16 Replies Latest reply on Sep 26, 2008 4:42 PM by Jim_Simon

    adjusting smartsound track length

      I must admit, I'm very, very dissapointed by the way the smartsound tracks are working in Premiere Pro CS3 (at least, as I don't know any other Premiere versions). I'm used to Pinnacle Studio's behaviour, where, after adding a Smartsound track to a timeline, you can drag it's end to adjust the length. No matter whether you shorten or lenghten the track, the music always finishes nicely with the ending tones and there is no intermediate step of creating a wav fle. (After all, if it is a wav file, as in CS3, it is all over: you can cut it at any moment, and can not make it longer). The beauty and the "smartness" stems from this very behaviour (in Pinnacle): dragging the end marker and adjusting the length directly on a timeline.

      b It is really very sad this smartsound feature is not implemented/used by CS3 :(
        • 2. Re: adjusting smartsound track length
          Level 1
          Jim, hate to say this, but if you bother to open/read/replay to a thread, could you be more specific? "Tell them" - that is who?
          Another point: I really miss this feature, so in replies I'm more interested in getting others opinions: Is it common feeling or am I alone? When opening your reply, I expected exactly this: someone's opinion on the feature described. But thank's anyway. Unfortunately, alone I'm not that mighty to tell "them" what to do. But if there are many of us...
          • 3. Re: adjusting smartsound track length
            the_wine_snob Level 9
            Grzegorz,

            Unfortunately, this is the way that the QuickTracks plug-in for Premiere is implemented. It does not work the same way that SmartSound QuickTracks works in some other NLEs.

            Until recently, the QT plug-in also crashed PP, because of the WAV display in the Timeline. That was corrected in an update.

            What Jim is referring to is to contact SmartSound on how their plug-in works in Premiere. It is their implementation of it, that causes the behavior that you commented on.

            Now, let's hold our breath, because SmartSound just released SonicFire Pro 5, their flagship music program. It is possible that QTs will be changed to add this feature. Also, QTs is not included as part of P Elements 7, so users do not need to install a separate plug-in, just like in Pinnacle. Does this mean closer integration with P Elements? Likely. Does it mean closer integration with Pro too? Possible.

            Back when I started with Pro, after using many versions of Pinnacle Studio, one had to BUY QTs for US$99. It soon became a free plug-in, though not without some problems.

            I've just upgraded my SFP 4.5 to 5, which features closer integration with FCP (Mac), and I'm exploring how well it flows with Pro.

            I hope that SmartSound makes some major changes in their plug-in for Pro. I'd suggest e-mailing their customer support dept. I can tell you that they are quite friendly, responsive, helpful and really care about users, who have any problems. If they see that enough users want and need this implementation, I'm sure they'll do what they can to get those changes into the next release of the plug-in, which should come soon on the heels of SFP 5.

            Personally, I'd love to see SFP 5 (a much more robust program, than the QTs plug-in) built into Pro. Now THAT would be great.

            BTW, SmartSound is having a "sale" on 6 of their discs right now. It's basically buy 2.5 of these and get the other 2.5 free. I also anticipate other sales in October, as has been their pattern.

            Links:
            http://www.smartsound.com/music/index.html
            http://www.smartsound.com/company/contact.html

            Hunt

            [Edit to add] You can also stretch, or compress the SmartSound Track in QTs inside of Pro, but it is a couple of clicks and drags, plus re-rendering of the Track. Not as easy as inside of Pinnacle, but very doable. Explain that you want it work the same, as with Pinnacle. If enough request it, and it's possible, they will issue an update.
            • 4. Re: adjusting smartsound track length
              Jim_Simon Level 8
              >Tell them" - that is who?

              The makers of the software you're complaining about. I don't have an opinion myself, but you seem to. So, let them know.
              • 5. Re: adjusting smartsound track length
                Andrey V Level 2
                If you have Smart sound file on the time line double click it and you will get the dialog that lets you chose the music style and the file length, after this length change you will be able to stretch your music on the time line.
                The one and the only big reason why it is different from Pinacle Studio is this. Premiere works more with time code of the video and audio then studio does. And if you know that in studio you cannot look at the audio timecode, in premiere you can. So that's why this is so different from program to program, its a time code of an audio file implementation.
                • 6. Re: adjusting smartsound track length
                  the_wine_snob Level 9
                  Big User,

                  Your method is how I handle a change in my SmartSound Tracks. It's an extra click, or two, but no biggie. Thanks of explaining why there is a difference too - I had never thought of that, only accepted that is was different. The only thing that I dislike about the Premiere way, is because I use the SmartSound default naming convention and the initial Duration appears in the file name. I then change the Duration, by your stated method, and the file's Duration changes, but the name remains the same, i.e. SmartSound Ramp It Up [00:25:12] might end up being [00:22:12], when it's done. This does not adversely affect Premiere in any way, because the file is linked in the Project Panel. However, if I go through my existing Movie Music folder, looking for Ramp It Up and see [00:25:12], I'll soon find that it's really 00:22:12, because I changed it's Duration. Of course, I can change it again, or just re-do it too. Ain't no deal-breaker for me.

                  Also, with SonicFire Pro 5, I think I'll be doing more work in it, than in QuickTracks, especially if I'm using a piece from their Strata or Backstage collections. I just hope that one day IT gets ported as a plug-in for Premiere. Heck, Deko-title was once a standalone and now we have Titler, so I can dream and hope.

                  Hunt
                  • 7. Re: adjusting smartsound track length
                    Level 1
                    Thank you both for the comments and explanations. I would still prefer to drag the track's end on the timeline, but double clicking and readjusting the length is not that difficult.
                    b Is there any easy way to measure the time span, to enter it after double clicking on ss track? I know, I can subtract ending and starting timepoints on a calculator, but is there any way to somehow mark the starting point with the slider, then move to the desirable end of the clip and have a difference displayed? Or better yet, copy it and paste into ss dialog box?

                    Thanks
                    Grzegorz
                    • 8. Re: adjusting smartsound track length
                      the_wine_snob Level 9
                      Grzegorz,

                      The Info Panel will give you much of that information. You can place the CTI where you want it and display a good deal about your Clips, the total Duration and other, but I don't really know of a simple method. Most bit-rate calculators also have a Time Code function, so the match is simplified. Do not know about any Copy/Paste though.

                      I'd like to be able to place Markers at each end and get a reading of the Duration between them, but do not think that is possible, without subtracting in a Time Code calculator. Maybe I'm wrong and Eddie, or someone else, will correct me, and then I'll feel dumb. That might be something for a Feature Request.

                      Hunt
                      • 9. Re: adjusting smartsound track length
                        Curt Wrigley Level 4
                        > Is there any easy way to measure the time span, to enter it after double clicking on ss track?

                        Put the work area bar over the section you want to measure, then simply hover your mouse over the center of the work area bar and it will show you the length in time of the bar.

                        Curt
                        • 10. Re: adjusting smartsound track length
                          the_wine_snob Level 9
                          The WAB! Why did I not think of that? Thanks Curt. How simple and how dumb of me to not think of it. OK, maybe that will the only "duh-moment" of my day... well, here's hoping.

                          Greatly appreciated - WAB huh? Dang!

                          Hunt
                          • 11. Re: adjusting smartsound track length
                            Jim_Simon Level 8
                            Here's a better way, since the Work Area Bar won't go back to automatic adjustments (which I like) after you make any manual adjustments.

                            Set appropriate In and Out points in the sequence, and you can see the duration under the program monitor. Then just CTRL-Z twice to get rid of the markers.
                            • 12. Re: adjusting smartsound track length
                              Steven L. Gotz Level 5
                              >the Work Area Bar won't go back to automatic adjustments ...

                              I figured out how to solve that once, now I just have to find the reference material, or figure it out again. As I recall, it is a search and replace issue in the text file.
                              • 13. Re: adjusting smartsound track length
                                Steven L. Gotz Level 5
                                I had to figure it out again.

                                If you accidentally move the WAB, and you want to reset it, close Premiere Pro and then in a XML editor or Wordpad, search for "WorkBarAdjusted" and change it from "true" to "false".
                                • 14. Re: adjusting smartsound track length
                                  Jim_Simon Level 8
                                  Nice tip. (But it should happen by default when double-clicking on the WAB, or some other inside method.)
                                  • 15. Re: adjusting smartsound track length
                                    Steven L. Gotz Level 5
                                    Jim,

                                    I believe that the Adobe people decided that if you changed the duration of the WAB, it would be rude of them to automatically change it. So perhaps a menu item available through a right click?

                                    If we start asking for it now, we might get it in CS5, you think?
                                    • 16. Re: adjusting smartsound track length
                                      Jim_Simon Level 8
                                      A menu item, a double click, I'm not fussy. Just some way within the Premiere GUI to make it happen.