9 Replies Latest reply on Aug 5, 2008 2:15 PM by MadManChan2000

    Creative use of CC calibraton in the DNG Profile Editor

    Level 1
      The DNG Profile Editor can be used to create profiles that mimic film looks.

      I think right now it is manual trial & error process involving changes in hue, saturation and lightness, but it could be theoretically achieved with Color Checker calibration working in reversed order.

      - Photograph the CC using your favorite film
      - If B&W, develop in your favorite developer
      - Scan the film
      - Use the scan in the DNG Profile Editor as target values

      The current DNG Profile Editor obviously does not allow that, it would require adding a new tab and clone the CC calibration feature and alter it to use the photographed values as target values as opposed to internal values.

      I don't know if it would be worth the effort, but I thing the idea is worth of sharing.

      By the way, unless I'm doing something wrong, the saturation slides don't seem to go 0%, so creation of B&W profiles is not possible.
        • 1. Re: Creative use of CC calibraton in the DNG Profile Editor
          MadManChan2000 Adobe Employee
          Hi Mirek, correct, one cannot completely desaturate using PE. This is by design. For grayscale work you are actually better off using CR's gray mixer and split toning tools and saving the result as a preset.
          • 2. Re: Creative use of CC calibraton in the DNG Profile Editor
            michael shaffer Level 1
            It would seem that once any profile recipe had created a suitably accurate profile, that the same adjustments (tone curve, hue, saturation) that had created (eg) the "vivid" profile for the Nikon D3 could be used for a different camera(?) That is, to open its recipe with a text editor -- copy the appropriate lines -- and paste them into my recipe.

            That is, wouldn't the same adjustments that created "vivid" for the D3 also be applicable to any other accurate profile?
            • 3. Re: Creative use of CC calibraton in the DNG Profile Editor
              michael shaffer Level 1
              > ..., wouldn't the same adjustments that created "vivid" for the D3 also be applicable to any other accurate profile?

              If the above were true, it occurred to me while in the shower that the following might prove to be easier, less prone to error, and conceptually more straightforward:

              (1) To use DNG PE to open (eg) the "Nikon D3 Camera Vivid beta 1.dcpr" recipe (... if I were to somehow obtain it) ...
              (2) Then to reference it to my E-3 "colorimetric accurate" base profile ...
              (3) And finally to export it as "Olympus E-3 Camera Vivid.dcp"

              Not having the Nikon recipes keeps me from trying this -- plus the fact that I've undoubtably oversimplified the innards of DNG PE -- but it would seem to be a logical use of 'recipes' relative to 'base profiles'(??) If so, can these recipes be made available?
              • 4. Re: Creative use of CC calibraton in the DNG Profile Editor
                MadManChan2000 Adobe Employee
                Michael, Tutorial 2 of the PE shows you how to share recipes across multiple cameras:

                http://labs.adobe.com/wiki/index.php/DNG_Profiles:Editor#tutorial_share
                • 5. Re: Creative use of CC calibraton in the DNG Profile Editor
                  I wanted to create a "Kodachrome" color profile. I don't even have a film camera, so I couldn't just shoot a Macbeth chart on Kodachrome. My steps:

                  1. Download and install the demo of Alien Skin's "Exposure" plugin, which purports to emulate film stocks.

                  2. Shoot a ColorChecker, and apply the "Kodachrome 25, no grain" filter to it.

                  3. Save as a TIFF, load in Camera Raw, turn into a DNG.

                  4. Load DNG into the Profile Editor and calibrate from that chart. This creates settings to UNDO the "Kodachrome" effect.

                  5. Invert all the settings.

                  6. Save the recipe and load it up with a real DNG raw file from my camera. Tweak some things visually and add a tone curve for a little contrast.

                  7. Export the profile.

                  I quite like the result.
                  • 6. Re: Creative use of CC calibraton in the DNG Profile Editor
                    Level 1
                    Can you post some place a before and after sample?
                    • 7. Re: Creative use of CC calibraton in the DNG Profile Editor
                      Level 1
                      Good idea. Yes, I've posted an example on my Flickr.

                      I chose a picture with good reds and yellows. There are four images in the set:

                      1. The original, untouched image. This is using the new Adobe Standard beta profile, brought into Lightroom with all default settings, including linear tone curve, no exposure or color adjustments, white balance "as shot", etc. For reference.

                      2. The image with my test profile applied, but no further adjustment.

                      3. My original attempt at the image, using the "old fashioned" pre-DNG-profiles raw processing method, for reference. The yellows are orangeish, which isn't that objectionable but also isn't accurate. The reds are weaker than I would like.

                      4. The "final" image, with my test profile plus additional tweaks -- white balance, tone curve for contrast, crushing out the blacks a bit more, etc. Two or three minutes of total processing, versus quite a bit more for the previous attempt with no "special" profile. The reds and yellows are perfect.

                      The Flickr set:

                      http://flickr.com/photos/100mph/sets/72157606547890574/

                      This was just a first, pretty quick attempt at playing with the DNG Profile Editor. I'm sure it can be tweaked more and even more can be accomplished.

                      [Edit: note: I changed the "upload date" on the test images so they wouldn't stay at the top of my Flickr page. Ignore the 2007 date, it doesn't mean anything.]
                      • 8. Re: Creative use of CC calibraton in the DNG Profile Editor
                        michael shaffer Level 1
                        > Tutorial 2 of the PE shows you how to share recipes across multiple cameras ...

                        Thanx for making DNG PE all that it is! The tutorial implies that the adjustments that would create "vivid" are in the recipe. That particular recipe for the Nikons wasn't included with the PE installation. Are these Nikon & Canon example recipes available?

                        Just as a curious aside -- Why did Adobe make these special profiles for Canon & Nikon, when it appears that you could have distributed "as near colorimetric accurate" profiles for all supported cameras in the 'standard profile', as well as a distribution of the "special" recipes that could be applied to any camera for all users who wanted them?
                        • 9. Re: Creative use of CC calibraton in the DNG Profile Editor
                          MadManChan2000 Adobe Employee
                          Hi Michael, only the profiles themselves are available, not the recipes. The Camera Matching profiles for Canon/Nikon were created in response to requests to be able to have colors from CR/LR that are similar to those in DPP (for Canon) and NX (for Nikon). The CM profiles have nothing to do with colorimetric accuracy; they're only purpose is to match (or at least closely approximate) the DPP/NX color renditions.