26 Replies Latest reply on Nov 11, 2007 3:54 PM by mickkeay

    photo dvd question

      I am trying to make a DVD for my photos in premiere. I found that the quality of the photos are quite bad in the DVD. What should I do to keep the best quality of the photos when making DVD?

      Thanks!
        • 1. Re: photo dvd question
          Harm Millaard Level 7
          DVD is limited to 720x480 resolution. Nothing can be done about that.
          • 2. Re: photo dvd question
            John T Smith Adobe Community Professional & MVP
            Not 100% sure about this, but I seem to remember reading somewhere that a video is actually about 72dpi

            So even a 300dpi picture loses a LOT of information when it is converted into a video
            • 3. Re: photo dvd question
              Ruud Blauw Level 1
              Video isn't any "dpi" (dots per inch) as there are no inches in video. The only thing that matters for video are the dots (pixels).
              • 4. Re: photo dvd question
                Harm Millaard Level 7
                John,

                Ruud is absolutely correct. Just imagine a video frame. Does the resolution change when displaying it on a 7 inch monitor or on a 65 inch monitor? If your assumption about dpi were correct, imagine the resolution required for a large screen.
                • 5. Re: photo dvd question
                  Level 1
                  You have to define "quite bad". In my experience the photo I include on a DVD are "quite good". Just as good as any Photo Gallery that you get on a movie DVD. Are yours worse then that? If so this is not normal. Give us some details on how you use the photos to go to a DVD. How do you make them fit? What settings are you using to obtain the coded output? And so on. Also Encore has a SlideShow option. Have you try using this. Is it any better?
                  • 6. Re: photo dvd question
                    Level 1
                    Thanks for the replying. I am fairly new to the premiere. Actually there are more questions.

                    1. some of the photos need rotate 90 degrees, right now what I can do is set rotation in motion effect. it is tedious to do one by one, is there anyway that I can just set one photo and copy the effect to all other photos that need rotate?

                    2. I set the project property that photos will be scaled to fit when added to timeline. It looks fine but in the actual output the photos seems a little bit distorted: the person's face is wider than actual. What setting did I mess up?

                    3. After I set a nice transition between two photos, how do I copy the same transition to other photos?

                    Thank you!
                    • 7. Re: photo dvd question
                      Harm Millaard Level 7
                      1. Copy and Paste Attributes.

                      2. Scale to frame. Leave that off and use scale in the Motion effect.

                      3. Set as default and use CTRL-D.
                      • 8. Re: photo dvd question
                        Phil Griffith Level 2
                        it would be easier to rotate your images before you import into premiere. You can do that in windows photo gallery or if you have it, photoshop. any photo editing program will do it tho.
                        • 9. Re: photo dvd question
                          Level 1
                          Harm and Phil, Thanks very much!
                          • 10. Re: photo dvd question
                            Eddie Lotter Level 4

                            You will also find links to many free tutorials in the Premiere Pro Wiki that will quickly show you how things are done in PPro.

                            Cheers
                            Eddie


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                            • 11. Re: photo dvd question
                              the_wine_snob Level 9
                              Here's a question that pertains to quality with a "rotated" image:

                              How close to Photoshop's highest quality algorithm is the one in Premiere? There will be interpolation, when the image is rotated. Id suspect that PSs system works about as well as can be expected. Anyone ever made a comparison?

                              Were the images mine, Id do all of the work (rotation, and whatever else was required) in PS, at the highest rez possible, then do a Save_As (all can be called from a custom Action), to a separate folder. Id then size, set PAR, etc., with another Action to a finals folder, which Id then Import into Premiere. Ill go and check to see if I can find any noticeable difference between Motion>Rotate in Premiere and doing the same in PS.

                              Hunt
                              • 12. Re: photo dvd question
                                Ruud Blauw Level 1
                                >There will be interpolation, when the image is rotated.

                                Why would there be interpolation when an image is rotated? As long as the dimensions don't change, the rotated image should be unaltered. Just rotated. :p
                                • 13. Re: photo dvd question
                                  the_wine_snob Level 9
                                  There are a very few newer algorithms that allow for lossless rotation, but up to CS2, PS did not have one. I do not know about APP. With most digital image programs, interpolation takes place as pixels are displaced, in this case through rotation. I have yet to upgrade to CS3, so I cannot speak from direct experience there. Adobe might well have used a lossless rotation scheme. Now, the degradation will be minimal, but will be there. In the tests that I ran, I could not tell any difference, whether the image was rotated in PS, or in Premiere, but I was only viewing the results on a 21" CRT monitor.

                                  As a test, Open an image in PS and hit Ctrl-T (Free Transform), then Rotate. [Note: you may have to dbl-click on the Layer, if it is the
                                  i Background
                                  Layer]. Hit Enter (or dbl-click within the Bounding Box) to accept the Rotation. Repeat the process several times. Save_As a new name, and Open the original image. Compare the two very carefully. You will see the degradation. Now, Im usually working on very high-rez still images for ads, so the degradation can create real problems. I could not see the changes in Premiere. Maybe a factor of the smaller image, or a newer algorithm.

                                  I also could not find which form of interpolation Premiere uses, but would assume that it is at least bicubic. PS (as of CS) allows for bicubic, bicubic-smoother and bicubic-sharper (as well as a few flavors of nearest-neighbor).

                                  Hunt
                                  • 14. Re: photo dvd question
                                    Ruud Blauw Level 1
                                    Bill,

                                    I think you are looking at the result of saving in a lossy compression format rather than image degradation caused by the rotation itself. (As long as we are talking about rotating 90, 180 and 270 degrees.)

                                    There are techniques for rotating JPEG images so that they don't need to be recompressed when you save them after rotating.

                                    When you do your test and save in a uncompressed format like TIFF you should find that the original and the rotated version are identical.
                                    • 15. Re: photo dvd question
                                      the_wine_snob Level 9
                                      The tests were all run using PSD format. The image quality loss comes from the interpolation of the new pixels, not from a loss due to compression algorithms. This is one of the reasons that all Transforms should be done at one time and not several in different stages. Even Adobe recommends that one use an un-do (Ctrl-z) and try again, rather than incremental Transforms. It is also why Adobe implemented several different algorithms for the interpolation Modes - nearest neighbor, bicubic (several flavors), etc. Now my tests have not been on strict coordinates, i.e. 90/180, but usually only a few degrees of rotation, usually to correct for a vertical, or horizontal diviation of but a few degrees.

                                      Again, I do not know the inner workings of CS3, or of the Motion>Rotation in PP. Maybe things are different now, or within PP.

                                      All of my tests have also been done on very high-rez images in PS (through CS2), so the mileage might vary with newer programs, and at video rez, might not be a noticable issue, even on newer TV monitors.

                                      Hunt
                                      • 16. Re: photo dvd question
                                        the_wine_snob Level 9
                                        Rudd,

                                        To enhance my knowledge of the processes in PP, do you happen to know the algorithms used? I'm basing all of my comments on PS (before CS3), and would appreciate any insights into how PP does the "math." Again, at video rez, it might be a moot point, due to the lower-rez and smaller size of the image.

                                        Thanks,
                                        Hunt
                                        • 17. Re: photo dvd question
                                          Ruud Blauw Level 1
                                          Bill,

                                          Because the OP was talking about 90 degrees rotation, I assumed we were discussing that. You are absolutely right that anything else than multiples of 90 will cause degradation.

                                          I have no idea which algorithm is used by PPro.
                                          • 18. Re: photo dvd question
                                            I just created a slideshow in Encore recently as an additional element on a DVD. Jun- if you have Photoshop (or any image editor really) do all your image editing there and try to always work with a lossless file format like tiff. With jpegs every time you save the file you lose information. The images in the slideshow I made look excellent and all I did was [after the image was edited to my liking] resize each image as a high quality jpeg at 1600x900 and using 'save for web' I set a compression level of 85. The resulting images were less than a mb each and like I said, they look great. Once all the images were ready I imported them into Encore as a slideshow. From there you can set your transitions, timing, music, etc. It's very intuitive. It would be fairly simple to create an automated [batch] action in Photoshop to resize an entire folder of images all at once, assuming the aspect ratios are all the same.
                                            • 19. Re: photo dvd question
                                              Level 1
                                              I beg to differ on the capability of Encore to produce good quality slideshows. I often include a photo galery on the DVD I produce. It cost little to add even the photos taken by other participants in the event. The quality is very good and the customer is very pleased to have all these mementos. I could not do it if I had to edit the photos beforehand: the cost would be prohibitive.
                                              • 20. Re: photo dvd question
                                                mickkeay Level 1
                                                Has anyone had to scan in multiple photos> I have been given a bunch of 5x7 prints to include in a project and I am wondering what resolution to scan and save them to before importing into PP.
                                                • 21. Re: photo dvd question
                                                  Level 1
                                                  Scanning with 200 ppi produce good results for regular DVD resolution. Some scanner even let you scan 4 pictures at a time (one in each corner) and save the result in individual files. I use BMP output but JPG should be OK. Of course if you need to zoom in the photo wthin PPRO then you have to scan at a much higher setting.
                                                  • 22. Re: photo dvd question
                                                    mickkeay Level 1
                                                    Thanks Pierre - What scanner does the 4 at a time - that could be a real timesaver? I AM hoping to move and zoom around them in PP so will experiment with the scan settings. I have been here before and cant remember my settings - but I do remember coming to the conclusion that high dpi settings and BIG JPEGs that resulted didnt actually make the end result on the DVD much better - but I cant remember the optimal setting. _ I must write stuff down!! Thanks again
                                                    • 23. Re: photo dvd question
                                                      Level 1
                                                      I have the HP Scanjet G4010 which does that with Windows XP. If you have Vista make sure you get the new software and drivers. As for scan settings it makes no sense to scan with a higher resolution then the pixel count of the original photo. For exemple if the original take was 2592x1944 pixels, that translates to about 350 ppi. So a 300 ppi scan will be close to the optimum. Of course the transfer to a print has reduced the resolution somewhat depending on the quality of the printing process (always assuming that the photo was printed from a digital camera).
                                                      • 24. Re: photo dvd question
                                                        mickkeay Level 1
                                                        Will check it out. I notice quite a few have that feature now (time to upgrade) The photos are not mine. I think they were taken with a 35mm SLR film and just printed at local shop a few years ago. They dont look as if they were taken with a very good camera either! So I guess 300dpi would be a good place to start the scanning tests. Cheers Mike
                                                        • 25. Re: photo dvd question
                                                          Steven L. Gotz Level 5
                                                          I think that Photoshop can do that for you automatically from any scanner.
                                                          • 26. Re: photo dvd question
                                                            mickkeay Level 1
                                                            Thanks guys - Yep its Automate / Crop and straighten in Photoshop. It then straightens them up and opens each one in a new window - ready to save. Pretty cool