11 Replies Latest reply on Dec 27, 2008 5:35 PM by the_wine_snob

    PE4: Frame size increased but sound playback faster.

    Level 1
      Hi
      I've increased the frame size and exported the movie to AVI Pal 16:9 Widescreen. The movie is playbacked great but somewhere in the middle of movie, the sound playbacked faster than the movie.

      Can anyone please help me how to fix this problem? I'm using Pentium 4 3.0 G. with 2GB Ram.

      Thanks,

      Bank
        • 1. Re: PE4: Frame size increased but sound playback faster.
          Steve Grisetti Adobe Community Professional
          Which sound? The sound from the original video or music or narration that you've added later -- or all of it? If it's the original video's audio, what type of camcorder did you get this video from and how did you get it into your computer?

          Also, what do you mean by "I've increased the frame size" and how did you do it?

          And you're judging the playback from an AVI you've output? Where are you playing this AVI? Rather than Windows Media Player (which can be challenged with some AVI, import the AVI into a new Premiere Elements project and see how it plays back there.
          • 2. Re: PE4: Frame size increased but sound playback faster.
            Level 1
            It was the sound from the original video I downloaded from the internet. The original files extention was .avi and the size was about 700 MB with 120 minutes long. The pixel was 560x240. I used PE4 to export the file to Microsoft DV Avi.

            The project setting was: Pal-DV-Widescreen 48kHz
            Compressor: DV Pal
            Frame size: 720 X 576 v 16:9
            Frame rate: 25 fps
            Pixel Aspect ratio: D1/DV Pal Widescreen 16:9 (1.422)
            Quality 100%

            Audio Setting:
            Compressor: Uncompressed
            Sample Rate: 48000
            Sample Type: 16 bit
            Channel: Stereo
            Interleave: 1 second

            After the export, the picture of the output AVI is bigger and the quality is good. I've used Windows Media Player, Nero Showtime, VLC Media player to playback the output AVI. Only the problem is Video and audio are not sync. The audio is playbacked faster than the video especially in the middle of the movie. I try to import the out AVI into the new project (get media) to see how it plays, but it looks like PE doesn't support the file type.

            Please guide me how to fix this problem.

            Thks.,

            Bank
            • 3. Re: PE4: Frame size increased but sound playback faster.
              the_wine_snob Level 9
              Bank,

              Let's go back one step. What is the CODEC used in the AVI, that you downloaded? A freeware program, G-Spot (www.headbands.com/gspot) can tell you all about that file, plus which CODECs are both used in it and which are properly installed on your system. Most Audio sync problems come from DivX (or Xvid) compressed files. The "AVI" tells us nothing about what is inside that file. G-Spot will. You *may* have to convert that AVI file to DV-AVI
              b BEFORE
              you Import it into PE to get things to work properly, but we won't know that, until we know what is inside the AVI "wrapper."

              Good luck,

              Hunt
              • 4. Re: PE4: Frame size increased but sound playback faster.
                Steve Grisetti Adobe Community Professional
                Well, Hunt. It looks like the file uses a DV-PAL codec. So I don't think that's the issue.

                Do you see anything iffy in the sound specs?

                And I'm still not sure what he means by "I've increased the frame size".
                • 5. Re: PE4: Frame size increased but sound playback faster.
                  the_wine_snob Level 9
                  Steve,

                  You're correct. I had missed that, or had forgotten it. Hey, I'm still on Island time...

                  Sound specs look good to me. Right where I'd have mine. Sometimes, sample rate can change the Duration, but not to the extent that the OP describes. Besides, the sample rate is 48KHz, so no problem there.

                  I'm guessing that Motion>Scale was used to "zoom in" on the footage. That should have no effect, that I can think of. Without a speed-change or some sort of pitch-correction, I am at a loss. Kinda' like the missing middle from another poster's Audio file. You know we DID just have a full Moon, but I'm stumped again.

                  Hunt
                  • 6. Re: PE4: Frame size increased but sound playback faster.
                    Level 1
                    Bill and Grisetti,

                    Many thanks for the help. Here's the information of the downloaded AVI file I got from Gspot;
                    Size: 698 MB
                    Container:
                    Audio Frames: Aligned on Interleaves
                    Video: 612 MB (87.62%)
                    Audio: 77.4 MB (11.07%)
                    AVI Overhead: 9.12 MB (1.31%)
                    Uerdata/Metadata
                    ISFT: Virtualdubmod 1.5.4.1 (build 2178/release)
                    IAS1: English
                    JUNK: Virtualdubmod bulid 2178/release
                    USER: XviD 0047
                    Audio
                    Codec: 0x0055 MPEG-1 Layer 3
                    Info: 48000 Hz 107 kb/s tot, joint stereo LAME 3.97
                    Codec(x) installed
                    Video
                    Codec: XviD
                    Name: XviD ISO MPEG-4
                    Codec(s) are Installed
                    Pixel: 560 x 240

                    Also, please disregard " I've increased the frame size " which I mistakenly informed. Actually, I had just simply imported (get media)the downloaded AVI file to PE4 New Project. With the project setting;

                    The project setting was: Pal-DV-Widescreen 48kHz
                    Compressor: DV Pal
                    Frame size: 720 X 576 v 16:9
                    Frame rate: 25 fps
                    Pixel Aspect ratio: D1/DV Pal Widescreen 16:9 (1.422)
                    Quality 100%

                    Then, I exported it into Microsoft DV AVI file type. The output file size was approx. 22 GB.

                    Please let me know what you think.

                    Thanks,

                    Bank
                    • 7. Re: PE4: Frame size increased but sound playback faster.
                      the_wine_snob Level 9
                      Bank,

                      Look down to about line 17 of your G-Spot info. In that line, "CODEC: Xvid," I think that we might have the answer. Xvid is the open source version of DivX. It is a highly compressed format (and not as clean a compressor, as is its "cousin" DivX). Just as I initially suspected, this CODEC can play all sorts of evil tricks, when editing in any NLE.

                      My suggestion would be to convert this file BEFORE you Import it into PE. My hope is that you have not already done a bunch of editing, as that would have to be redone. The conversion format that you will want will be PAL DV-AVI with fully compliant DV Audio (PCM/WAV 48KHz 16-bit).

                      There are several good converter programs, and many are freeware. I use one that is shareware (about US$39) called DigitalMedia Converter from Deskshare, but many users here have had great results with the freeware apps. Check the FAQ at the top of the main page of this forum for suggestions, with links.

                      What often happens with both DivX and Xvid compressed files is:
                      1.) really bog down PE, because the NLE is trying to convert the file to DV-AVI
                      2.) Import with only Audio, or Video
                      3.) Audio, or Video, will truncate, and sometimes pieces from the beginning will magically appear later in the Clip
                      4.) Import will fail completely
                      5.) a simple cut will cause everything after that cut to go black, or freeze on a single frame (or sometimes with crazy pixelation) for the rest of the Duration in the Video, or cause the Audio to go really wierd after the cut (possibly what you are seeing - did you cut at about the point that the Audio speeds up?) I've seen the Audio go into a really loud "stutter loop." I can't get the headphones off quickly enough!

                      I have found it so much better to make the conversion outside of the NLE. The converter that I mentioned, DMC, will allow batch conversion, so I load it up with all non-DV-AVI Assets and turn it loose, while I set up my Project. By the time that I have all Bins, etc. done, the conversion is usually complete (I do have several heavy-duty, fast systems). The main thing that this does is take the onus off of the NLE to try to do the conversion. It also establishes a file that is all I-frame (basically, there is a physical frame for each frame in the Clip), and it will be larger, as each frame will be rendered. In the compressed form, there will be 1 I-frame, followed by 10-18 "difference frames." It's cutting on these "difference frames" that cause the most problems.

                      Last, because the material has been highly compressed already, quality will take a hit. Whether you can stand that quality hit is up to you. Where there is camera, or subject movement, you WILL see jagged edges and pixelation, plus maybe color artifacts, some of which can look horrible.

                      Good luck, and please let us know how the Project goes,

                      Hunt
                      • 8. Re: PE4: Frame size increased but sound playback faster.
                        Level 1
                        Bill,

                        Again, I'm really appreciated your help.

                        I did use DMC v2.70 from Deskshare to convert the original AVI file with the following setting;

                        DV AVI
                        Digital Video AVI type 1
                        Pal frame rate 25 frame per sec / dimension 720 x 576 pixels

                        I got the output file which is approximately 22 GB. But like you mentioned, the video quality was hit. There're lots of jagged edges and pixelation. It got even worse than the output I got from PE.

                        The audio were still not sync. At this point, I haven't imported the output file to PE since I think PE will not fix the audio problem. Do you think so?

                        What do you think it still causes the audio problem? I already did the conversion outsite PE. Also, I didn't edit or cut anything on the original video file.

                        Thanks,

                        Bank
                        • 9. Re: PE4: Frame size increased but sound playback faster.
                          the_wine_snob Level 9
                          Bank,

                          I believe that you are close. Chose DV-AVI
                          b Type 2,
                          not Type 1. Many programs have all sorts of issues with the older Type 1, usually Audio. DV-AVI Type 2 *should* fix most Audio issues. If you do not see Type 2, then you will need to get the MS DV CODEC, which you should already have, but its installation might be corrupt. DMC will only work with CODECs that one already has installed, as it ships with none of its own.

                          As for the quality hit, unfortunately, once the original file has been heavily compressed, there is nothing that can be done to get the quality back.

                          I've had some luck using a few little "tricks" that make it "look" better. I'll add Neat Video Effect to the Clips, being very careful to apply just the right amount of noise reduction - takes some time and patience to get it just right. Then, after this Effect, I'll go back with a tiny amout of Sharpening. Again, trial-n-error is the best approach, and may differ Clip to Clip. If the Clips are pretty consistant, you can add the Effects to one, Rt-click on it and choose Copy, then highlight the rest and Rt-click, choosing Paste Attributes. Even if these are not perfect for all remaining Clips, you can go into the individual Clips and tweak them. A little Color Correction might help, too.

                          Compressed source files are the bane of all video editors.

                          Hunt
                          • 10. Re: PE4: Frame size increased but sound playback faster.
                            Level 1
                            Bill,

                            Thank you so much. I've got the output file made from DMC. The output file is OK. The audio problem has been fixed. There is still a little sync problem. But I think it's ok since the original file has been heavily compressed.

                            I'd to wish you and everyone in the forum the best for the New Year to come!

                            Bank
                            • 11. Re: PE4: Frame size increased but sound playback faster.
                              the_wine_snob Level 9
                              Bank,

                              The best news is that you are almost there. Sync issues can stem from a lot of causes. With some problem sources, I've had to jog the Audio Tracks a few frames, several different times in a Timeline. When this becomes necessary, I'll use the Razor Tool to basically make smaller Clips, and by unlinking the Audio & Video, adjust these, as is necessary. In a few instances, I've had to extract little snippets of "ambient audio" from elsehwere to fill in any "blanks." However, if one is adding a music soundtrack, these are less often necessary. If the sync issues are constant, then it's easy. If there is "drift," well it's just more work, but doable.

                              Good luck on the completion of your Project and let's hope for a wonderful New Year for all !!!!

                              Hunt