the icon in Bridge CS3's Content listing to see a preview in the Preview window just shows me another copy of the icon in the Preview window. I think it's interesting that GraphicConverter can load the images directly and show image icons in it's browser and even Mac OS X can show a preview icon (image icon) of the MRW files but Bridge CS3 can do neither load nor show image icons. :(

                                                              I'm looking for a way to fix this situation. If anyone finds a solution please post it up here.

                                                              Thanks!
                                                              • 28. Re: Camera Raw 4.4 doesn't work when hosted in Bridge
                                                                PECourtejoie Adobe Community Professional
                                                                Tessy, you posted in a thread about Camera Raw 4.4. I guess that you have trouble with that peculiar version?

                                                                Did you try updating Camera Raw to 4.4.1?