1 2 3 Previous Next 87 Replies Latest reply on Oct 6, 2010 8:16 AM by Todd_Kopriva

    ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction

    tajino

      Hi, I'm having serious interaction slowness issue with CS4 and ATI radeon 3870 in Vista64 + Aero desktop composition,ATI catalyst driver 9.5.

       

      Slowness is most obvious if you a layer selected which have several keys, with motion path display on in the viewport, try moving the layer around in the viewport, it takes a second or two before any reaction. It is even worst if OpenGL always on or OpenGL interaction on, slightly better in Adaptive resolution viewport refresh.

       

      However, if motion path display is off, moving layer is noticably faster.

       

      The motion path display also causes slowdown in other areas, like zooming in and out with the ',' and '.' key in the viewport, orbiting camera, etc etc that involve viewport drawing.

       

      I've noticed also AE CS4 comp viewport doesn't get vertical sync (either with Vista Aero on or off), when you do a quick horizontal pan you'll notice tearing.

       

      I'm wondering if anyone experiencing the same issue with ATI card and catalyst driver.

       

      If ATI works for you, which version of ATI catalyst driver do you use?

       

      Thanks.

        • 1. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
          Mylenium Most Valuable Participant

          What screen resolution do you run and how is the monitor connected? HDMI? DVI? VGA? Also, what happens if you disable AEro/ switch to a different visual theme?

           

          Mylenium

          • 2. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
            tajino Level 1

            Hi Mylenium,

             

            my screen resolution : single 1920x1200 via DVI

             

            I have tried disabling Aero, switch to classic, still the same slowness, in fact it feels even more sluggish due to no desktop composition, you can even see the slow ui painting going on.

             

            Do you have any ATI graphics card + Vista64 that managed to run AE CS4 smoothly? if yes, what's the driver version?

             

            Early last year was Nvidia driver's broken GDI+ support that causes no AE CS3 ui no acceleration, and very sluggish, now it is ATI.

             

            I do not have other ATI card other than this two Radeon HD3870, now they are both crippled in CS4.

             

            Just curious if the current nvidia 285/295 drivers is working silky smooth in AE CS4.

             

            thanks for your reply.

             

             

            Tajino

            • 3. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
              Mylenium Most Valuable Participant

              My GeForce 285 is working smoothly on Vista 64... So much for that. As for your card, I'm afraid I cannott offer any real advise. I was merely asking in case we missed something. The only ATI card I evber "owned" I won in a price draw of some games mag and I sold it on eBay. Anyway, it's strange, regardless, that none of the usual steps seems to fix your driver/ display issues. Have you run DXDiag to check for any possible conflicts? Do you run any 3D programs on your system? If so, do they work correctly?

               

              Mylenium

              • 4. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                tajino Level 1

                Thanks for the nvidia 285 confirmation, I will get it now.

                 

                Dxdiag is all normal , also AE CS4 opengl reports all features supported. It must be some glitchy part of the ATI current drivers.

                 

                My main 3d app, Lightwave runs ok except some minor drawing glitches like in the graph  editor flashy scale, modeler dragnet garbled overlay etc. Which are all ok with all my older NVidia cards. Modo on the other hand works fine with ATI.

                • 5. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                  ChrisProsser Adobe Employee

                  I used to use a Radeon x1950 without any problems for a long time. I'm now back on NVidia hardware. Have you tried an older driver to see if is something that broke in 9.5?

                  • 6. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                    yann mallard

                    hello!

                     

                    i haD the same problem !...

                    QUADRO FX4500 & GeForce 8600 GT + Vista64 = AE CS4  VERY slow interaction

                     

                     

                    and just wanted to try something   about   the motion path ...    checking ON   No motion path

                     

                    and suddently i discovered this one  .... HARDWARE ACCELERATE COMPOSITION, LAYER and footage panels..

                     

                    ... well i tried it. and  it s working for now....

                    • 7. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                      tajino Level 1

                      It has got to do with the way cs4 is drawing anti aliased motion path, if you turn off motion path display, the interaction speed will be back to normal. I have tried also by turning off AA in the catalyst control center, and it helps to improve performance slightly but still not up to the speed of cs3.

                       

                      Just received my nvidia 285 today, will be testing it out, see how it goes.

                       

                      Latest drivers doesn't mean a thing. It might even break stuff that used to work properly  before. I doubt things like this ever happens on the Mac.

                      • 8. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                        yenaphe Level 4

                        I've got a x1950 radeon on my Vista 64, and AE is working smoothly. But i haven't installed the latest drivers because it broke my display. Maybe try previous drivers to see if it works.

                        • 9. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                          tajino Level 1

                          I've tried a few versions back to 8.x, nothing works. Which version exactly are you using that works fine with vista64 + AEcs4. Thanks.

                          • 10. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                            yann mallard Level 1

                            hello !

                             

                            i am using   after effects  version 9.0.2.42

                             

                            and the cs3 version did n t have the slow interaction problems.

                             

                            both version 8.something and the latest update that was realased for this version.

                             

                             

                             

                            did you try in the preferences  CHECK  ON    Hardware Accelerate Composition, Layer, and Footage Panels.

                             

                             

                            and your video card does support DIRECT X 10 ?

                             

                            i did nt had the time to test this CHECK ON option with the QUADRO FX4500... but my tech guy was saying this one is not friendly with DIRECT X 10.

                             

                            ...

                             

                            PS >  absolutly   NO CRASH today ! every thing is fine....   welll .... except some  network card driver issue... hehehe ...!!! we have to get a new one... this time more ... vista friendly ...

                            • 11. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                              Impulse Fire Level 1

                              your graphics card and OS arent the only things that can have an effect

                              what is your cpu?

                              • 12. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                tajino Level 1

                                >your graphics card and OS arent the only >things that can have an effect

                                >what is your cpu?

                                 

                                 

                                I know how it feels like when it is a cpu bottleneck situation, but this is definitely not the case. My cpu, dual Xeon quad core 2.93Ghz.

                                • 13. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                  yann mallard Level 1

                                  did you try in the preferences  CHECK  ON    Hardware Accelerate Composition, Layer, and Footage Panels.  ?

                                  • 14. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                    tajino Level 1

                                    Yes, check on. Restart AE still the same. Check AE opengl stats, all features supported.

                                     

                                    I've installed EVGA nvidia 285 today, with the latest june driver, motion path with a few keyframes drawing cause the exact slowdown issue as my ATI 3870. Very depressing.

                                     

                                    Mylenium, which version of nvidia driver are you using for your 285? Did you turn on vista aero composited desktop? I tried either with aero on or off, same slowness.

                                     

                                       

                                     

                                    end

                                    • 15. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                      yann mallard Level 1

                                      BODY { font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:12px; }

                                      wouoouaooo.,.

                                      i am so sorry for you man!!

                                      i feel the pain!!!

                                      this kind of driver/system/software madness !!!!   i can t handle it

                                      anymore!! next time i move to MAC !! HAHAHA!!!

                                      Just for you info > i am using >>>   NVIDIA  GeFORCE  GTS 250 

                                      driver IS   8.15   11  8618  

                                      On Sun 28/06/09  7:40 AM , tajino forums@adobe.com sent:

                                      Yes, check on. Restart AE still the same. Check AE opengl stats, all

                                      features supported.

                                      I've installed EVGA nvidia 285 today, with the latest june driver,

                                      motion path with a few keyframes drawing cause the exact slowdown

                                      issue as my ATI 3870. Very depressing.

                                      Mylenium, which version of nvidia driver are you using for your 285?

                                      Did you turn on vista aero composited desktop? I tried either with

                                      aero on or off, same slowness.

                                      end

                                      • 16. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                        TommesKoch Level 1

                                        Hello guys,

                                         

                                        have the same prob here, with a Mac Pro (Vista 64), 16 Gig, Quadro FX 4800, Driver 186.18.

                                         

                                        If Motion Path is visible interaction is incredibly slow.

                                         

                                        Have cheked ON/OFF Hardware acceleration - but nothing helps.

                                        • 17. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                          tajino Level 1

                                          Glad to hear that, at least I'm not the only one facing this issue.

                                           

                                          Even after changing my graphics card to geforce GTS 285 on driver 186.18, the slow Motion Path issue still persist.

                                           

                                          Mylenium, mind telling us which version of nvidia driver that is working on your GTS 285, Thanks.

                                          • 18. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                            TommesKoch Level 1

                                            Well, installed the newest nvidia driver, but nothing helps. To mention i am working on a 30" dell monitor. Btw. now i have no opengl support under After Effects... my card (FX 4800) isn't compatible (any more) LOL? (Nice, stable support for "lamer" cards Adobe - thanks very much) Btw² my 3D app LightWave works fine with this card...even GLSL shaders works smart...

                                             

                                            BUT i tested it on my second computer the same Mac Pro but with an ATI FirePro 8700 (driver 8.563) and the same scene and it worked like charm. Everything is fine as it should be. (24" dell monitor).

                                             

                                            I remember before i had the Mac Pro i have had installed the CS4 on a supermico dual quad xeon with an ATI 4870 and have had the same slow interactions when working with paths... wtf oO

                                            • 19. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                              Adolfo Rozenfeld Adobe Employee

                                              I'd like to suggest everyone who is experiencing this issue (slow display of motion paths) to write to me with configuration details:

                                              AE version (for example, 9.02)

                                              CPU

                                              OS version

                                              Graphics card brand/model

                                              Graphics card driver

                                              Is HW Accelerate Composicion, layer and footage panels turned on or off in Preferences > Display?

                                              OpenGL mode in Fast Previews (Always on/Interactive/Off)

                                               

                                              arozenfe{[at]}adobe.com

                                              • 20. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                                Adolfo Rozenfeld Adobe Employee

                                                Please also let me know if the following helps:

                                                For Nvidia cards using multiple monitor set-ups, change the the multiple display setting to "compatible".

                                                For all cards in which it may apply, use the graphics card control panel to set advanced functions to default settings and turn off anti-aliasing and 16-bit mode, if available.

                                                • 21. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                                  TommesKoch Level 1

                                                  Hello Adolfo,

                                                   

                                                  AE Version 9.0.2.42

                                                  Dual Quad XEON 2,8 GHz (Mac Pro early 2008 model), 16 GB

                                                  Windows Vista 64 Bit, all patches installed

                                                  Nvidia Quadro FX 4800

                                                  Driver 190.38

                                                  HW Accelerate... tried both ON and OFF

                                                  OpenGL mode was Interactive, but with actual driver OFF

                                                   

                                                  Regards,

                                                  Tommes

                                                  • 22. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                                    Adolfo Rozenfeld Adobe Employee

                                                    Hello, Tommes.

                                                    I suggested users experiencing this wrote to me (address in the message above), so that I could attach contact info in the report as well.

                                                    Did you try turning off antialiasing, 16-bit modes and any other advanced feautres in the Nvidia control panel?

                                                    Anyone else?

                                                    • 23. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                                      David_Ellington

                                                      vista 64 bit

                                                      intel core2 quad Q6600

                                                      4gb ram

                                                      ATI firegl v5600 ver. 8.603.0.0

                                                      AE CS4 ver. 9.0.2.42

                                                      Hardware acceleration doesn't seem to make an impact.

                                                      all advanced features disabled

                                                       

                                                      I've been having issues similar to the original poster.  I've had luck turning down the number of keyframes displayed in the motion path.  You do this in preferences/display/motion path options.

                                                       

                                                      I set mine to "no more than 5 keyframes" and it sped things up a little, but it's still not as smooth as I'd like.

                                                       

                                                      Hope this helps.

                                                      • 24. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                                        tajino Level 1

                                                        Hi PatsyCake,

                                                         

                                                        Can you try panning quickly in the main composition viewport by holding space and drag, can you see display tearing(no vertical sync) in the viewport?

                                                         

                                                        Thanks.

                                                        • 25. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                                          David_Ellington Level 1

                                                          there is tearing.  It's less pronounced (almost didn't notice it) if I'm

                                                          zoomed out, but more pronounced if I'm zoomed in to the composition.

                                                          • 26. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                                            Adolfo Rozenfeld Adobe Employee

                                                            Pasty and Tajino:

                                                            I am currently on a trip, so I am not as active as usual on the forum. But I am following everything. Thanks for sharing your configuration information. Again, the reason why in these cases I ask people to (also) write to my e-mail address is so that I have contact info for each configuration.

                                                            • 27. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                                              raven52321

                                                              I'm also having a similar problem, I've sent details to adolfo's email as requested.  I'd like to see if anyone has found a solution for this.

                                                               

                                                              If you are running CS4 and have not seen this problem, maybe we could hear from someone with a working configuration?  for example, what drivers are working for the nvidia GTX 285?

                                                              • 28. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                                                tajino Level 1

                                                                It's been months and there seems to be no solution yet. It is strange 

                                                                to see only a small number of people voicing out this problem. Could 

                                                                it be they either not noticed it or not bothered by it?

                                                                 

                                                                Adobe please do something about it. The problem looks to be like an 

                                                                antialias related issue, it is as if the motion path drawing are 

                                                                getting too many AA passes on refresh and thus causing the unnecesary 

                                                                slow down. Just a guess because when I force off the AA in Nvidia 

                                                                control panel it improves the motion path drawing speed slightly.

                                                                 

                                                                Anyway I'm still hoping for a real solution.

                                                                 

                                                                 

                                                                Tajino

                                                                • 29. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                                                  ChrisProsser Adobe Employee

                                                                  Hi Folks,

                                                                   

                                                                  Sorry we haven't posted here in a while. We still can't reproduce this in house. This seems to affect a small number of people. People with the same exact hardware config on the surface do not always have the issue. We have yet to figure out the common cause between all the different hardware and software configurations.

                                                                   

                                                                  With OpenGL off and Hardware Accelerate Item Views disabled we basically create a:

                                                                  Gdiplus::GraphicsPath, then call a bunch of LineTo() methods. Then stroke it one for the main stroke, and stroke it a second time with a partially transparent drop shadow. We do this to an offscreen buffer and then blit that once at the end. That's it. We do call LineTo() for every frame, but with the default display (Preferences->Display) prefs at 30fps you'll be getting 405 little segments drawn. We set the GDI+ antialias mode to SmoothingModeAntiAlias8x4 for this operation.

                                                                   

                                                                  I'm guessing something is causing GDI+ to be super slow on these machines since the delay seems to be related to the number of segments stroked in this path (according to these emails). 405 segments is a pretty small number and the GDI+ rasterizer should be able to do this without a hiccup. This is why I'm baffled.

                                                                   

                                                                  Also, GDI+ generally isn't hardware accellerated. Only the blit to screen is accellerated. All these line raster operations are done on the CPU and should be consistent from machine to machine.

                                                                   

                                                                  Sorry I can't be more helpful.

                                                                   

                                                                  --chris

                                                                  • 30. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                                                    Adolfo Rozenfeld Adobe Employee

                                                                    A few posts above I posted a few guidelines so that users experiencing this behavior could provide configuration details. As far as I remember, I got a couple of detailed reports. So, if you are experiencing this problem, it's important that you provide as much information as possible (using the guidelines above). A sample project would also be welcome, no need for media files. You can post this here, or e-mail it to me (e-mail address also in this thread).

                                                                    • 31. Re: ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                                                      Socialkaos. Level 1

                                                                       

                                                                      HI guys

                                                                       

                                                                      I have same problem like U.

                                                                      Moving points on motion path with opengl is very ...frustrating.

                                                                      Even with very simple test projects.

                                                                       

                                                                       

                                                                      Specs:

                                                                      • Vista64 SP2
                                                                      • Cs4 (all programs fully updated)
                                                                      • Dual CRT with 1600x1200 (comaptible mode in nvidia panel)
                                                                      • 2 Quad Xeons
                                                                      • Intel D5400XS
                                                                      • 8GB RAM
                                                                      • MSI Geforce 9800GT (8.15.11.9038 driver-via WinUpdate) (antialiasing off)
                                                                      • Intuos Wacom (newest driver)
                                                                      • Hw accelerated compositions, opengl (interactive/always on)
                                                                      • 32. my solution to ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                                                        aditive_munich

                                                                        hi everyone,

                                                                        i had exact the same problem. and solved it --> it turned out, that my wacom tablet drivers caused the problems with motionpaths in after effects.

                                                                        after closing the wacom_tablet.exe in the taskmanager the problems in after effects were gone.

                                                                         

                                                                        hope this helps you,

                                                                        cya

                                                                        • 33. Re: my solution to ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                                                          TommesKoch Level 1

                                                                          OMG!

                                                                           

                                                                          Hi, i have an wacom tablet (intuos 2), too. After i killed the wacom_tablet.exe in the taskmanager everything works fine again. I had to used administrator rights in taskmanager to kill the two processes with exact the same name, after that it works.

                                                                           

                                                                          Thanks a lot! *thumbs up*

                                                                           

                                                                          Machine specs:

                                                                          • Mac Pro Dual Quad Xeon 2,8 GHz (Model 2008)
                                                                          • 16 GB RAM
                                                                          • Nvidia Quadro FX 4800 (driver version 191)
                                                                          • Windows Vista 64 (updated)
                                                                          • Adobe Master Collection CS4 (updated)
                                                                          • 30" Dell Monitor (2560x1600)
                                                                          • 34. Re: my solution to ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                                                            Socialkaos. Level 1

                                                                            Yeah U solved the problem.

                                                                             

                                                                            BUT How to use wacom with AFterFX openGL?

                                                                            • 35. Re: my solution to ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                                                              Adolfo Rozenfeld Adobe Employee

                                                                              Now that we seem to know the culprit (Congrats! Can more of you confirm this?) it'll be much easier to fix, working with Wacom to find out the problem.

                                                                              Now we also know why reports that only mentioned the graphics card model, etc couldn't be reproduced easily.

                                                                              • 36. Re: my solution to ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                                                                Socialkaos. Level 1

                                                                                I try old and new drivers from wacom.

                                                                                Only answer is kill a wacom [snip].


                                                                                (I think they have a lot of work to do.

                                                                                AE conflict, Vista conflicts, Kaspersky2010)

                                                                                 

                                                                                [snip]

                                                                                 

                                                                                [post edited by moderator to remove inappropriate language]

                                                                                • 37. Re: my solution to ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                                                                  TommesKoch Level 1

                                                                                  yeah, best tablets worst drivers...

                                                                                  • 38. Re: my solution to ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                                                                    aditive_munich Level 1

                                                                                    glad to hear that this fixed it for you!!

                                                                                    forgot to mention that actually i'm not on vista64 but on windows7 64...

                                                                                    so the problem isnt even tied to the OS... its just wacom

                                                                                     

                                                                                    my wacom drivers are:

                                                                                    -----------------------------------------------------------

                                                                                    Wacom_Tablet.exe
                                                                                    Tablet Service for professional driver
                                                                                    Version: 6.1.2.3

                                                                                     

                                                                                    Message was edited by: s.poertner

                                                                                    • 39. Re: my solution to ATI 3870 + Vista64 = AE CS4 slow interaction
                                                                                      Socialkaos. Level 1

                                                                                      I tell u something.

                                                                                      Beware of using newest wacom drivers(!)  (6.1.2-4 / 6.1.2-3)

                                                                                      I try it ...8 Windows installations before

                                                                                       

                                                                                      Ps, AI and Flash will be crashing on "mouseover"

                                                                                       

                                                                                       

                                                                                       

                                                                                      ------------------------------------

                                                                                       

                                                                                      And my 6.1.1-3

                                                                                      1 2 3 Previous Next