20 Replies Latest reply on Jul 16, 2007 9:04 AM by (natem)

    Why is the exported file size so small?

      Hello!

      I just spent the last few days watching about three hours of Adobe Premiere Pro CS3 tutorials and almost all five hours of the Adobe Encore CS3 tutorials on Lynda.com with the awesome 30-day trial that I received for purchasing these two programs. I pretty much got to the end of authoring my first DVD with Encore, but the file size is so small that it doesn't even take up the full size of a single-layer DVD and I was expecting to be using double-layer DVDs.

      Here's why I didn't post this in the Encore discussion: My two file sizes are 10GB and 8GB. I have them both as single timelines in Premiere Pro and exported them each to Encore. But why does the file size decrease to just over 1GB for each of the files in the Export to Encore option in Premiere Pro CS3?

      I begin a brand new project in Premiere Pro, import the 10GB .avi, and then do the Export to Encore with "DVD Double Layer", "Author with Menus", "Entire Sequence", "NTSC High Quality" with the quality level switched from 4 to 5, Video Codec = "MainConcept MPEG Video", 720x480, 29.97 drop frame, Lower, Standard 4:3, VBR, 2 Pass, the default bitrate settings of Minimum Bit Rate = 1.5, Target Bit Rate = 4, Maximum Bit Rate = 7, and then whatever GOP Settings are set to M Frames = 3 and N Frames = 15. Without any video editing at all, it estimates the file size at 1.7GB.

      If my goal is to get the file sizes closer to 4GB and 3.5GB, can I fiddle with any of these settings without screwing up the ability for all DVD players to read my disc? I thought it would probably be ideal to have them closer to 7GB and 6GB, and then let Encore downgrade the quality to fit all of the content on the DVD with very little room to spare. But why is there no default to keep the video resolution at the absolute best possible?

      Should I be exporting to a Movie instead of exporting to Encore?

      Thanks!
      Matt
        • 1. Re: Why is the exported file size so small?
          Harm Millaard Level 7
          The trial does not support exporting to MPEG, which is needed for DVD's. Second, if you have a 10 GBV AVI that amounts to around 46 minutes. No use to use a DL, a single layer is quite sufficient with 8 Mbps CBR settings.
          • 2. Re: Why is the exported file size so small?
            Level 1
            What do you mean by "the trial"? I paid $699 for the upgrade. Oh, I see. By the trial, I meant the 30-day free bonus to Lynda.com that I got with buying the two programs. I am not running trial versions of Premiere Pro or Encore.

            And I am trying to fit 43 minutes and 56 seconds of one show in a single timeline and 39 minutes and 18 seocnds of another show all onto the same DVD.

            Thanks!
            Matt
            • 3. Re: Why is the exported file size so small?
              John T Smith Adobe Community Professional & MVP
              I have been learning with Pro2 and now Pro3 and Encore3 for about a month by digitizing a lot of OLD movies on VHS before they stop playing (some are already losing video & sound quality) so your 44 + 39 = 83 minutes is right in the general area I've been doing

              A 90 minute movie is just about 20gig of AVI and that goes down to just about 4.3gig when I create an ISO to burn to DVD... this is with Encore3's automatic setting

              So... I think your 83 minutes should create a compressed file of just about 4-to-4.2 Gig
              • 4. Re: Why is the exported file size so small?
                Level 1
                Well, that's the problem. It's only 3.2GB! :) I don't know if I should mess around with the bit rate to increase the video quality or if I should just leave it alone.
                • 5. Re: Why is the exported file size so small?
                  John T Smith Adobe Community Professional & MVP
                  When I was working with Pro2 and creating "simple menu" DVD's I spent a lot of time adjusting the transcoding settings to get the best possible quality... by changing the bitrate in the 2-pass VBR area until it was "just barely" under the point where Pro2 told me there was not enough space to create the DVD (actually, I always create an ISO so I can use a different burning program)

                  Now that I've installed Pro3 and Encore3, I export DV AVI out of Pro3 and then let Encore3 do the transcoding... using the Automatic setting so E3 does all the work of figuring out the best fit at the best quality

                  Unless you simply want to have that control in Pro3, just let Encore do all the work for you
                  • 6. Re: Why is the exported file size so small?
                    Level 1
                    But when you "export DV AVI out of Pro3 and then let Encore3 do the transcoding," you're not using the Export to Encore option, are you? If you're using Export -> Movie and then using the Microsoft DV AVI setting that it defaults to, don't you lose your Encore Chapter points, or are you not using any? In the Lynda.com tutorial, it mentioned something about needing to use Quicktime, Targa, or TIFF for the export if you wanted to maintain your Encore Chapter points, I believe.
                    • 7. Re: Why is the exported file size so small?
                      Level 1
                      I always create an .ISO as well. I don't know what the .ISO writing capabilities are in Encore, but I will probably continue to use the RecordNow! Deluxe that came with my original Sonic MyDVD 6.1 a few years ago.
                      • 8. Re: Why is the exported file size so small?
                        pmasters8941 Level 1
                        where is the 30 day trial at? Is it for just Premiere buyers or does it also count for Production Premium users as well as I dont remember seeing anything in the box.
                        • 9. Re: Why is the exported file size so small?
                          Steven L. Gotz Level 5
                          When I registered my Production Premium I got a chance to sign up for Lynda.com for 30 days, or a few other possibilities I don't remember anymore.

                          And yes, increase the data rate until you get to just over 4GB and you should be happy.
                          • 10. Re: Why is the exported file size so small?
                            Level 1
                            Patrick,

                            After I installed and registered my software, I received this email twice for both Premiere Pro and Encore, and I would imagine that it would only make sense to receive this same type of bonus for Production Premium:

                            "Thanks for registering - claim your benefit today.
                            Adobe Systems Incorporated [adobe@adobecs3.com]

                            Thank you for purchasing and registering your copy of Adobe Premiere Pro CS3. You now have a wealth of creative tools at your disposal. While taking advantage of online and printed resources we also encourage you to select a complimentary benefit. At Adobe we want you to get the most out of your software it's our commitment to you.

                            Check out Adobe Bridge Home*, a feature of Adobe Bridge CS3.
                            Get access to product tips, training videos, product news, and other creative resources all in one place. Simply click the Adobe Bridge icon within any application to get started.

                            You got it, now get more.

                            Hypatia Sans Font:
                            Developed for customers who register their Adobe Creative Suite® 3 product, these unique and stylish fonts were inspired by the 1920s and '30s. Receive Adobe's new type family (a US$169 value) for free.

                            Lynda.com Training:
                            Take advantage of a free 30-day Online Training Library® subscription, including in-depth Adobe training in easy-to-use video format.

                            Classroom in a Book® Series:
                            Deepen your skills with this series of self-paced training offering step-by-step explanations, time-saving techniques and insider tips. Receive up to a 40% discount on Adobe Press' Classroom in a Book series."

                            Thanks for the tip, Steven! I will try that now.

                            - Matt
                            • 11. Re: Why is the exported file size so small?
                              Level 1
                              Alright, I fiddled with the Target Bit Rate and that seemed to do the trick, but I couldn't get it anywhere near 4GB without putting the bit rate WAY higher than it should be, at least according to the article that I was just reading at http://www.customflix.com/Special/AuthoringNightmares/03/BitsAndBytes.jsp.

                              It says you shouldn't have your bit rate be higher than 6.5Mbps if you're using DVD+/-R media, and only a maximum of 8Mbps if you're having your discs replicated professionally. So it looks like 2.654GB is the file size that I will end up with for the first of two shows that I am putting on this DVD.

                              For our set-top DVD player, I am still using an old Sony that I got as a graduation gift in 1999, and nothing I've ever played on it has failed yet. I'm tempted to increase to 7Mbps to see what happens, but I don't have an unlimited amount of time to screw around with this right now.

                              It also says to switch from PCM audio to Dolby Digital audio to save space, but I'm not really in danger of filling up an 8.5GB disc and the file size doesn't adjust at all when I select it. Plus, it looks like you only get three trial uses of Dolby Digital before you need to pay to register Dolby Digital. Hmmm... is it worth it?

                              Thanks!
                              Matt
                              • 12. Re: Why is the exported file size so small?
                                Steven L. Gotz Level 5
                                I hate to say it but you are a bit confused. You said you used:

                                Minimum Bit Rate = 1.5, Target Bit Rate = 4, Maximum Bit Rate = 7

                                Take the minimum number up, and the target number up, not the Maximum number.
                                • 13. Re: Why is the exported file size so small?
                                  Phil Griffith Level 2
                                  you can export dv avi out of prem 3 and when you go into settings you can specify that your chapter points and text (going by memory here) export with the file. I used this function with prem 2 and let encore do automatic encode for me. it will work with 3 as well.
                                  • 14. Re: Why is the exported file size so small?
                                    Steven L. Gotz Level 5
                                    Even though exporting to DV AVI and letting Encore do the transcide may lose a generation of quality, it is still the easiest and most common method.

                                    It is certainly worth trying.
                                    • 15. Re: Why is the exported file size so small?
                                      Level 1
                                      I was originally using the defaults that were set for me:

                                      Minimum Bit Rate = 1.5, Target Bit Rate = 4, Maximum Bit Rate = 7

                                      Since then, I've switched to this:

                                      Minimum Bit Rate = 1.5, Target Bit Rate = 6.5, Maximum Bit Rate = 6.5

                                      Fiddling with the Minimum Bit Rate didn't change anything as far as file size is concerned, so I didn't think I should touch that. Would it be safe to put them all at 6.5Mbps? Or is 7.Mbps more common? Is the person writing the article on CustomFlix just a worry wort, or will my viewers have more problems with 7/7/7? :)

                                      Thanks,
                                      Matt
                                      • 16. Re: Why is the exported file size so small?
                                        Level 1
                                        Are you guys saying that it is NOT recommended to use the Export to Encore options and just Export -> Movie instead? I think I am still confused regarding that.

                                        Thanks,
                                        Matt
                                        • 17. Re: Why is the exported file size so small?
                                          Level 1
                                          Man... looking at the page source for the CustomFlix website, it looks like that article may have been written in 1998. I wish they would date their articles!

                                          - Matt
                                          • 18. Re: Why is the exported file size so small?
                                            Steven L. Gotz Level 5
                                            I would certainly raise the minimum rate to 3, and target rate to 6.5 makes some sense, with the maximum at 7. It really depends on the footage as to what the right setting should be.

                                            To be honest, I think Encore is still much better at optimizing disc space on the DVD, but you can do it manually with some experimentation.
                                            • 19. Re: Why is the exported file size so small?
                                              John T Smith Adobe Community Professional & MVP
                                              When I was using Pro2 to make simple-menu DVD's (before Encore3 and automatic transcoding arrived) I had min=3 and max=7 and then would just adjust the target bitrate a tenth at a time until the screen message went from not enough space to Ready

                                              Seemed to work OK... but just giving an AVI to Encore3 and using the automatic setting is a lot easier

                                              But... that is based on not having any chapter markers in the timeline... so I don't know the effect of having chapter markers and exporting to AVI
                                              • 20. Re: Why is the exported file size so small?
                                                Level 1
                                                Sequence markers (not Encore chapter markers, not clip markers), both numbered and unnumbered, can be exported to an AVI file, provided they have something in the Comments box.

                                                Options relating to embedding marker data in an AVI can be found under File > Export Movie > Settings > Compile Settings.