15 Replies Latest reply on Oct 13, 2008 10:19 AM by (BBGeeker)

    Title Fade In - Flashes Brightly Then Dims

      Has anyone else had this problem? I'm using PRE4 and the video is an interview. I superimposed a title (i.e. the name of the person speaking) and used the default "fade in" and "fade out" feature. When I preview it, even after it has been rendered, the title fades in gradually as expected. However, right when it gets to 100% opacity, it seems to "flash" brightly - as if it briefly went to 110% opacity for a second - then it dims back to 100% opacity (at least it says it's at 100% opacity). I have the title on screen for about 5 seconds and then it fades out, but again, right before it goes from 100% opacity to the fade out, it flashes brightly again - as if it went up to 110% opacity for a second - and then it fades out normally. I've done this with several projects and it always does the same thing. Frankly, it's frustrating. I've developed a workaround to avoid the problem, but it's a bit more tedious since it seems as if the default fades should work flawlessly. Has anyone else had this problem or is this unique to my system? Thanks for prompt responses!
        • 1. Re: Title Fade In - Flashes Brightly Then Dims
          Level 1
          As a quick follow-up, I mentioned my workaround but failed to describe it. Sorry. Here's what I've done that works: I created the titles normally and applied the default "fade in" and "fade out" effects on them. This created keyframes which allegedly went from 0% opacity to 100% opacity (for fade in) and the opposite for the fade out. However, instead of letting the keyframes get all the way to 100% opacity (since that seems to be where the bright flash happens), I moved the keyframes down a bit so the maximum opacity was 98%. By making that adjustment, the bright flash at 100% opacity never happens. The downside is that the title is only at 98% opacity, but I suspect that's something that only the video editor would notice - I don't think the viewer would notice that. Just wanted to describe the workaround. But I'm still frustrated to have to make adjustments to keyframes when the default fade in and out should work fine without that bright flash. Sure would be grateful to know if anyone else has had this problem or if it is unique to my system - and the reason I'd like to know that is b/c it might be worthwhile to reinstall the software if nobody else has the same problem. Thanks!
          • 2. Re: Title Fade In - Flashes Brightly Then Dims
            Paul_LS Level 4
            Yes this is a known bug with the titler in PE4. As you have done set the opacity to 99% and it will be fine.
            • 3. Re: Title Fade In - Flashes Brightly Then Dims
              Level 1
              Thanks, Paul! It's helpful to know it isn't just "me". :) Hope you have a great weekend!
              • 4. Re: Title Fade In - Flashes Brightly Then Dims
                I haven't had this problem in PreEl7 but haven't done too much titling yet - can anyone confirm if it got fixed for the latest version of Elements?
                • 5. Re: Title Fade In - Flashes Brightly Then Dims
                  Paul_LS Level 4
                  I tried it a number of times in PE7 and have not seen it. So I assume it has been fixed.
                  • 6. Re: Title Fade In - Flashes Brightly Then Dims
                    Level 1
                    Paul - thanks for confirmation that this was apparently fixed in PRE7. Thanks also for your suggestion of going to 99% opacity for my workaround. I tried that and it works fine. It's more "work" than it should be, but at least it works and, believe it or not, the 99% looks better than 98% did (at least to my untrained eyes). Thanks for all!
                    • 7. Re: Title Fade In - Flashes Brightly Then Dims
                      the_wine_snob Level 9
                      BBGeeker,

                      If your Titles are all on a separate Track, you can wait to adjust the Opacity until they are all done. Set the Opacity of the first (or last) to 99%, Rt-click and choose Copy, Lasso all of the others and then Rt-click and choose Paste Attributes. I find this far quicker, than doing the Opacity for each. You just have to remember to do this!

                      Note: if you have other Effects in the first (or last) Title, that you do not want in the rest, add them AFTER you have done the Copy/Paste Attributes.

                      Good luck,

                      Hunt
                      • 8. Re: Title Fade In - Flashes Brightly Then Dims
                        Level 1
                        Geez, Bill! I wish I had seen your post BEFORE I adjusted each title individually b/c your method is infinitely more efficient than what I did. My titles are all superimposed on the main video track, so the titles are up on the video2 track - which means your method would work perfectly.

                        One quick note: I tried getting the first title the way I wanted it and then copying from the timeline and pasting it where I wanted it. That doesn't work easily because PRE4 inexplicably "assumes" I want it on the main video track and never even considers that I might want it on the video2 track. Therefore, I had to paste it to the end of the main video timeline, then move it up to the video2 track, and then slide it into the right place on the timeline. Very inefficient. Yet it would be so much more logical to have PRE4 let me choose which video track I want to paste the darn thing to. Anyway, the method I described works. HOWEVER, as someone else discovered in this forum, if I then try to edit the copied title (even though I know it would affect the title I copied it from), the system doesn't like that and crashes. So if I am going to copy titles using this method, I have to be completely sure the titles are exactly as I want them b/c I know I can't expect to edit them once they've been copied from the timeline.

                        Steve Grisetti (I'm a BIG fan, Steve!) and others on this forum have noted that another way of copying titles is to "duplicate" it from the project tab (when it shows the media you've imported). Apparently, this gives you a new title that is completely independent from the original (i.e. can be edited w/o affecting the original) but is based on the original. I've found that you can then edit this title by double clicking on it in the monitor window and it doesn't crash the program. Do the same thing with a title "copied and pasted" from the timeline, and you'll crash the program.

                        It seems like it makes a BIG difference how you work with these dang titles, so it's important to understand what will work and what will cause frustration. Unfortunately, I think it seems more logical for me (and possibly other users) to "copy and paste" from the timeline rather than "duplicate" from the media bin. I'm trying to get the concepts straight in my own mind so I can make notes for myself, and if I ever get something that makes sense, I'd be happy to post it here if anyone is interested. It often seems that I'm quite a bit "off the pace" of the knowledge of everyone else here, so what I'm discovering for the first time is often something of common knowledge to the rest of the forum. (sigh)

                        All of that just to say this: Thanks, Bill, for your very helpful suggestion. I think adding your suggestion to what I was doing before would make things much more efficient. Thanks for sharing!
                        • 9. Re: Title Fade In - Flashes Brightly Then Dims
                          Steve Grisetti Adobe Community Professional
                          (It just make my day when I get quoted. Thanks, BB!)

                          You can duplicate a title so that you can edit each separately (as opposed to cloning it -- which makes a copy in which both titles change as you change one), right-click on the title in the project media panel and select the Duplicate option.
                          • 10. Re: Title Fade In - Flashes Brightly Then Dims
                            Level 1
                            It's an honor to quote you, Mr. Grisetti - especially after all the help you've given us here and other places (e.g. muvipix.com). It makes MY day that you noticed! :)

                            Seriously, I think you made an important distinction that helps clear this up. When "copying" titles, you can either "clone" a title or "duplicate" it. If you clone it, then whatever you do to one, you do to all the others; if you duplicate it, then you create a separate title that you can edit independent of the one you duplicated it from. For me, that makes a lot of sense. To clone a title, you can just "copy and paste" from the timeline. To duplicate a title, as Mr. Grisetti explained, you right-click on it in the project media panel and choose "duplicate", and it will then create a new instance of the title in the media panel.

                            Thank-you for your very helpful clarification, Mr. Grisetti!
                            • 11. Re: Title Fade In - Flashes Brightly Then Dims
                              Level 1
                              One quick clarification regarding my reply to Bill Hunt where I said I can't edit titles in the monitor window if I had previously "copy and pasted" them from the timeline b/c this would crash the program. I think I know why:

                              For efficiency, when I "copy and pasted" the titles from the timeline, I had grouped some of them so I wouldn't have to select each one individually. When I then moved them to the video2 track and slide them to the position I wanted on the timeline, I never ungrouped them. Therefore, when I saw the title in the monitor window and I tried to edit it, I was trying to edit a "group" of titles - which is not possible - so my program got hung up. In contrast, when I ungrouped the same titles and THEN tried to edit in the monitor window, it worked fine.

                              Long story short: the program crashing issue was MY fault for not ungrouping the titles before trying to edit them, and not PRE4's fault. Just wanted to clarify that I'm the idiot, not the software!
                              • 12. Re: Title Fade In - Flashes Brightly Then Dims
                                the_wine_snob Level 9
                                BBGeeker,

                                You have pointed out what I consider a poor design choice by the PE folk. I really like to be able to target my various Tracks and then do with them, as I wish. I find some of the automation to run counter to my personal workflow, but them maybe there are many more, who feel otherwise. It is "features" like this, that make me appreciate Pro even more. OTOH, I do have the luxury of having both, so I can pick and choose.

                                Glad you got it working,

                                Hunt
                                • 13. Re: Title Fade In - Flashes Brightly Then Dims
                                  Level 1
                                  Thanks, Bill! It does seem to be an odd design choice when you can't choose which track onto which you want to paste something. It runs contrary to how we work in a Windows environment since you normally can "point" your cursor to where you want something to be pasted and then paste it there. Here, if we copy something like a title (using the method Mr. Grisetti calls "cloning"), we can't choose where to paste it - instead, PRE4 automatically assumes we always want it pasted to the main video track. I guess that helps "automate" things a bit, but from my perspective, it creates a frustrating limitation that forces me to use a workaround. So I completely agree with you. I just wish I was as luxurious as you are. :) Thanks again for your helpful input!
                                  • 14. Re: Title Fade In - Flashes Brightly Then Dims
                                    Ed.Macke Level 3
                                    BBGeeker,

                                    i the program crashing issue was MY fault for not ungrouping the titles before trying to edit them, and not PRE4's fault. Just wanted to clarify that I'm the idiot, not the software!

                                    I'm a programmer, and I can assure you that it is, in fact, the software's fault! Regardless of what the user ever does, it is never, ever permissible for the program to crash. Never, ever.

                                    You are not an idiot. You may have done something that resulted in the program crashing, but it most emphatically is not your fault. It is the job of the programmers to either a) anticipate and handle every possible action, or b) make sure unhandled actions can't happen. What you did was a possible action that wasn't handled properly. Obviously! :)

                                    That isn't to say the programmers at Adobe aren't idiots, either. Premier is a horribly complex program. Grouped titles is just something that was overlooked in the program (a.k.a. "a bug").
                                    • 15. Re: Title Fade In - Flashes Brightly Then Dims
                                      Level 1
                                      Thanks, Ed, for that reassurance. I hadn't looked at it like that. I don't know if PRE4 didn't handle the grouped titles properly. I simply forgot that the titles were still grouped and tried to edit what I thought was a single title. Nothing happened. I got impatient and tried to edit it again. And then again. Still, nothing happened. That's when I probably should have realized that I was doing something wrong, but I just kept trying to edit the title and eventually the program crashed. I probably gave it too much "input" at once. I suppose it could have been prevented if an error message came up saying "you can't edit grouped titles" or something like that, but when the user gets no feedback from the machine, the user is tempted to try it again and again and again, eventually overloading the program. I understand and respect how complicated it must be to program an app like PRE4, and I think it's probably impossible to anticipate every possible situation, so all things considered, the Adobe folks did a fantastic job. Believe me, I remember the early iterations of Premiere and this is a huge improvement. I just claimed "idiot" status for not realizing that I might be doing something wrong and that's why the software wasn't responding as I expected. If I go to start my car, for example, and it doesn't turn over, I immediately look for the reason why instead of just turning the key with the same dead result each time. (This just happened recently and it was b/c I had the car in neutral rather than park. I moved the shifter to park and zooommmm, the car started right up.) I don't know why the car won't start in neutral, but it won't and I blamed myself for not having it in park rather than blaming Honda for it. Same thing applies with the Adobe folks. Overall, they did a fantastic job. There are some quirks that don't work right (e.g. a title will flash brightly then dim if you put the automated "fade in" effect on it) but generally it works pretty darn good and I genuinely appreciate having it. Thanks again for your reassurance and for explaining it from a programmer's perspective!